Forum - View topicREVIEW: Angel Beats! Complete Collection
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Covnam
 Posts: 3644 |
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I was waiting to pick this up till a review came up so that I knew what was included and what wasn't (considering their recent releases). I'm happy to see that the OVA is there, but not that the Another Epilogue short is missing. Hmm, decisions decisions.
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DRWii
 Posts: 636 |
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My only real problem with the series is the ending. Oh sure, it's really emotionally powerful...spoiler[until you realize it's a complete paradox; if Kanade was supposed to have gotten Otonashi's heart, then why was she in the afterlife first? And well before him at that?] Oh well, doesn't change the fact that the rest of the show is good.
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xBTAx
Posts: 189 |
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It doesn't have Another Epilogue? There was some suspicion beforehand that it wouldn't based on it saying it had 13 episodes + the OVA, but I didn't expect it to be true. It is rather short and I'm certainly a big enough fan of the show to buy it without AE, but unlike some other shows with omake shorts or something similar, AE does add to the plot a bit, so...
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maaya
Posts: 976 |
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"Its excellent balance of music, humor, action, drama, and emotion"? Never thought anybody could feel that way about Angel Beats
 Indeed, it's always amazing how tastes (and perceptions) can differ.
To me, AB was one horribly disappointing series, badly written, badly directed, one of the worst the whole year 2010 had to offer. I'd replace "excellent balance" with "big mess", that ends with a big plot hole spoiler[how can Kaede have been in the afterworld way longer than Otonashi, if she had been alive longer (and apparently a lot longer) than him.] "Few viewers will correctly anticipate the truth" because it makes no sense >< And the setting sounded so interesting and fresh. This show could have been so much better. I really wish they would have adapted After School Nightmare instead. |
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GeminiDS85
Posts: 391 |
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The series never indicated that spoiler[ the linear timeline of the purgatory the characters inhabited was in direct juxtaposition to the linear timeline of the world of living, so, therefore, Kanade arriving before Otonashi is completely justified in this narrative context.]
Last edited by GeminiDS85 on Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:28 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Yttrbio
 Posts: 3652 |
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spoiler[Maybe he was just napping all that time? It's Purgatory High, I don't think time has to make sense.] spoiler[If I were more into "analysis" of such things, I'd say that, until Kanade was around, there wasn't any point for Otonashi to be around, because she was what would help him pass on. But vice versa, too, huh? I'll stick with my "meh, whatever works" answer.] I found the banter to be hilarious, but the drama kind of overwrought and difficult to take seriously. I was pretty surprised to see the license picked up. I was sure that folks on the Japanese side of things thought they had something worth way more than it actually would get here. |
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Key
Moderator
 Posts: 18182 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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I knew these objections were going to come up, but that wasn't a point that I could address in the review proper without getting into major spoilers. We discussed this supposed plot hole at length in the Anime forum Angel Beats! thread back when the series' initial Japanese airing finished, and some came up with what I consider a very reasonable explanation: that spoiler[nothing in the series indicates that everyone died around the same time, so it was hardly impossible for Otonashi and Kaede to exist there simultaneously. As for her getting there first, the series made suggestions in a couple of places that lost souls occasionally wander into that space who don't belong there, so it is entirely possible that Otonashi's soul was wandering for a long time before arriving there.] Thus the ending doesn't necessarily reflect a plot hole. Of course, if you've already got such a mad-on hate for the series that you're calling one of the worst of 2010 - and, honestly, I find that to be such an outlandish claim that I consider it hyperbole - then that explanation is unlikely to sway you. |
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hissatsu01
 Posts: 963 Location: NYC |
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This review was rather more charitable than I would have been. Like other PA Works shows, production values were generally quite good. And when Angel Beats! was trying to be funny, I generally found it quite funny. Unfortunately, when it was trying to be dramatic, and especially when it was trying to tug at heartstrings in an all out effort to get some tears is when it became completely laughable. I couldn't take it seriously at all. In the end I felt the time I wasted watching it would have been better spent working on my backlog.
Last edited by hissatsu01 on Thu Jul 14, 2011 1:48 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Ringking
Posts: 338 |
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As for the working out the remaining characters backstories, i was actually having a discussion about that the other day on another forum. I get the feeling that if enough time had been spent working out EVERYONE'S issues, the series would have dragged on for to long. And even when they did get rid of them, that serves a purpose on its own (spoiler[to demonstrate just how simple it is to make the choice]).
