Forum - View topicANNCast - Sheh's All That
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Otaking09
 Posts: 637 |
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Think about it.
If there were NO dubs, almost NOTHING good would've been properly distributed. For those who absolutely HATE dubs... Deal with it. I mean "purist/shmurist". "Recession/shemession"! While I personally don't mind subs, dubbed anime helped me pick my absolute favorites. Dubs, themselves, are solely responsible for bringing all the big-hits to US. I buy anime as often as I can. Sure I may sample them online, but if I LOVE it, I'll buy it and not give it a single thought more. And WHO cares about them using the same VAs?! It's cool! Guy 1 = "Hey, I here Orihime's VA is in this new one called Eureka Seven." Me = "Really!!! Wow, she's pretty talented, wonder what'll happen..." Guy 1 = "Yeah. Oh and when you get the time check out out Koi Kaze, it's not that well known... But trust me, it is GOOD!!!" Me = "Sure man, you seem to know what you're talking about I check back tomorrow." That was how I found out about MANY of my now current favorites. It is necessary for dubs to exist. I thought this interview, was especially enlightening for me, and seeing how I buy anime already, I'll just do what I always do watch dubs, and buy dubs. No offense to subbed fans, but dubs NEED to exist... Go out and buy ALL the animes on My Favorites List!!! |
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KoujiTamino
 Posts: 163 Location: Tacoma, WA, USA |
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Well, that was a fun blog to listen to. "Now they're gonna stop making pies and it'll be all Zac's fault." Oh wow, that got a good chuckle out of me. Also, Ms. Sheh's cosplay story was adorable.
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kikiyo2
Posts: 36 |
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If only there was "free marketing" that Mrs Cheh speaks of... oh wait... there is - and it's the same thing she keeps (hypocritically, I might add) demonizing. No wonder the American/dub industry is tanking. They keep blaming the fans. Anyone with any speck of business sense knows this is retarded. And there's no way I'm going to pay their inflated, ludicrous prices when they don't even offer what I want (HD subbed digital files). And until they do they're going to keep in this downward spiral. I get so sick of these people playing the pity card. Yes, anime is going to die because we don't have your precious dubs
 . But just keep blaming us fans instead of giving us what we want if it makes you sleep better at night.
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Cosplaybunny
 Posts: 224 |
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I think you mean to say free advertising and no this is not free advertising. This is providing free product, and not just samples of said product but the whole product for free. Advertising would imply that sales are made but too many are just free riding on the anime industry without contributing financially. Lack of dubs in the current anime industry is just one of many signs that the industry is currently under duress. Without the support of actual fans (not the free riders that do not contribute financially to the anime industry) it will be extremely hard for the anime industry to continue as is. It's not pity but just simple economics, without substantial financial support an industry cannot continue. If you have an honest problem with the distribution of anime, write to the companies, go to conventions and talk with industry guests. They are not mind readers and need to know if there is a market out there for download only products. You can also let them know that there is a market for downloadable anime by purchasing what downloadable anime there is (ie itunes), watch the legal free anime that is available online. They are not going to listen to someone who is not a paying consumer. |
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littlegreenwolf
 Posts: 4796 Location: Seattle, WA |
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Inflated prices my @$$. If anything, anime has gotten cheaper per dvd over the last 10 years. You may want HD subbed digital files, but I like my DVDs just fine. She's not blaming the paying fans, she's blaming the free riders who you mention. |
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KoujiTamino
Posts: 163 Location: Tacoma, WA, USA |
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The difference between internet piracy of more mainstream works and anime is that the more mainstream stuff has enough support to offset the damage that it does. Anime pretty much depends almost completely on DVD sales. The companies are trying to delve more into digital distribution, but abandoning DVD sales completely would be suicide. There's no way they'd be able to make a profit off of shifting focus to digital distribution as there isn't anywhere near as much support as there would be with a series such as, say, House. Also, overpriced? Since when? Even when you don't factor in English dubs, there's a lot of extra cost to releasing anime in the US vs. series made for the US market. The latter already made a profit. DVD releases (as well as digital distribution) for American TV shows are almost seen as an afterthought, as a favor to the fans and a way to make extra money. For anime, DVD and now Blu-Ray releases are the lifeblood of a series' profit, even in Japan. While what Ms. Sheh may have said was slightly hypocritical, it certainly isn't worth slamming her for. While both are equally illegal, she was speaking out more against the type of people that continue to download fansubs even after a series has been licensed for release in their country. That's quite a bit different from watching a series that wasn't available outside of Japan back when she was (presumably) much younger at the time. She also didn't lay all the blame on 'fans', she also put blame on the very studios she does contract work for for not selling the shows better. Also, digital distribution sucks. I like physical media, thank you very much. I like art boxes and dvd cover art.  Don't think you speak for all fans.
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kikiyo2
Posts: 36 |
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How can I when they won't even give me that option? There's not one company that has put out any subbed digital files that even touch the quality found on fansubs? So why should I support their half-assedness?
Are these "free riders" also still not fans? Maybe they wouldn't be "leeches" if the industry would just give them what they want. Anime DVDs are cheaper but they're still way too expensive thanks to the American companies vastly inflating the prices with unnecessary costs like dubs and DVD manufacturing and shipping. That's what I meant by expensive. Also, if the Japanese would just use fansubber's work (translations, encoding, etc.) not only would it generally be better than what the American companies offer but it'd be a lot cheaper.
