Forum - View topicThings anime should borrow from American TV or vice versa.
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Top Gun
 Posts: 4594 |
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It amuses me somewhat that Japan is being held up as a paragon of contiguous storytelling and non-ratings-driven entertainment...when they're the ones who gave the world the never-ending shounen title.
Kidding aside, one element of anime I'd love to see American television co-opt is the reasonably short, self-contained story. When I first started watching anime, the very idea of a 26-episode, fully-planned storyline with a pre-defined ending was entirely revolutionary to me; it's something that's simply never done in American television. The individual seasons of 24 are probably the closest we come to that model, and shows in the vein of Lost or Heroes share some of its traits, but even then, there's no guarantee that the end of the road has ever been planned. (As a Lost fan, I was rather reassured when the news broke that the writers had sat down and planned out the general end of the series, though I did wonder just what they had been doing up until that point.) Just about all of my favorite anime series fit into the 26-to-50 episode range for the precise reason of what it allows: sustained character development and storyline progression toward a planned end. Going the other way, something I'd dearly love to see Japan borrow from American television is the concept of...the season break. Now, there have been several recent productions, such as Code Geass or Gundam 00, that seem to be following this model, but they aren't the shows that really need to in my opinion. I'm referring, of course, to the aforementioned never-ending shounen titles. The whole concept of "filler" completely arises from the seeming necessity (probably for financial reasons) of keeping these shows on-air every single week of the year, no matter what the cost. Is there any logical sense in making fans endure almost two years of banal filler before returning to the main plot of a series? Why is the idea of taking the summer/winter/whatever off to give the manga some breathing room such a foreign one? Out of the shounen series I've seen, I think One Piece handles the necessary evil of fillers least annoyingly, but even it shouldn't have to do what it has done to support this model. I just can't comprehend why no one's tried this idea. |
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JacobC
ANN Contributor
 Posts: 3728 Location: SoCal |
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...there was a remake? Battlestar Galactica is an excellent TV show, if nothing else, just for pacing proficiency, something American TV SORELY lacks. I think it's the best example out of the ones mentioned of what Tony K. is hinting at. It's not a cult classic for nothing! (Of the others, Alias got really doofy really fast.) (The only problem I had with it is that the crew spent most of the show fleeing rather than acting toward a goal of their own. They were always on the defensive, so you ceased to care so much when their lives were CONSTANTLY threatened by...well, I shan't spoil it, but that was what soiled the series for me. Too many valleys, not enough hills. But it is a good show. I'm picky.) Yes, I went back and looked at some episodes after I found out Alessandro Juliani was L. I'm such a hopeless fangirl. |
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Bluebeard
 Posts: 267 Location: Massachusetts |
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What I enjoy about anime that many American shows lack is the inclusion of genuine sadness and tragedy regularly, not just in a special gimmick episode focusing on that one event only to have it completelly forgotten about in subsequent episodes. In an American show, something like breaking up with one's significant other amounts to tragedy on a Shakespearean level to the characters. Anime isn't afraid to explore death and illness in a realistic way, such as showing Haruka's rehabilitation after her coma instead of having her up and about as they very well could have since it's a cartoon and American cartoons will often gloss over trivial things like that.
 In fact, just last night I was watching When They Cry. While I was watching the scene where spoiler[Shion is stabbing the hell out of a crucified Satoko, I thought "Well this is just stupid. If she stabbed her in the arm that much she wouldn't even feel it after a while. And not a second later, Satoko stopped screaming and Shion made a comment about her arm going numb. I was floored by this.]
