Forum - View topicFate/stay night (TV 2005).
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xiaoxu
Posts: 21 |
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okies jus to clear up a few epic confusions....i tink i roughly get the pic after watching the anime twice...spoiler[First up,Saber.Epic spirit is King Authoria and wields the swrd excalibur.The eng dubbing makes it seem like sabers blade and shiros creation are both the same ting.But if uve heard the original Japanese ver,ud noe that wad shiro made was caliburn,which is actually supposed to be the swrd taken frm the stone that makes him/her king.Now excalibur is the invisible swrd saber uses.Its the swrd which makes the wielder undefeated in battle and whose sheath allows the wielder not to shed a drop of blood.If im not wrong in my mythology,this swrd was gifted to Authoria in recognition of her heroism....noting to do with making her king.And now on to shiro and archer.Some ppls mite not notice but those 2 have alot in similar.Archer also seems to understand shiros power.Also,of all kinds of weapons,y'd u tink shiro created the same ting archer did? and not make the swrd like he used to agains berserker?This is jus my view,but i tink Archer may be an exception.An unknown epic hero because he's not even a hero yet.Archer may be shiro in the future...well tats wad i tink. Upon observation and deduction.]well as for the rest of the servants,i believe rin has already explained tings to u
-------------------------- [EDIT: Translation] Okay, just to clear up some confusion, I think I get the idea after watching the series twice, now... spoiler[ First up, Saber. Her Epic Spirit is King Aurthur and wields the legendary sword, Excalibur. The English dubbing makes it seem like Saber and Shirou's created blade are both the same thing. But if you've heard the original Japanese version, you'd notice that what Shirou made was Excalibur, which is actually supposed to be the sword taken from the stone that makes him/her king. Now Excalibur is the invisible sword Saber uses. It's the sword which makes the wielder undefeated in battle and whose sheath allows the wielder not to shed a drop of blood. If I'm not mistaken in my mythology, this sword was a gift to Aurthur in recognition of her heroism, not anything to do with making her king. And now on to Shirou and Archer. Some people might not have noticed, but those 2 have a lot of similarities. Archer also seems to understand Shirou's power. Also, of all the different kinds of weapons, you'd think Shirou created the same thing Archer did, and not make the sword like he used against Berserker? This is just my view, but I think Archer may be an exception. An unknown epic hero because he's not even a hero yet. Archer may be Shirou in the future. Well, thats what I think, anyway, upon observation and deduction.] As for the rest of the servants, I believe Rin has already explained things to in the story itself. [EDIT: Please make a better effort in proper spelling and grammar. If you post anything like this anymore, I'm copying and pasting your text, sending it back to you via PM, then deleting your posts until you can fix them. -TK] |
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KyuuA4
 Posts: 1361 Location: America, where anime and manga can be made |
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Watching the series again... somehow -- I get turned off by eps. 18... or so. The appeal it had in the beginning... it dribbled off. I have a feeling the game was tons better... by better... I mean.
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HitokiriShadow
 Posts: 6251 |
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spoiler[Archer is Shirou. That's why they are so similar. I don't remember the explanation of how that worked, but its something the anime never went into.] And good lord, your typing is horrendous. Fix it, that's not optional here. |
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ElementSun
Posts: 106 |
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This series has some of the worst character development between the male and female protagonist. I was just getting sick of how dense each side was. The only thing that kept me watching was Rin.
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xiaoxu
Posts: 21 |
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Sigh...alright alright...I'm pretty much used to typing so fast that I usually ignore some spelling and gramatical errors...but if that's not allowed in the forum then I'll abide by the rules.
Oh yes...forgot to mention about rider.spoiler[Her epic spirit is medusa.In greek mythology,Medusa and her two other sisters(forgot their names) were powerful beings who had the power to turn anything into stone when thier powers are combined.They enslave mythical creatures and make them do thier bidding.Thus her noble phatasm is in the form of pegusus,the flying horse.Also she always has a visor covering her eyes,which implies probably that anyone who looks into her eyes will be turned to stone...]any questions? Most of you probably figrued it out already but jus in case there are some people who wonder about the servants,take it as general knowledge. 
Last edited by xiaoxu on Tue Aug 28, 2007 10:06 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar  Posts: 16941 |
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Thanks for fixing the grammar, but in the process you seemed to forget something else you had before; spoiler tags. Anyone not up to dvd 3 won't know any of that info about Rider. Please use spoiler tags.
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Maryohki
 Posts: 526 |
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I had the same incorrect guess for Saber's identity as well X3.
I'm only up to ep. 14. That ep devastated me so I'm on break from F/SN. |
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Randall Miyashiro
 Posts: 2451 Location: A block away from Golden Gate Park |
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I just got around to watching the final DVD, and decided to catch up on all those spoilers in these threads. I think this one (last comment under two months) is the most recent and has some interesting comments, so I will use it instead of creating a new one.
