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NEWS: Crackle to Stream Robotech TV Series, Film


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penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 8138
Location: Penguinopolis
PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2016 10:51 pm Reply with quote
Robotech needs to go away. Actually, at this point, even Macross needs to. Talk about a burned down franchise. Between Kawamori and Harmony Gold, the whole mass has been obliterated by incompetence. Frontier was forgettable, Delta is abominable, and Robotech is just... how is that still a thing? We can't even get a good release of Macross Plus over here because of HG nonsense. Both sides of the world failed the fans.
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Beltane70



Joined: 07 May 2007
Posts: 2945
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 12:16 am Reply with quote
While I agree with your sentiments on Robotech, penguin, I find very little wrong with Macross and its past few sequels.
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SWAnimefan



Joined: 10 Oct 2014
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 2:38 am Reply with quote
It's ironic that I grew up in the age of Robotech and never really saw it beyond the models friends had (it never aired on the stations where I lived). So I respect old school fan dedication. But after watching the REAL Macross Saga from the original Macross to Macross 7, Plus, 0, Frontier, and now Delta, I can understand the hatred for Harmony Gold and what they did to the real series.

I really find it despicable Harmony Gold making a profit off the original like they are. Could you imagine if they took Star Trek, renamed it something else, and had Kirk and Spock voiced over as alien hunters? Then they prevented TNG, DS9, Voyager and Enterprise from being aired?

Harmony Gold should let go of Macross, let it be its own self again. Then they can do whatever they want with the Robotech franchise (minus the Macross elements). But instead, they tightened their greedy fists in making a movie that's going to make everyone think the Japanese creators ripped off Robotech. And that's not right. I just wish Nue and Shōji Kawamori put more of a legal fight, so they get the money they rightfully deserve.
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Cptn_Taylor



Joined: 08 Nov 2013
Posts: 925
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 3:18 am Reply with quote
penguintruth wrote:
Robotech needs to go away. Actually, at this point, even Macross needs to. Talk about a burned down franchise. Between Kawamori and Harmony Gold, the whole mass has been obliterated by incompetence. Frontier was forgettable, Delta is abominable, and Robotech is just... how is that still a thing? We can't even get a good release of Macross Plus over here because of HG nonsense. Both sides of the world failed the fans.



Talk about using a broad brush Penguintruth. Robotech is already six feet under anyway, and most Robotech fans are fast approaching senility age. This kind of fandom can't be passed on to a successive generation. So Robotech will die with its current few fans. Frontier on the other hand was anything except forgettable. You do know that Frontier is the biggest success that Macross franchise has ever had in Japan ? It's the main freaking reason we have Macross Delta.
Seriously man don't put Harmony Shit and Studio Nue/Big West/ Satelight on the same plane. One is the bully, the others are victims. HG literally stole the name of the franchise from the rightful owners. The blame for your Macross Plus not getting an american release is entirely on the shoulders of the shady shitty company that shall not be named.
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SuiSeiKen



Joined: 19 Mar 2012
Posts: 51
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 5:30 am Reply with quote
penguintruth wrote:
Robotech needs to go away. Actually, at this point, even Macross needs to. Talk about a burned down franchise. Between Kawamori and Harmony Gold, the whole mass has been obliterated by incompetence. Frontier was forgettable, Delta is abominable, and Robotech is just... how is that still a thing? We can't even get a good release of Macross Plus over here because of HG nonsense. Both sides of the world failed the fans.


From the very beginning, the Macross franchise always had 3 thematic elements : song, love triangle and variable fighters. No less, no more. So did Frontier, and so does Delta. It so does not betray the original Macross spirit, except for people who can't deal with j-pop, which is taking more and more part on the shows since Frontier. But here again, because the franchise knows how to move along with the times, and evolves in the form it popularized. You can say it's a facility to the japanese otaku market, i rather consider this as a strength that many over franchises don't have.

By the way, it's still really funny to see people both complaining about Delta's j-pop and adulating 7 and his j-rock. Basically the same for me. I just call it "Macross, the power of songs".

What could i say about Harmony Gold ? Yeah, although they did all in a legal form, they stole a name from it rightful owners. That's the point.
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Anime World Order



Joined: 05 May 2006
Posts: 387
Location: Florida
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 8:21 am Reply with quote
TarsTarkas wrote:
Robotech has many fans and they shouldn't be punished because some fans are mad at Harmony Gold.


Macross has many fans and they shouldn't be punished because some fans are quite enamored with Harmony Gold. Yet here we are. Still. After decades.

There wouldn't be this decades-raging, seething disdain for Harmony Gold and Robotech if they'd just allow the rest of the unaltered Macross titles to come out here and remain in print. But they don't, and they falsely claimed "don't look at little ol' us, Big West is the responsible party here!" for ages.

