Forum - View topicThis Week in Anime - Is Fire Force Worth Watching?
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Kuroi Ren
Posts: 143 |
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TBH, you seemed to be the most defensive one here. Also, many anime characters have traits like ears or something trivial but different. Like Shinra's smile. It had an excuse but not a good one. It's just part of his character and I don't see why that's a point of argument? Plus, most people like the animation and characters. The fanservice happens but it's momentarily and then gets back to the main fight. It's annoying but not unbearable
Exactly
. You just described every Shounen ever (power of friendship, love, etc.) and Shinra is OP anyway so it's not like he only won because of his self-righteous attitude |
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lossthief
ANN Reviewer
Posts: 1395 |
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You've mentioned a couple times that Tamaki's lucky letcher thing is "satire" so could you explain? If it's satire of other contrived fanservice, what precisely about that is it trying to criticize? If it's trying to comment on the dehumanizing aspect of it, that seems at odds with all the shower scenes or Hibana feeling up Iris or the other shots of cleavage or the main girls in their underwear. If it's trying to be so over the top it can't be enjoyed sincerely for titillation, it's definitely not trying hard enough in an anime landscape with Food Wars and Fairy Tail From my perspective it just comes off as a more self aware, 4th wall breaking version of the same boob and butt pratfalls you'd find in Yuuna & the Haunted Hot springs or We Never Learn. Which isn't really satire because, as the shirt says |
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meiam
Posts: 3442 |
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Yeah that's not how commentary works... like at all. Every shonen protag ever act embarrass when fan service happen around them. That's like stealing something and when your caught claiming that it was a commentary on crime. The fan service is just that, fan service. It doesn't feed into the story in anyway nor does the show comment on it (it's a show about fire magic, what part of that comment on fan service?). |
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Hal14
Posts: 669 Location: Heart of africa |
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I swear i've read a news article like this recently. The person claimed they broke the law to test it. It's sad, but not surprising, to see people claim the fanservice is 'satire' or 'social commentary'. I'm reminded of a certain youtube channel that is satire but the creators have never called it such because a good joke is one you don't have to explain. Otherwise your no different from the people who say "It's just a prank bro" after doing something dumb and malicious |
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asneakysnake
Posts: 28 |
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I agree Fire Force is having it’s cake and eating it too by sexualizing all the girls instead of just Tamaki. |
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Kuroi Ren
Posts: 143 |
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I mainly disagree. I mean, the fanservice is stupid/annoying but it seems to be designed as comedy anyway. The bath scene was an example of actual Fanservice. The rest seems to be comedic like many moments in Shounen (and non-shounen) anime. And it appeals to a young teenager audience so you can't judge it based on that I personally like the characters, and they slowly show each of their backstory starting with Shinra, the sister, etc... They're fun and enjoyable to watch. Arthur's stupidity is what makes him unique. The captain's weight training. The vice captain's brutality (it's hilarious to see him shoot his juniors) Tamaki is not very likeable but I'll just ignore her stupid fanservice device and even she's had her moments with Rekka's betrayal and her suspension. I'd like to see where it goes. I mean, what do people expect when they say they want "better" characters?. 2 girls so far have had their clothes torn and it wasn't even sexual. Maki is portrayed as a powerful woman who beat 2 third-gens, so I don't see the sexually abuse you mentioned. Most of all, the story isn't rushed. Calling it incoherent even thought it's quite straightforward is exaggerated. Barely anything has happened over 9 whole episodes and that's considering it's only 24 episodes. In fact, the episodes make me feel like I want more and the new introduction of the mysterious cult/adolla burst as well as the mystery of the traitors within the fire force make it interesting. The world building is still happening and besides, infernals are very one dimensional. Fighting them would quickly become dull in comparison to fighting mysterious fire fighters with dubious motives. May I ask what concepts you are referring to? It seems to me like it's sticking to what it should.
He probably meant "comedic" but I can see what he means. Fanservice or not, you can't judge a SHOUNEN anime because of fanservice. It's just part of the package and us Seinen people should enjoy the rest or watch something else. I am enjoying the fight scenes, characters, unique setting and story. Those seem more important than "marketing" aimed at teens |
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lossthief
ANN Reviewer
Posts: 1395 |
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I mean, just off the top of my head i can think of several shonen titles with no real fanservice hooks - Promised Neverland, Demon Slayer, World Trigger, Haikyu - so it feels pretty myopic to insist Fire Force's cheesecake is something everyone should just expect with a shonen anime. And even then, there are different methods and degrees of delivering cheesecake in a series that don't distract from otherwise serious moments, or feel unusually meanspirited the way FF's often does. |
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meruru
Posts: 471 |
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Rather than blaming the audience (calling them prudes, etc.), maybe blame the work, in that it's very obviously made for a very specific type of person.