Im also gonna put forth a differing theory concerning the 'plot holes' and hanging story threads that people are always so eager to point out. My conclusion was simply that the story to be told isn't the story of the world, its origins or how it works, its the story of the people who fought that meaningless war. Those hanging parts and 'holes' are typical Key writing, exactly WHY things happen are generally not relevant in their works, only the fact that it DOES and how thats going to impact on the characters. In many ways, I like these unresolved bits because of the way they allow the viewer to think about the story afterward and make their own conclusions. It also means this series gets better with rewatching (I've done it 10 times now: P) |
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swienke
 Posts: 245 |
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Yeah, chalk me up as another person who wasn't terribly impressed with this show. It had a fantastic, compelling, and utterly unique premise, but I thought it was unevenly paced and horribly directed, and that just killed it for me.
My biggest problem with the series was probably how horribly rushed some of the character development was, and how many of the character interactions rang hollow. For example, I absolutely hated how the episode concerning Naoi spent so much time spoiler[building him up to be some horrific sociopathic monster that was willing to kill and torture everybody in the Battlefront, and then had Otonashi come in and hug him and suddenly he was just a sad misunderstood puppy. Here we had the makings of a great villain, and within about 10 seconds he becomes nothing more than the "hypnotist who uses his powers to amusingly evil effect," as Key put it.] Frankly, I raged about that episode for days afterwards, and it still stinks of god awful directing. As for the ending, I didn't actually have an issue with the chronological inconsistencies for the reasons that Key mentioned, but I thought that Angel had the personality of a cardboard box, and her spoiler[relationship with Otonashi was one of the limpest, most confoundingly lifeless anime relationships I've ever encountered. They had absolutely zero chemistry, and I felt as though the creators were trying to smash me over the head with "THIS IS A SERIOUS ROMANCE!!!" during the last couple of episodes instead of allowing it to blossom organically. And those last couple of scenes between the two of them just smacked of artless, unsubtle attempts at melodramatic manipulation.] Frankly, it left a pretty bad taste in my mouth. That's not to say that I hated the series, because I certainly didn't. I thought Iwasawa and Yui's stories were beautifully and poignantly explored, and I shed quite a few tears for both of their episodes. But it's partly because of how magnificently it handled their stories that I was so disappointed with the rest of it: their arcs showed that the series was more than capable of providing moving and emotionally resonant entertainment with a high degree of skill, so it makes the clumsiness and choppy pace of much of the rest of the series almost inexcusable in my eyes. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Angel Beats wasn't one of the worst for the year (either with respect to being broadcast or released) but it isn't one of the best. It was fun to watch, but I also can never forgive it for its problematic writing and awful pacing. The plot was only truly getting going and then bam the show was over, massive plot holes unfilled and numerous loose plot threads left dangling in its wake. Episodes eleven and twelve raised more questions than they answered, while episode thirteen resolved only the character relationships and the immediate situation. Sort of. The cast was easily twice as large than a one-cour series could ever handle, reducing most characters to one-note performances.
Finally, the backstories were all supposed to be moving, yet it was absurd in just how overtly manipulative the writing got. Honestly, is their anyone who didn't roll their eyes when hearing of Yurippe's past? Kind of not the reaction that was intended I'm sure, but what exactly did Maeda and co. expect with such a poorly-conceived and heavy-handed attempt at gaining sympathy for the female lead character? From that point on the show was broken goods, although episode five managed to be both very funny and very engrossing.
Oh, I am so relieved that you're wrong about this or else I would be terrified for the immediate future of the North American Anime industry. The only positibe thing Angel Beats did was have awesome music. I can't even say it had exceptional art; the second episode was rather notable for the drop-off in quality. With all of its narrative, plot and pacing problems I cannot see how it could be better than any of Dance in the Vampire Bund, Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood or Ga-Rei Zero, all of which were released or partly released this year (if I'm not mistaken). I just know that Theron is probably going to include Angel Beats in the end-of-year honours list and that irks me. Oh well. |
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One-Eye
 Posts: 2261 |
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I liked the series in general, but as with a lot of anime it left me with mixed feelings. The parts that worked usually worked well and the parts that didn't were often a bit forced. It felt at times a bit uneven, not balanced through out. It feels a bit rushed because we don't see other characters back stories. But I agree with the review, delving into each characters stories might have made the series too long.
