Forum - View topicHey, Answerman! [2006-10-06]
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Lady Multi
Posts: 675 |
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I love the Tsubasa Shaoran better than the CCS version...I hated him, I wished he would DIE in CCS. It's pointless to bash an entire series because of ONE character...and the X and Clover thing wasn't CLAMP's fault at all and is technically not "unfinished" just on Haitus.
Don't get me wrong, I'm an impatient little Bi.t.ch when it comes to CLAMP manga and I get really upset when my favorite characters get killed or maimed... ...but I'm not going to argue about an entire anime/manga because they took an AU verison of my favorite character (but personally I LOVE the AU versions of MY characters--OMG, Subaru is a friggen' VAMPIRE~!  ...and Seishirou is STILL a friggen' badarse~! ...AND GORGEOUS~! *hyperventilates*)
Now, I do have to admit I'm not completely thrilled by the animation-style of the Tsubasa Chronicles anime, but hey, I'm the one who can watch a Disney movie three times in a row and point out ALL the animation and logic bloopers in the film. ...besides compaired to xxxHolic (though I do like it), Tsubasa Chronicle's is gorgeous. ...but, hey, what's with all this chat about an anime not released in the US, yet; I can wait to see what happens with an Engish dub *prays its not completely horrible*. |
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Lady Multi
Posts: 675 |
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on a separate note:
doujinshi, I own some; I LOVE doujinshi, but I know what they basically are: fanfiction with pictures. |
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Tenchi
 Posts: 4471 Location: Ottawa... now I'm an ex-Anglo Montrealer. |
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Also, from what I'm reading about this rapidly fizzling and backfiring "October Surprise", the most explicit conversations, assuming those IM's aren't fakes, were with a page who was 18 years old at the time and who was baiting him on, getting a homophobic chuckle out of an easy target. Even if he was attracted to slightly younger targets, I'd call Foley an "ephebophile" at worst, with an age of attraction easily half a decade at the very least older than Michael Jackson's probable age of attraction, in the age range that could hardly be called "shota". |
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Jordansuki
Posts: 3 |
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Yeah, sadly Answerman made the common mistake of implying that Doujinshi are only fans works. I do it, too. Doujinshi are simply self published works in a magazine style format. Being a yaoi fan, some of the manga I read was originally doujinshi. Chapters of works by Kazuma Kodaka, Youka Nitta and Tori Maia that are now in manga form were doujinshi. And, for two of them, those manga are licensed in the US. Now, also as a yaoi fan, if shouta would just disppear I would die of sheer happiness. |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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Jesus christ, can we not turn this into a "republican apologists defend sicko" thing? Parrot whatever crap you want from right-wing radio and right-wing television on other forums. Go ahead and do that. Other forums will welcome that. You can go ahead and dismiss it as an "october surprise", but please don't shit up this thread with a bunch of apologist nonsense. Please. |
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Lapis Lazuli Lolita
 Posts: 220 Location: The N-Field |
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Don'tcha love politics, Zac? One question though: What do you mean when you say "Other forums will welcome that"? Will this forum not, even in relevance? This is just out of curiousity, as I won't be bringing up any of this crap. |
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Mohawk52
 Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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If Answerman is one thing, it's certainly educational. Living the sheltered world that I do, I never heard of the term "shouta" before now, though I've never differentiated between the gender difference, Lolicom meant the same for both to me.
On the subject of doujinshi, I too grimice when I read it being lumped into the "nothing but fanfic porn" catogory. There are a few "self published novels" of uncompleted anime, that never had a running manga before its production. The three "Shin Tenchi Muyo" or "True Tenchi Muyo" novels written by the OVAs' creator Masaki Kajishima are just an example of one I would pay handsomely for, if translated into English. One could never completely understand this story without them. 
Last edited by Mohawk52 on Fri Oct 06, 2006 3:46 am; edited 1 time in total |
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cardcaptormanda
 Posts: 237 Location: United States |
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I agree that CCS Syaoran was better. So was CCS Sakura, for that matter. But I think the ranter (hmm…not a word?) is either a little confused, or getting upset at nothing. Yes, the characters in Tsubasa share the same name and a similar character design as various other CLAMP characters, but that's it. It's an AU, and she shouldn't be surprised or upset if he's different, because he's not the same person. There doesn't need to be reasoning behind why (such as him meeting Sakura at a younger age, etc...), because the only reason needed is "it's an AU." He was never meant to "be" Syaoran in the first place.