If they just did that, then all that anger would vanish. People used to be very anti-Streamline Pictures, but now that seeing their version of the titles they put out is optional instead of mandatory it's no big deal.
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FLCLGainax



Joined: 10 May 2010
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Location: Land of the Free
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 9:10 am Reply with quote
Before clicking on the article, I had assumed "film" meant "Robotech: The Movie" from 1986 instead of Shadow Chronicles.
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EricJ2



Joined: 01 Feb 2014
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 11:56 am Reply with quote
SWAnimefan wrote:
It's ironic that I grew up in the age of Robotech and never really saw it beyond the models friends had (it never aired on the stations where I lived). So I respect old school fan dedication. But after watching the REAL Macross Saga from the original Macross to Macross 7, Plus, 0, Frontier, and now Delta, I can understand the hatred for Harmony Gold and what they did to the real series.


Even worse, HG's marketing in the trailer knows the words to use, and is deliberately trying to kiss up royally to the last sentimental bastion of 80's Age-of-Robotech survivors who won't watch Macross because it "doesn't sound" like what they remember:
"It wasn't like anything else on TV at the time! It had a story, and people got really-killed, and it wasn't like other 80's action series!"
Fortunately, it's even THOSE last remaining survivors who have learned enough to hate HG.

(Oh, if they had gone that other 80's Age-of-Robotech fan step and said "...While everyone else on TV was watching Ranger Smith stop Yogi Bear from stealing picnic baskets!" I still remember defending the Flintstones to the death against of one of those in school, and even though I've since become a Macross:Classic fan, I'd do it again.)
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enurtsol



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 14093
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 2:08 pm Reply with quote
SWAnimefan wrote:

I really find it despicable Harmony Gold making a profit off the original like they are. Could you imagine if they took Star Trek, renamed it something else, and had Kirk and Spock voiced over as alien hunters?


Do ya know why they had to do it that way with Robotech?


SWAnimefan wrote:

Harmony Gold should let go of Macross, let it be its own self again. Then they can do whatever they want with the Robotech franchise (minus the Macross elements). But instead, they tightened their greedy fists in making a movie that's going to make everyone think the Japanese creators ripped off Robotech. And that's not right. I just wish Nue and Shōji Kawamori put more of a legal fight, so they get the money they rightfully deserve.


Good luck with that since they signed that contract that made sense at the time.
Kinda like Marvel signing that Spiderman contract with Sony that kinda made sense for them at the time.
And kinda like the new deal that now allows Spiderman to be used by both Marvel and Sony, pretty much the fastest way Macross can be used by both sides outside Japan is for both sides to play nice and shake hands on a deal that mutually benefit together.
Spiderman rightfully belongs to Marvel, but Sony still wants to make monies and has contract law on their side. So either they keep things unchanged for decades more, or they can work it out. So they worked it out.
There's a lesson there.
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walw6pK4Alo



Joined: 12 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 2:42 pm Reply with quote
But Harmony Gold doesn't want to play nice. They have this weird perverse death grasp on Robotech, like it's the only thing in their lives that gives them any meaning.

Anyway, aren't Robotech fans getting their AARP cards this year?
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Redbeard 101
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Joined: 14 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 2:58 pm Reply with quote
Alright folks lets watch the pointless, and possibly flamebait, one liners. I removed a handful already. Thanks
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PurpleWarrior13



Joined: 05 Sep 2009
Posts: 1897
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 4:14 pm Reply with quote
Robotech used to stream on Hulu, Netflix, and YouTube when Manga Ent. had the streaming rights. Glad to see it back, but it's a shame it's the "old" version instead the remastered one with better quality footage and deleted scenes put back in.

And you don't have to be old to like Robotech. I'm 21 and enjoy watching it. HG's legal problems are one thing, but fans can still enjoy Robotech if they want. IMO, it holds up really well, and was a surprisingly accurate adaptation for the time. The actual people that localized it aren't even working at HG anymore. They moved to places like Saban shortly afterwords. I know plenty that like it to this day, and I would certainly never insult someone for liking or disliking something. As far as I'm concered, Macross is basically a different version of the same show (as Season 1), and we're all fans of the same thing. Once again, the legal issues are a seperate thing. Robotech would still exist even if HG didn't.
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TarsTarkas



Joined: 20 Dec 2007
Posts: 5064
Location: Virginia, United States
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 8:48 pm Reply with quote
walw6pK4Alo wrote:
But Harmony Gold doesn't want to play nice. They have this weird perverse death grasp on Robotech, like it's the only thing in their lives that gives them any meaning.

Anyway, aren't Robotech fans getting their AARP cards this year?


I liked Macross Do You Remember Love, I loved Macross Plus, and I liked Frontier a lot. I own the Laserdisc for DYRL and that musical special one too, and I have Macross Plus too. Wish I could own Frontier, but that is how the ball bounces.