First off I really loved the last episode, although I can see how some could be rather disappointed in the end. The animation for the last episode is fantastic and reminds me of many anime series from the 80s and 90s where it seem more common for a studio to allocate more money in the last episode. spoiler[ Did anyone find out more about the Shirou and Archer connection? This seems odd to me] spoiler[As for Saber's identity I assumed it had something to do with the Holy Grail from the first episode. My first assumption was that she was Guinevere (probably along with a good number of others) so I was not shocked when she turned out to be Arthur.] Since I have been collecting the various figures from the series I kept expecting to see the characters outside of their battle gear. I thought that there would be a stretch of episodes where the characters took a break and went to the beach or park. Does the game have any of these leisure moments? One thing that I found amusing is the credits at the end of the episode had the entire Cast and Crew of the series mixed together and listed alphabetically without positions listed. To top it off the Japanese staff was followed by the entire English staff listed in the same manner. I assume this reflects the original Japanese credits which is sadly missing on the DVD. The last time I saw something this creative was on the last episode of Patlabor which had the entire staff of all 63 episodes listed at the end of the last episode. These special credits make the project seem like a team effort which is really cool. I hope that both Type Moon series will be eventually picked up again and I'm really glad Geneon managed to finish this series. |
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Nagisa
Moderator
 Posts: 6128 Location: Atlanta-ish, Jawjuh |
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spoiler[Archer is Shirou. Specifically, he's a future Shirou, who followed the path of a "Hero of Justice" only to have it lead to the deaths of everyone he cared about. I don't think Type-Moon are ever very specific about it, but eventually Shirou's heroism turns people against him or martyrs him, and just before he dies he makes some sort of deal to exchange one last miracle for the chance to bend the rules of the Grail War and be summoned in the past (it's been a while since I read up on all of this, so I might be fudging a fact or two). The reason for being summoned is so he can either sway his past self away from the path of a "Hero of Justice" or kill him, all in an attempt to prevent everyone from dying because of him.] All of this is introduced and explored in the Unlimited Blade Works and Heaven's Feel scenarios of the original game (each scenario being a different ordering of the same story's events in order to focus on different sets of characters). The anime's producers, in all their infinite wisdom (  ) decided to stick to an extremely strict interpretation of the game's first scenario, Fate, which really just glazes over everything not involving Shirou or Saber, seeing as all of that stuff is meant to be covered in the other two scenarios. Since the anime lacks these other two scenarios and is just one of three left to stand on its own, it really winds up being a wonderful celebration of bad character development as a result, since it's a lot of tease with no delivery (Rider's true master, the REAL Servant Assassin, and the Matou family's role in the Grail War, and I think Ilya's original function being other things teased in Fate, but only developed and explored in UBW and Heaven's Feel).
Luckily, I think the manga coming out is based on Unlimited Blade Works, so we'll at least get two of the three scenarios adapted. I just hope it gets licensed eventually.
Most of the casually-clothed Fate figures actually come from a second game called Fate/hollow ataraxia, which is both a sequel of sorts to Fate/stay night (explaining the three scenarios as spoiler[alternate realities that got smashed together into one timeline thanks to the Grail breaking down]), as well as a "fun disc" intended to add some character development and have a little semi-canonical fun with the cast that couldn't be had in the main plot. Saber getting swimming lessons, Lancer going fishing at a local dock, and Caster getting a part-time job are some of the events seen in the game at one point or another. |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar Posts: 16941 |
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That would explain why Archer told Shirou he hated him so much and was telling him that he was only good at the one ability and to focus on it because he had no talent for anything else.