As for him being a stale and wooden character in Tsubasa… I personally think most of the characters come off that way. I just don't feel a "connection" with them like I have in other CLAMP works, which is probably one of the main reasons I haven't really been enjoying Tsubasa as a whole. |
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darkheart510
Posts: 4 |
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i really really don't think that scene can be considered "gangbang," it was more of a reaffirmation of their connection with one another. With shota, along with all other genres of manga, you have to look at the content in order to be able to sort it out into age groups and appropriateness. right, there are some that's absolutely disgusting and should be blasted into space, but there are others that are sweet, emotional, and basically harmless. People who haven't read any of it (or the right ones) shouldn't make blanket statements like "all shota" or "all lolicon." it's like saying "all mecha" or "all shojo." it's more about the content than genre. While on the other hand, i also agree that having any sort of advertised shota/lolicon coming into the market would result in some a horrific battle, so licensing anything obvious will be out--for a looong while. it's still very very taboo regardless of whether it's fictional or not. on the news today, the jailed suspect of the jon benet case had "five images of child pornography..." just FIVE. it wasn't like a whole hard drive. and we never get any word of what the nature of the images are. what, kids of relatives in the tub covered in bubble bath? or something worse? Also, i'd hate to be classified as a molestor just because i have shota images on my laptop (which i do). i don't get the urge to molest little boys and girls. i still see them as i always have: little. freakin'. brats. i understand that often sexual scenes depicting anyone of any age are idealized and romantised blah blah blah. I think the problem is differentiating between fantasy and real intent to do. like with violent images in video games, there are people who play to unwind and others who take it too far. From that point, it stops being a issue of video game influence and it becomes an issue of what's wrong in the mind/life/body of the perpetrator. The cause of the problem is never ever just one thing, but a whole slew of things, like childhood trama, depression, etc. We just demonize the closest thing because it's easier to have something to face. But if you're a yaoi fan(which i am and darn proud of it) and you've been watching the licensing frenzy, you'll have noticed some mangas that are cutting it pretty close. The ones which have been licensed are very tame and very sweet. (but absolutely tasteless in terms of plot/angst/humor or anything that'll make it remotely interesting) I haven't seen any that are lolicon tho...what licensed lolicon mangas are there? Moving on, i like syaoron in ccs. but not quite so much in tsubasa. and the rant described it perfectly because i had no inkling why i didn't like him so much. Really, he is like a flat generic, cookie-cutter "tragic hero" with no real faults. Yea, Syaoron in ccs was a dense idiot, but that made him so much more likable. Tsubasa's Syaoron is sweet, gentle, determined and totally not real. Sure, i'll cry for him at moments that Sakura doesn't remember him, but...he irritates me. come to think of it, so does Tsubasa's sakura to a certain extent. the only reason i'd keep reading is to see the interaction between fai and kurogane. that's it. Also, to the people who buy doujinshi only to find porn, i think that instead of focusing on a title(naruto, FMA, etc) you should try searching by artists/group. there'll probably be less of a chance of finding porn, but if you buy anthologies....umm.... you'll have to take the good with the bad... |
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HitokiriShadow
 Posts: 6251 |
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Since the forum crashed and posts were lost, I'll restate (more or less, since I can't remember the exact wording) what was put in my post and save a mod/admin/whoever from having to do it again: No more politics. All further discussion of politics will be deleted. |
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sazan fan
Posts: 3 |
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TRC (Sakura's) Syaoran is a clone with a manufactured/borrowed heart from the real Syaoran who had just recently escaped from his prison. That is why Syaoran was acting the way he is. TRC is actually just as intricate (plot wise) as any other Clamp works (if not more). You just need patience to follow through with the entire story. If fact, TRC (sakura's) Syaoran is probably the best Clamp character thus far. You think you have him figured out (just like how he is described in the rant, predictable etc.) then all of a suddent everything you knew about him goes right out the window. So in summary, even though you are just expressing your opinion, Nathalie, you are completely wrong.
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Lollercoaster
Posts: 2 |
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I'm pretty sure the author of the Syaoran rant missed the point entirely.
TRC is, essentially, a vehicle for fanservice and very little else. Because of this, its plot is that of a very generic shounen manga, complete with the stereotypical main characters of the genre: the ever-determined, boring, personalityless male protagonist and his equally boring, useless love interest that perpetually needs to be rescued, or helped, or more often doesn't really contribute anything at all (interestingly, the ranter didn't comment at all on the similar neutering of Sakura's character). Despite what they may say to the contrary, I believe the reason they chose Syaoran and Sakura as the protags of the series are because they are one of CLAMP's most well-known and popular pairings, not because they're one of the ones with the happiest endings. Syaoran and Sakura are like that in the manga because it better fuels the manga's purpose. If they had chosen any other two characters, it's likely they also would have been altered in a similar fashion. It doesn't decrease the amount of fanservice the manga presents because they still interact in cutesy, child-crush fashions like their original counterparts, which is what the CCS fans want from them. The only real side effect is that the more disgruntled fans feel the need to reimmerse themselves in the original series. Which gives CLAMP more money, which is the point. (Also, I would like to add that the anime in general is crap. The animation, the art, the storytelling, everything. The art in the manga is much more aesthetic and corresponds with the art in xxxHOLiC, with which it actively crosses over. Only it is adapted slightly to TRC's more racy and action-oriented style.) |
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FuuH
 Posts: 23 Location: middle-earth!:D |
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Honestly I somewhat agree with the this column's rant.. I think that, from what I've seen of Tsubasa, it's very uninspired and kind of a waste considering what was achieved with CLAMP's past characters.
I know it is supposed to be fanservice... I know a lot of people who adore reading more about their favorite characters. I think however that they're nothing like themselves in the past series they were in in Tsubasa.. It's very uninteresting, to watch your favorite characters turned into very simple, mindless fanservice. I love CCS with all my heart and Tsubasa doesn't really touch me the same way.. I don't see why people prefer the substitute. She has a point - it isnt CLAMP's best - it is probably CLAMP's worst. Even the popularity it has doesnt make it any good. It's wonderful for fans who are very much into seeing their favorite characters again (or anything CLAMP), but I hate seeing a thing like Tsubasa outshine their older, more captivating characters and stories. |
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Lollercoaster
Posts: 2 |
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I am actually included in that group. I don't like them at all in this series either. I was just pointing out the reason for such changes. Basically the way to go is to just deal with it and to enjoy the other benefits of the series. If there aren't any for you, then you just don't like the series. No big deal. |
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LydiaDianne
 Posts: 5633 Location: Southern California |
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I have to say that I don't really understand the rant about Tsubasa. I like this older version of Shaoran and it's obvious that we have more to learn especially the connection with spoiler[The Shaoran in the Bottle]. I'm looking forward to seeing exactly how the two connect. Also if the "evil henchwoman" is really all that evil...we'll see!
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