But I also love the Robotech Macross, and I still have the Robotech pilot VHS tape, that I bought from an ad in the Starlog magazine. I bought the VHS tapes for the TV series, and I still have one set in the plastic wrap it came in. Though it took me awhile to upgrade to DVD. I have read all the novels that came out, and still wish Harmony Gold would have gone in that continuity direction for the new stuff. People are still playing the Robotech games and they are still selling new stuff.

As to the current situation, if the Japanese companies felt they had a case against Harmony Gold, they would have gone to court along time ago. Maybe Harmony Gold are the bad guys, but the Japanese have played hard ball before too. Not too hard to believe that Japan wanted to restructure their relationship with Harmony Gold and they burned some bridges. Then again, maybe Harmony Gold is the big bad. No one truly knows and the Japanese aren't talking, and seemingly many wouldn't believe Harmony Gold even if they told the truth.

As another poster said, both the Japanese and Harmony Gold have to come together to resolve this in a beneficial manner for both sides. The best business deal is the one where both sides feel they came out winners.
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enurtsol



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 14093
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 11:21 pm Reply with quote
walw6pK4Alo wrote:

But Harmony Gold doesn't want to play nice. They have this weird perverse death grasp on Robotech, like it's the only thing in their lives that gives them any meaning.


Obviously both sides would have to benefit; otherwise there won't be a deal. It inevitably comes down to the same old question "What's in it for us?" Money talks a long way.

(In the case of the new Marvel-Sony deal, Sony gets to keep all the profits off their Spiderman movies instead of sharing it with Marvel per the old deal, and the same with Marvel with their Avengers movies featuring Spiderman.)
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GeorgeC



Joined: 22 Nov 2008
Posts: 794
PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2016 1:45 am Reply with quote
Wow...

Mentioning the "R" word here is like mentioning the "N" word on most bulletin boards.

************************

SDF Macross WAS released well over 10 years ago on DVD in the US... TWICE. Around 3-4 years ago, it WAS bundled with the Robotech English dub on DVD-R's sold through Amazon.com... Don't really understand this notion that it was NEVER available in the States because that's absolutely not true!

SO, if you were too little to get it or didn't want to buy it for whatever reasons, well -- can't help you there! You can always buy the Japanese DVDs or Blu rays if it burns you that much that any American company licensed Macross. Go ahead -- enjoy it without a dub or any English subtitles. They've done maybe 2-3 Macross releases in Japan that actually had an English dub (far worse than anything recorded in the US) or English subtitles so far? Good luck with that!

SDF Macross sold well enough for AnimEigo, the first company that put it out on subtitled DVD in the States but they kept their sales goals reasonably low and priced the show so that they didn't lose money on the deal. They sold over 10,000 sets of the entire series if I remember correctly. That's pretty good for a show that never aired uncut in the US.

ADV Films re-released the series, uncut, on DVD AFTER AnimEigo's licensed lapsed AND did a dub that was roundly criticized by all 10 people who actually bought their DVDs in store. (The Japanese audio on the AnimEigo release definitely sounded better.) The ADV-dubbed SDF Macross release was a sales failure... They also aired the series on Anime Network... Sure, anime channels have never been popular in the States BUT the fact is that the show did air on American cable.

Inconvenient fact -- Robotech WAY outsold Macross, Southern Cross, AND Genesis Climber Mospeada when they were all released on DVD. I don't know those sales figures -- only ADV Films/Section23 has them -- but I'd be surprised if the first Robotech release alone (the original broadcast version) didn't sell more than the uncut shows combined by at least a factor of 6, maybe 8. The fact of the matter is that the other three shows would probably never have been released in the States without the success of the show that so many of you hate with a passion. Not that you let those passions get in the way of inconvenient facts.

(FYI, I like all the shows -- for different reasons. I still think Southern Cross IS the weak-link in the English adaptation and is only moderately better in the original Japanese version.)

I don't know where this notion that the original show (SDF Macross) WASN'T ever available came from other than people who are so upset or ignorant of the facts that they just come in here to complain about them.

It's the same crap over and over again whenever "R" comes up.

You guys that hate this stuff ARE the minority, like it or not. It's a fact that localized anime has done better than any of the "true to the source," subtitled-to-death releases. That's not an opinion... those are the sales figures. Justin Sevakis and the guys who do the podcasts for ANN will tell you the same thing... No opinion in this -- it's hard, cold sales figures.

The discussions about what did and didn't happen with Robotech/Macross inevitably get toxic because frankly some of you are so locked into what YOU believed happened (instead of what did happen) that no amount of logic or legal paperwork will convince you to lighten up, to be fairer to the people who actually lived through these things. Decisions were made over 30 years ago that NONE of you were part of -- you weren't there, you didn't have a voice in it, you weren't aware of decisions that HAD to be made to get TV shows on the air. The TV environment in the 1980s was way different than it is today. There was no Internet like today, cable wasn't as widespread, and the licensing/syndication market was also very different.
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