HBO's Six Feet Under is probably the best American show I've seen that succeeds in tragic storytelling. |
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animeboy12
Posts: 160 |
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see that this is an anime forum I'm not surprised that it's mostly what American tv can borrow from anime instead of the other way
one thing I wish anime could do as well as american series in fight scene. I'm not saying anime fight scene are bad but there's an emphasis on style over practicality. |
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infinitebeauty
Posts: 75 |
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A lot of shows have great potential for soundtracks, but never actually make them. I know that if they ever release a soundtrack for Batman: Brave and the Bold I will be first in line to get it. I don't see that many TV soundtracks around though. And what does 'worthy' mean, anyway? The problem with anime borrowing from American television or vice versa is that the two are catering to different audiences. You might be of the opinion that American television sucks, but guess what? It's a business, and as long as people keep watching, people are going to continue what they are doing. It's a simple business model. There are people here that probably look at anime and go 'Jesus, what a bunch of melodramatic eyesores'. There is also the (rather trying) problem of comparing two different mediums. You can't really compare 2D animation with live action, as there is obviously far more flexibility with the 2D animation. Can Lost be compared with Evangelion? Technically, yes, but it does no service to either show. Plenty of western shows deal with death! Doctor Who (and here I am branching out into British shows) deals with tragedy all the time, and it's a family show. Blackadder Goes Forth had what is arguably one of the most heartbreaking and serious endings in British television (or ever), and that was a comedy! In fact, a lot of shows deal with sickness and dying, maybe you're just watching the wrong ones? One thing that both American TV and anime could use is more fourth-wall breaking and other such meta things. I've developed a taste for it, and when done well can up the show's intelligence and humor by a significant amount. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Good point. However, my guess is that fully animating a fight is pretty hard, and most Anime simply don't get the budgets and time necessary to do so. Plus, most American series don't make the entire show about the fight scenes a la Dragonball Z. That's why in Anime we get short bursts of action followed by endless standing around and talking. It's just a limit of the medium combined with the choice of shows that Anime does. |
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farruinn
 Posts: 122 |
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Dealing with sickness and dying is quite different from telling a tragic story. I agree with the earlier poster that there are more tragedies in anime than American TV. You might say a tragedy requires an ending, and if so many American shows just keep airing until they run out of steam, then it's no surprise that there are fewer tragedies. |
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Spotlesseden
Posts: 3514 Location: earth |
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Americans need some shows that have a good continuous story with begining and ending in one season 13 eps or 2 season 26 eps without break. No re-run, or no change time slot until the show is finished.
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animeboy12
Posts: 160 |
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infinitebeauty you make a good point. I think both mediums should keep doing what there doing. Accept the good improve the bad
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doctordoom85
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I don't think anime was a heavy influence on them, though they could have been minor. LOST, especially Seasons 1-2, was heavily influenced by Stephen King's The Stand, and also somewhat influenced by Watchmen/Lord of the Flies/Shakespeare's "The Tempest"/etc. Heroes is basically "LOST meets X-men" (and surprisingly, it actually worked.....in Season 1, that is), and Supernatural is essentially your road story but with tons of classic and creepy horror mixed in. Keep in mind, shows like these have existed before, they've just been somewhat forgotten. The Prisoner (minus the last episode) is TV at its finest, and Twin Peaks (Season 1, but 2 is another matter) is excellent. I think stories like these are more feasible nowadays as TV shows are allowed bigger budgets for certain kinds of stories. And of course, I think American TV will always rule in comedy. Sure, I love Azumanga, School Rumble, etc., but Seinfeld/Arrested Development/Simpsons/Futurama/etc. are on a whole other level for me. |
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infinitebeauty
Posts: 75 |
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But that wasn't what they were saying:
Plenty of shows have genuine sadness and tragedy. I wasn't imagining the fact that the end of Season 4 of Doctor Who had me in tears, or that I can't even think of Blackadder Goes Forth without feeling sad. Just because they do not adhere to the traditional rules of the tragedy (those are best told in miniseries, something Britain loves and the Americans seem less keen on) does not mean that they are incapable of dealing with death, illness, alienation, adandonment, etc. I once again point out that the two are marketing to different audiences. There is a market for animated tragedies in Japan, so they are made. There is less of a market here, so such stories do not get made as often. People want to watch a different type of story here, and I don't see why fans of tragedies should fault them for it. There is a market for heavy-on-the-sex shows for teens, for crime shows and a couple of well written (at least to start with) sci-fi shows. That's what gets made. When actual tragedies start making headway outside of HBO or Showtime, that's when the networks will make them. [/b] |
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JacobC
ANN Contributor
Posts: 3728 Location: SoCal |
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^ You did mention British shows, though. We may both speak English, but there's a major difference between artistic expression in America and in the U.K. I've seen Dr. Who, it's the shizz, but not the other one. Regardless, from what I've experienced of British TV (and theater, while we're at it!) they have far greater mastery over drama than we're beginning to approach. Melodrama too, which is a problem, but ignoring that, their dramas are better in general.
