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Hey Answerfans!

Apparently, what the R1 companies are doing isn't what the fans want, because if it was... the fans would be BUYING IT! Sales wouldn't suck. The simple fact is, R1 companies aren't producing what people are willing to buy, but R1 companies are more terrified of actually having to change their failing business practices to provide what fans actually do want. It's easier to just point fingers and whine than it is to make a fundamental change in their business philosophy.

However, what I was trying to get across earlier is that it is just not feasible to put out such a product that will make fansubs “obsolete.” It’s requiring the product to compete with fast, free, (arguably) quality and actual digital copy.

You're assuming the consumer is honorable enough to pay for a product that can be obtained illegally with little or no legal risk provided it was offered in that fashion. History easily demonstrates that if people can obtain anime illegally for free without any worries, even if the product is inferior, they will do so rather than pay.

Not to mention saying the industry must adapt or die is selfish and pathetic.

That's like saying that someone can break in to your house and take all they want and that it is your responsibility to adapt to the fact they can take what they please or give in.

That's just stupid, you're essentially robbing the rights of others and telling them that since you can do so that they must now adjust or be removed.

Such an argument also demonstrates insane bias and an inability to actually meet in the middle or compromise, which demonstrates you are also unwilling to discuss the topic, but rather shove your stance down other peoples throats. If that's the case then you are done here, end of story. This is a discussion, not your soapbox to preach your stance towards others. This is the last warning.

You're assuming the consumer is honorable enough to pay for a product that can be obtained illegally with little or no legal risk provided it was offered in that fashion. History easily demonstrates that if people can obtain anime illegally for free without any worries, even if the product is inferior, they will do so rather than pay.

Not to mention saying the industry must adapt or die is selfish and pathetic. That's like saying that someone can break in to your house and take all they want and that it is your responsibility to adapt to the fact they can take what they please or give in. That's just stupid, you're essentially robbing the rights of others and telling them that since you can do so that they must now adjust or be removed..

So you claim, but there's evidence to the contrary also.

Welcome to the wonderful world of business, *ALL* industries must adapt or die. That's reality.

That's got to be one of the most idiotic analogies I've ever seen, I don't even know where to begin.

You mean like you're doing, right? Sure, let's see some good old censorship while you're at it, it just proves I'm right.

However, with translation before release, they can at least compete on the speed front. As for the digitcal copy, the anime industry is perfectly capable of releasing high quality online material.

They're certainly honorable enough to buy single songs by the millions off iTunes, aren't they? It isn't like you can't get any music you want for free any time you want it. This disproves your claim.

Sounds to me like you're still demanding the industry to adapt to what you want of them

Doesn't sound to me like you're looking to meet in the middle

Rather people are seeming to demand the industry be reduced to slavery.

I can understand their restraint though due to the costs involved and the risk it presents.

Is that all that unusual? Similar demands exist regardless of industry. Aside from that, is it right to say someone is "demanding" when they simply state what they are willing to accept. If the industry doesn't want to do it, they don't have to. But they'll lose the money from those who "demand" it their way, just like any other business will lose if it doesn't meet customer demands.

The middle is wherever the companies decide to meet at the end of the day in order to make whatever money they are able. Instead you expect the consumers to do what the businesses want even when they aren't meeting the expectations?

I am wondering how you define "slavery." I don't like my job much. I still do it because i get paid. I have the freedom to choose another job or to do nothing at all. Slaves have none of those freedoms. If these companies would rather make something other than anime, or ignore the demands of a large portion of their users because they think they are unreasonable, that's their prerogative. But it's also the prerogative of the consumers making those demands not to buy anything.

The risk of doing nothing has proven to be very high. No solution can be found in avoiding change.

It seems odd to me that you have argued that you don't think people are "honorable" enough to do the right thing, and yet you expect them to be more likely to do the right thing when their expectations are outright ignored. I suppose if the risks are really so high that they industry can't try anything else and if "it's not time to convert yet" that they can continue to ignore fansubs. That's about the only choice they have, unless they actually think stronger enforcement is going to encourage people to love the industry and start buying dvds.

Psycho 101 wrote:

If you still are asking that than you have not paid attention the other 12 pages here or any of the other plethora of related threads you yourself have posted in. You sir have your blinders well and truly on obviously.

Considering most shows are fansubbed before they're even licensed in R1, please explain how the fansubbers can be stealing from R1 licensees before they even exist?

Or are you just going to keep making the same tired, empty assertions?

Doesn't sound to me like you're looking to meet in the middle and that your "compromise" is simply reliant on demands that companies offer you what you get out of theft. Whether you like it or not they work hard and put a lot of man hours in to these productions and they deserve the right to be paid for working the same as you deserve that paycheck you get for doing your job. You're still dismissing the rights of others and I fail to see how that is not harmful.

You're right, they do need to make their product as close as possible to consumer demands. But "as possible" needs to have some accountability there, and so far that isn't being accounted for. Rather people are seeming to demand the industry be reduced to slavery. They get whatever they want for nothing, and that can be accomplished through no other means. While it may be stupid (and I'd watch it with the insults)

to demand people buy something completely different to what they want for the sake of business may not be the wisest method; consumers demanding a method of product production that an industry and the people whose livelihood depends on it can not survive on just because they don't feel like paying is equally as bad. You're still demonstrating no desire to meet in the middle at all, but rather still demanding the middle come to you.

Digital distribution is likely the future, but not in such an absolute way as you're demanding and the industries will still need to charge to the degree they can survive. I won't deny that some adaptation needs to occur, but I'm not entirely convinced we're in a position yet to convert. Personally, given the option I would still buy DVD's as I then get a solid hard copy for my money and I would prefer that option remain available. Of course, modern technology has opened other avenues and it would be wise of the distributors to explore those avenues. I can understand their restraint though due to the costs involved and the risk it presents.

I still think we're a ways off for true digital distribution on video files. I know I certainly don't have the anywhere near the bandwidth required nor do I expect it to be available in my area any time soon. At least in the United States, it would take a long time to install the necessary groundwork that would allow the true high-speed connections to the masses and the Government does not appear to be rushing ahead with it.

But can it do so without the expense of the other factors I listed? I don't see a way it can. As for speed, it would require licensing the show before it airs which would entail a fair amount of risk. Also, I would reasonably assume that this would undermine the Japanese TV broadcasting rights/contract.

Obviously if they just give it all away for free, we'll be seeing 50 episodes of those stick figures before long.

Working with them isn't practical either because US labor laws would require those fansubbers be paid since the industry is a for profit industry, therefore they wouldn't actually save money.

The best option for them would be to ignore the fansubbers and develop a competing product. It isn't the ideal situation, but given the alternatives it's the only practical answer.

You are right though. This has gone OT for long enough, so yeah, think I'll step out as well.