That's not true at all. It's merchandising that makes the money for anime. For the American companies, they might rely on DVD sales, but the actual anime industry itself will just be fine without DVD sales. |
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Megiddo
 Posts: 8360 Location: IL |
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No, they're not fans. |
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becomedog
 Posts: 18 |
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I'm sad you used the f word... I thought I had finally found a podcast where they didn't have to resort to cussing to express themselves. Oh well.
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Cosplaybunny
Posts: 224 |
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They're not going to put the time and effort into making HD quality downloads without knowing that there is a paying market for said downloads. The industry is just now exploring the HD/download market. They will not provide a product where there is no market. It may not be exactly what you want, but something is better than nothing. Support what you can when you can so that you can let them know there is interest. Again they are not going to listen to those who do not financially support them. I wouldn't call it half-assed either. If you've ever had the chance to talk to those in the industry and what it takes to produce even just a dvd, you'd realize it takes a lot of time and money. Again without a consumer market for a product, the industry will not provide a product.
To answer your other questions, no I do not believe that free riders are actual fans. Fans imply support which these free riders do not give. This does not apply to those who purchase occasionally or watch free and legally. What do these fans want? The anime industry is working hard to provide simultaneous broadcasting, free anime episodes to watch online. They industry can only do so much to please these "fans". They cannot compete with completely free/extremely cheap pirated anime nor do I expect them to. I think these fans need to come back to reality and see that the industry is doing the best they can. I'm sorry as soon as money is involved these fansubbers are not going to provide their services for free. I've also heard from the horses mouth that certain fansubbers have been offered a chance to work with the industry and have completely snubbed them saying they would rather "fight the man" When did the industry that provides us so much entertainment become the enemy? The Japanese industry as it stands right now cannot survive without international (currently the largest right now is the American) industry. Shows have been made in the past because of the financial support of the American industry (Big O!, Kino's Journey). The Japanese have been in a financial recession far longer than we have been (since the early 90s) that they have not been able to completely recover from. The anime industry was one of those industries that suffered greatly barely surviving if it wasn't for the american interest in the industry. Now both are completely reliant on one another. Do not believe for one minute that if one falls the other will survive unharmed. |
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bayoab
Posts: 831 |
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Japan doesn't get HD downloads legitimately. This is asking for something that Japan doesn't even do, which means it will take longer. Also, various companies have been experimenting with HD streaming.
No, Japan would still charge twice the price for less than half the number of episodes that R1 would give you. In fact, they are doing that with Haruhi (2009). Also, here is a very rough general estimate of what the costs are for your standard $30 MSRP DVD (sold at $25): $10 for the retailer (Bestbuy/TRSI/Amazon/etc) $8 for licensing and royalty fees. $3 for the dub $1.00 for packaging, shipping, pressing $3.00 for "other" (company profit, marketing costs, staff costs, etc) |
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DomFortress
 Posts: 751 Location: Richmond BC, Canada |
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Furthermore, because the anime production companies don't have the content licensing rights of their copyrighted anime series. They had to finance the labor cost of animation productions themselves, while they don't get paid from anime related merchandises sales. |
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jenseki
Posts: 9 |
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Okay, I feel like I should write something here.
I have many friends in the anime industry both in the US and in Japan. And the Japanese industry has suffered from the same illegal downloading problem as the US anime market has. As times got tough they came to rely on overseas licensing, which means the Japanese studios/creators relied on the income generated from US audiences buying DVDs. Yes, people forget that you support the Japanese creators by buying legitimate copies as well. However, since very few people are actually buying anime in the States these days, Japan has come to rely more on merchandising to make money. Which means they often make the anime at a loss hoping to gain the profit from toys that they sell. Which means: as an audience member, the content of my anime becomes severely limited. Zac and Justin were earlier complaining about how they don't make certain types of shows anymore. Well, there's a reason for that. Moe type shows, those geared toward super otaku seem to be doing well in Japan. Like Haruhi and Lucky Star, because the die hard otaku is willing to spend as much as they have to, to buy the merch. In the end, it seems to be all driven by money so, the most powerful way to influence the industry is with your wallet. I wasn't trying to complain about fans, I was just trying to highlight to people the power of their pocketbook. |
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Essedus
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I'm sorry, but you are incorrect. Going by the definition of "fan", one does not actually have to buy anime DVDs or related products to be an anime fan. The definition of "fan" is "A fan, aficionado, or supporter is someone who has an intense, occasionally overwhelming liking and enthusiasm for a sporting club, person (usually a celebrity), group of persons, company, product, activity, work of art, idea, or trend." Therefore, even those who never bought an anime DVD but watch tens of fansubed episodes per day are anime fans. This concludes this weeks vocabulary corner. |
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Cosplaybunny
Posts: 224 |
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No they're not. When looking further into the wikipedia article quickly quoted above you can see the characteristics of a fan.
Edit: Hit the submit button too soon. Time and resources are the key in this quote. Fans want to purchase goods from the things they are fans of. Most of these "free riders" don't express any interest in purchasing anime and instead demand that their expectations be met. It's give and take and all they would like to do is take and still expect anime to be there. Nothing is good enough (nor I think it ever will be with some individuals). I mean it's as simple as watching the official anime with the commercials and occasionally picking up a series you like. Last edited by Cosplaybunny on Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:03 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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