You pretty much nailed the two points that bugged me about the series, but I probably don't feel as strongly about it as you do. I thought the first was a bit over the top, but I could have dealt with it except spoiler[we have that whole hugging thing going on. The power of the hug in Japan must be something,] but its over used and annoying. I also felt that though the end was quite emotional and worked by itself,spoiler[ the relationship did not feel developed enough to warrant such a confession and emotion.] These weaknesses bring the show down for me a little bit. Not to the point were I hate it and I would still recommend it for most of the reasons in the review. Its still a good show and I think the unique qualities it has make it a recommended show to watch. |
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crosswithyou
 Posts: 2892 Location: California |
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How come no one's mentioned the absolutely perfect performance by the Japanese cast?? Otonashi's backstory gets me teary every time. The last episode was very powerful too.
I have to admit that I didn't pick up this series at first because the art style was the dansei-muke type, but it was strongly recommended to me by a friend. And I gotta say-- I LOVED Angel Beats!. Already got this on order from Amazon and am just waiting for a few other pre-orders to come in so it can be shipped out. Am looking forward to rewatching the series in high-def! |
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immortalrite
 Posts: 56 Location: Yonkers, NY |
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I personally tend to think that Purgatory-set stories furnish some of the strongest and most compelling/meaningful character drama around. Angel Beats therefore undoubtedly has a masterpiece-level premise a la Haibane Renmei, whilst it is arguably rather flawed in execution.
Now while I do not like to think of myself as a monstrously cynical person, I did also have one of those "but wait, this doesn't make any sense" moments at the ending, assuming at the time that the series' setting and its desire for a dramatic revelation had revealed themselves to be directly, albeit inadvertently in conflict. However, one satisfactory explanation may exist which Theron has already touched upon: in nearly all standard Purgatory theology, it is understood that time does not necessarily move in a linear fashion (for example, this is a constant theme in C.S. Lewis' The Great Divorce) as it does on Earth, but rather that "all times are a single instant." Time thus only appears linear 1) for storytelling purposes and 2) from the limited perspective of individuals, namely in this case, that of Otonashi. We therefore need not assume that he was transported to the Battlefront instantly after he died, but that, in a certain sense, both he and Kanade exist there "infinitely." Granted, I understand that this is a grain of salt which many, perhaps even myself, are not willing to completely accept if at all. Actually my main issue with the ending was that spoiler[I didn't really like how it was strongly suggested that after being "redeemed," the students were able to regain their former lives on Earth, as opposed to going to Heaven. The notion that one gets to live again after they have already effectively "lived again," seems like a classic case of double jeopardy, or having your cake and eating it too.] Also, the issue of too many characters and too little time to properly develop them could have easily been remedied by either by 1) making it a 26-episode series or 2) having a smaller supporting cast. I never felt this has been an issue with previous Key works, as the primary cast has always been somewhat limited. As much as I really enjoyed seeing how Yuri overcomes her bitterness and resentment and Hinata reclaims his original love for baseball through romantic interest, it felt as though perhaps the producers were a little bit too gung-ho when it came to generating a large supporting cast of somewhat shallow, albeit varied, characters who exist purely for comedic value. As much as I want to see the dub, I am still on the fence as to whether or not I will actually buy this on Blu-ray. Given this review, I might indeed turn out to be more forgiving towards it upon multiple viewings. |
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maaya
Posts: 976 |
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To me it's a very lazy explanation. Still, it wouldn't be so bad if the series actually did imply it somehow, but it didn't. So even the whole "time is relative"-theory is still speculation by fans, who somehow try to fill that hole in the story. The creators really could have bothered to address this issue. They had so much comedy fillers and 2 specials. The way it is now, it just seems like a badly thought-out scenario v.v But in fact, the ending plot hole is far from the worst part of the show. spoiler[ "the students were able to regain their former lives on Earth, as opposed to going to Heaven." ] spoiler[I dunno if it's supposed to be the same life (they do have similar hair color etc), but the whole setting seems based on Buddhism, and they are therefore reborn all the time (until they attain enlightenment). So I guess they're simply reborn into a new life, with a new identity.]
It's not hate, just disappointment (and even that is gone now after 1 year). It was indeed among the worst shows I watched in 2010 (together with OreImo and Kobato f.ex.), but of course I skipped a lot of shows of which I already knew that I'd dislike them and it's highly possible that a lot of them were even worse than AB. But that doesn't help much, watching AB still was a very bad experience for me. |
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