Let me see if I got a few things right, please correct me if I don't Nagisa. The original game had 3 separate plots. Sort of like games with different endings based on what path you take except instead of endings it's 3 different plots all together. One unlocking the next I would assume in the gameplay. And the anime is only based on the first of those story lines right? That being the case do you think the others would ever get animated or not? Also, I've heard of Fate Hollow Atraxia and that it's a sequel of sorts to the first game. So all the wallpapers/figures of her, or others, in a bathing suit, or normal clothing, or anything of that nature stem from that game right? Judging by your Caster avatar and previous PM's with you I'm fairly confidant saying you obviously seem to like the series (as in the entire collective universe as it is) as a whole and know a lot about it. Do you know of any sites with synopsis' or written out plots/explanation of both of the games and what happens in them? I ask because they're obviously Japanese only games so there's no real chance of me playing them anytime soon. |
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Nagisa
Moderator
Posts: 6128 Location: Atlanta-ish, Jawjuh |
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It's not so much three separate plots altogether as it is the same plot told three separate ways, depending on who the lead female character is intended to be. The first scenario, Fate, has Shirou and Saber as the main characters, Unlimited Blade Works has Shirou and Rin as the leads, and Heaven's Feel has Shirou and Sakura as leads. With focus shifting to a different female lead each time, focus on other characters also shifts, as does the importance of certain plot points. It's still the Grail War, Shirou still teams up with Saber, Rin, and Archer, etc., but the way things play out is radically different in each scenario (and, of course, each scenario has multiple endings of its own in true visual novel tradition). And yes, the anime is based strictly on the Fate scenario. If you ask me, they should've written a completely new scenario for the anime that hit the main points of the three game scenarios, so that we didn't get so screwed over on character and plot, but unfortunately that wasn't the case. As for the other two getting animated, I highly doubt it'll happen. According to some sources, the intent the entire time was to adapt each scenario in a different medium: Fate would be an anime, Unlimited Blade Works would be a manga, and Heaven's Feel would be a drama CD or radio play or something (which is a helluva way to squander the most radically different and generally revealing, background-wise, of the scenarios). Not to say it won't happen, as there seems to be some sort of excitement over Type-Moon properties of late (one of their first works, Kara no Kyoukai, has a movie adaptation coming out in the next month or two), but I'd wager we saw something Tsukihime or Melty Blood-related, or an anime adaptation of the new Fate/stay night prequel Fate/zero, before we saw the remaining two Fate/stay night scenarios animated.
The vast majority of them do, yeah. I think there are one or two costume designs that have origins elsewhere, or are from the other Fate/stay night scenarios (Black Saber and Rider in jeans and a black sweater both stemming from Heaven's Feel, for example), but most casually-attired Servants stem from Fate/hollow ataraxia.
My fanfare with Type-Moon has waned a bit due to disappointment with the Fate anime and just having other interests come along, but yeah, I do consider myself a rather big fan of the whole Type-Moon/Kinoko Nasu mythology. As for information resources, the two best English sites I can think of are The Moonlit World (some grammatical errors throughout, but reliable information) and Wikipedia's Type-Moon-related pages. Despite the typical stigma against Wikipedia, their Type-Moon pages seem to be accurate from what I've read, and range from reasonably thorough pages on each major work to interesting articles on the mythology like this one on Kinoko Nasu's interpretation of vampires and his Dead Apostle characters. There used to be a really good Type-Moon wiki called Fuyuki City, but it seems to have gone extinct. |
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HitokiriShadow
Posts: 6251 |
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My understanding is that the anime included some elements from UBW and HF, though they still amounted to teases. I belief the part early on with Rin trying to kill Shirou in the school was from the UBW scenario and that the Caster thing never happened in Fate and was from the HF scenario.
I'm really looking forward to Kara no Kyoukai. I saw a trailer and it looks great. And it sounds like it is going to be multiple movies. Also, I have wet dreams of F/SN's other scenarios getting animated by Kyoto Animation, Bones, or Madhouse (in that order of preference).
I have an image that shows the character relationships between the various Type-Moon/Nasu stories (and full of spoilers for all series and scenarios), but I'll have to wait until I get home to post a link to it. |
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Kruszer
 Posts: 7987 Location: Minnesota, USA |
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I'm also looking forward to it quite a bit. |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar Posts: 16941 |
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That makes sense. Almost like Resident Evil 2 where you play the same game but from different perspectives. Not the same but a fair example I say. Thanks for all the info Nagi. I loved Tsukihime and Fate really just grabbed me. I enjoy lots of series but some just grab you more then others and turn you into a fan of the show itself. Fate did that for me so I've been on a quest to learn more about the whole universe since I knew there were other pieces related to Fate out there beyond the anime. It's also nice to hear there are multiple endings per each scenario in the game since the anime ending didn't really do it for me. The ending just seemed.....like it was missing something. I felt like there should've been more to it then there was. It was nice, a bit bittersweet obviously but still nice. It's just it felt like there was more to it that got left out. |
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HitokiriShadow
Posts: 6251 |
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Not quite. In Fate and Tsukhime, things play out drastically differently depending on the Scenario. It's not just different points of view of the same story. For example, in Heaven's Feel spoiler[you get to see Dark Sakura and Dark Saber (thanks to Caster) and, from what I understand, it is very, very bloody and involves a lot of people dying, like entire cities being wiped out] and in Unlimited Blade Works spoiler[Shirou learns how to fight and use his powers and eventually learns the Ulimited Blade Works attack and Archer is a "bad guy" in that scenario.] Also, here is the chart I mentioned earier. Contains Major Spoilers for Fate/Stay Night (the anime and the other scenarios). I don't think it spoils much for Tsukihime and Kara no Kyoukai, but be wary. The Nasu-verse |
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