I would say that American shows are better with humor, but then there's Monty Python's Flying Circus, one of the funniest frickin' shows I've ever seen, and I have to hold on that. Still, they're legendary, and I don't remember many other British shows that tickled my funny bone half as well as Everybody Loves Raymond, Arrested Development, Futurama, etc., so eh. (Or Frasier and Whose Line?, but I mentioned those already. Yes, I have seen the British Whose Line? They gave us the idea, but it's not nearly as funny. A lot of that is probably Drew.) On the note of anime, I do think that they have both the USA and UK beat on drama AND melodrama, (maybe one comes with the other?) Nothing screams melodrama quite like Elfen Lied or Kanon but at the same time, thick gut-gripping drama that doesn't resort to cheap blows is even found a-plenty in Japanese...kids' shows. I mean, Digimon hit home with more emotional honesty on a regular basis than CSI or Numbers or a plethora of other cheap "adult dramas" on TV. And that's Digimon! Never mind the dozens of other anime that are a lot better. Still, for all the good gut-wrenching anime, there is an awful lot of cheeeeeeeese to accompany it. (Black Cat, oh gosh, Black Cat...) Comedically speaking, I can't say anime is more or less funnier than American entertainment, because honestly, most of it's lost in translation. I've gotten more used to Japanese humor and find it funnier the more I know about their culture, but I had to groove into it, though. Comedy anime is still pretty alienating to a lot of people, with few exceptions. I always start newbies out on drama titles. (Okay, I ALWAYS start newbies out on Fullmetal Alchemist, but whatever.) |
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Haterater
 Posts: 1727 |
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I just wish that more American shows are able to finish their stories. I hate when I start watching a show, ratings go down, and "The Powers That Be" want to cancel them. Pushing Daisies was such a great treasure for me and it pains me that they are canceling it when it has so much potential. I liked how it flowed and everything, being able to be continuing and episodic at the same time. But low ratings, you're gone! It shouldn't be that way.
I would like more American cartoons to be more "serious" like how Gargoyles was. Kidos would like the action, but the more "understanding" and adult fans would get the themes more. Or just more shows in general to have more mature themes for older viewers that doesn't have to be comedy like Family Guy. I also would like to see at least a more focus on openings as well, or at least that one song that helps connect the show. I see it as helping the show and that artist. Helps for anime, it helps American shows as well. Best I remember is Grey's Anatomy with that "How to save a life" song. Sure it helped both sides well. |
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Charred Knight
 Posts: 3085 |
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Here's something I really think Western TV shows do better than anime
Show people as actual friends. I mean in anime their is no difference between teammates in military shows, and guys who hang out together in school. Probably the best example is Lelouch and Suzaku who to put it bluntly look like they have nothing in common and when they are together never come off as friends. Even by the end of the story they come off more like homosexual lovers than friends this isn't helped by that one Clamp picture where Suzaku licks Lelouch's sword in lust. The best you can hope for is "Those two guys" the characters who basically sole purpose is to occasionally show up to hang out with the main character. Also I am going to say that American comedies generally do blow away Japanese anime comedies, just because Japanese anime comedies always try to hard. They are always reaching for a laugh instead of letting the laughs come naturally. |
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infinitebeauty
Posts: 75 |
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That's how it works though. Making tv shows is expensive, and it's counterproductive to keep spending money on shows that you aren't making money off of. It's the same with comic book series too, unfortunately. *still bitter about Blue Beetle's cancellation* So yes, as much as it sucks, it should absolutely be that way. Why do you think Tokyopop has slowed down its releases and stopped almost all of its OEL line? Because not enough people were/are interested. If American TV started making miniseries outside of HBO, Showtime, and the Discovery Channel, I would be thrilled to pieces. Miniseries are awesome. |
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