One thing I personally find very frustrating about the manga/anime industry is that shoujo and josei are almost exclusively about romance. Every once in a while there's a major one about something in addition to romance, like fantasy/romance, sports/romance, scifi/romance, but still, the vast majority are romance, and hardly any have no romance at all. If you want other stories, really you have to read/watch shounen and seinen, which assume a male audience. |
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kotomikun
Posts: 1205 |
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That's kinda like saying "yeah, that zombie looks really gross, but it's designed as horror anyway." Like... you're not wrong, but what's your point? It's still a zombie, it's still fanservice. Sexual content in anime, and most other things, is almost always played for comedy to keep it from crossing the line into hentai, and because we all have a general awareness that it's a bit silly. But, like I said earlier, that isn't even the main problem here, and this other sentence... oof:
That question kinda says it all, though probably not the way you think it does. I can't possibly condense the entire discourse about answering that question into one comment, but maybe look at some opinions from women who watch anime about what makes a good character; if you can stomach the F-word, try anime feminist. Generally, "better" female characters means ones that aren't treated in ways that, if they were male, would probably offend you. That's an oversimplification, of course, but imagine a show with a female main character, who several bishonen coworkers have the hots for; the guys keep getting their clothes ripped off, and one of them is cursed with constant sexual embarassment. Probably not your cup of tea, right? And, yeah, the show is aimed at boys, but it's entirely possible to make a show that appeals to boys without giving them weird ideas about what girls should be like. See lossthief's post for examples. If you'd still rather watch fanservicey action anime, that's fine, you're not a bad person for doing so, and I doubt there will be a shortage of them anytime soon. But that you had to ask that question shows you have a lot to learn about where other people's preferences come from. |
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NeverConvex
Subscriber
Posts: 2308 |
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For me, I think the problems with Tamaki's character are less about her being offensive (though that's certainly a reasonable reaction), but rather that her 'lucky lechery':
(A) screams through the fourth wall at me that this is not even remotely a plausible in-universe mechanic, & is obviously just the director pandering clumsily in my general direction. It forcefully ejects me from any earned sense of verisimilitude every time Tamaki's on-screen (B) is emphasized precisely when it will do the most damage to the emotional tone a scene had been working to develop (as with her getting beaten mercilessly by Rekka until Shinra showed up; an imperfect but somewhat moving scene... at least until Tamaki's clothing is burned away in a pattern clearly designed to titillate) It also doesn't help that she's (C) a pretty thin outline of a character, of course. But with the exception of Shinra we haven't really gotten much depth of motivation on any of the cast, so that's hardly unique to her -- she's, uh, lucky to have gotten 2-3 whole character traits, I guess (blindly loves Rekka / stupid lucky-lecher thing / .. is a cat girl with some attitude?). Also, that T-shirt image lossthief posted is perfect. I had wanted to comment on the claim that Tamaki is 'satire', but just didn't have the energy to figure out how to articulate my complaint properly. That image captures the problem perfectly. Last edited by NeverConvex on Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:48 pm; edited 4 times in total |
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ANN_Lynzee
ANN Executive Editor
Posts: 2945 Location: Email for assistance only |
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Kuroi Ren please try to include all your comments in one post instead of multiple posts in a row. I combined them for you this time, but it keeps the forum from getting clogged up.
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theNightster
Posts: 1328 |
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The hate on Tamaki is pretty over blown I feel, sure the fan service regarding her is a bit out there but I respect her for accepting her punishment even if the whole thing with Rekka wasn’t her fault.
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Takkun4343
Posts: 1502 Location: Englewood, Ohio |
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>57 replies
Either the article was really that bad, or the show is more contentious than I first thought. |
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Kuzu
Posts: 145 |
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You have no idea... But yea...the show is pretty to look at alright, but I can't really disagree with the stated faults. Its really over the top with the tits and asses. That's not really unusual with Shonen, but usually they can make up for it with quality writing somewhere. Fire Force's writing just barely crosses the threshold of passable, so all you're left with is the fanservice. Females being treated like eye candy isn't new in Anime, but uh...if there's no character there, it makes them being nothing but eye candy really noticeable, and I'm pretty sure people want more out of a character than to be sexually and emotionally exploited for the sake of a gag or plot development. I'm still gonna follow this series, because I still like its aesthetic and fights are too good and I've seen enough boobs and asses in Anime to stop caring. Yes, I am easy to please and I don't really care. However, I will acknowledge the show is heavily flawed at worse and just hugely generic and uninspired at best which might explain why it's been under the radar for so long despite having a manga for a few years already. |
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StarfighterPegasus
Posts: 149 |
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I'll watch it for the eechi fanservice. If I wanted something deep and compelling I could look at something else. Fanservice is a very rough area. Some people like myself really like it but also understand that its not for everyone. So thank you, I'll give it a watch just a question for those who read the manga.
Is it as fanservicey as the anime adaptation? |
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