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This thread is prompted by the decision to not allow live comments for this article:

animenewsnetwork.com/interest/2018-02-09/recovery-of-an-mmo-junkie-director-causes-controversy-with-anti-semitic-tweets/.127409

This is Zac's rationale for closing live comments in the related discussion thread:

Quote:

In order to give our moderators a break, we're closing live comments for this piece. If you have feedback on the article, please send it to [email protected]. We'll be checking that email all weekend.

Thanks for your understanding.

First, let me say I completely understand why ANN would go this route. The chances of that thread turning into a noxious poop-storm are easily approaching 100%. However, there is a frustration at not being able to post a live comment about the issue.

Note to any poster who may decide to post in this thread PLEASE MAKE NO COMMENT ABOUT THE ISSUES RAISED IN THE ARTICLE. That's not what this thread is about and I don't want it getting locked because people are using it as a surrogate for the locked thread. Believe me, it's taking all my inner discipline not to make comments on the material itself, but like I say, that is not the purpose of this thread.

So, I understand the decision. But the rationale of wanting to give the moderators a break suggests that ANN currently does not have enough of them to police the site AND a thread that gives every indication of needing extra patrolling.

So one of my questions is... will ANN be taking on more moderators to avoid needing to close off live comments in the future? If not, then I would suggest it refrain from running articles like this. There is nothing more frustrating than wanting to comment and not being able to live and in public. In my almost 9 years of posting at ANN I don't think I've ever wanted to comment on an article more than this one.

That article is one of the most powerful ones I've ever read here. Most anime/manga related "news" is ephemera with no real lasting impact. This article hits and it hits hard. Much love to Rebecca Silverman.

Last edited by Tempest on Fri Feb 09, 2018 9:48 pm; edited 2 times in total

The issue wasn't one of resources.

Rather, we suspected that this thread would invariably end up filled with stupidity, and we simply did not want our moderators to have to deal with that kind of crap.

While I'm certain you, and most of our readers would have contributed nicely to the conversation, there are others would would have either made hateful comments, or made very ignorant comments defending some sort of principal they don't fully understand. This isn't the first time we've pre-emptively locked a talkback, and it unfortunately won't be the last time.

Even if we had a hundred moderators, we would have locked that thread.

-t

I can't say what Zac meant exactly when he said giving the mods a break. He did not mention it to us ahead of time and I won't speak for him. He can answer himself if he so chooses. We were given heads up by Lynzee in regards to the article coming out as she figured we'd appreciate it. Which we did.

I doubt the actual amount of moderators here played a part. My best GUESS regarding Zac's decision is not that we don't have enough mods to keep an eye on the thread, but rather the topic itself is simply very sensitive and, as you already said yourself, the likelihood of it going down the shitter is probably 99.8%. Plus it probably would have gone down the toilet very quickly. Probably too quickly for a mod to notice or stop it from going to pure hell in the blink of eye. The risk vs reward of leaving it open for comments was probably just too skewed. Not to mention threads like that are ones that often wind up getting people not just simply moderated, but straight up banned for the things they might say.

I would add that in the past several months we have been inundated with hot button topic after hot button topic. We have had a near endless stream of gigantic shit storm threads one right another with users causing quite the fuss. Every time 1 or 2 of such threads end another 1 or 2 come to life. I can't personally think of a time where there were so many right after each other at ANN. Normally there seems to be a break in between such threads for the mods and staff to grab a breather. Not so much as of late. Just constant vitriol and internet rage as of late.

This is just my best guess. I agree it is a very well done article and having thoughtful discussion on it would be nice. I however will be perfectly honest and say that as a mod I am not that upset at not having to wade through what could be some of the most disgusting and soul hurting comments that a thread is likely to produce.

Edit - Nevermind. Wasted all that time typing up and rewording my response only to have Tempest beat me by 1 minute.

Blood- wrote:

If not, then I would suggest it refrain from running articles like this. There is nothing more frustrating than wanting to comment and not being able to live and in public. In my almost 9 years of posting at ANN I don't think I've ever wanted to comment on an article more than this one.

Newspapers existed for a really long time without comment sections, Blood-. To suggest that I shouldn't have written this article because you can't write your feelings about it on ANN, but could a gazillion other places on the internet, is frankly insulting.

@ octopodpie - One of the advantages of a website over a printed newspaper is the fact that readers have the option of commenting immediately on something they've read about. Considering that the traditional newspaper industry has been in dire straits in recent years and online publishing has exploded, I'm not sure citing their way of doing things ranks is particularly relevant. But even newspapers offer a public "letters to the editor" section.

A lot of people who would have had very germane and supportive things to say about your article and about Rebecca Silverman's views and experience are going to be denied a live, public forum to do so thanks to the presumptive actions of a few. I think that's a shame.

I think articles like yours should be written and posters should be allowed to comment on them. It's immensely frustrating not to be able to do so. So I would rather not read something that makes my blood boil and not have any avenue to publicly comment on it on a site that normally affords me that option.

I am a customer of this site - a site where Tempest has felt enough financial pressure recently to publicly call for more paying subscribers - of which I am one of long-standing - and I am registering my opinion. I have to say I find your lack of professionalism when it comes to customer relations really irritating. You seem to think of this site as some sort of blog that exists to offer you a writing platform and for whom the views of those whose presence here contributes to keeping it afloat don't matter. It's a lousy attitude and one that I find insulting.

I find your view, regardless of how you dress it up, extremely self-centered and your questioning of my professionalism laughable, but sure. I think my journalistic duty to the site as nothing more than a blog.

There's a feedback email that serves the letter to the editor purpose and people are using it to send supportive messages. This isn't about that, you're upset that other readers won't see whatever your take is.

How is my characterization of your abysmal customer relation skills "laughable"? In your two posts so far you have amply demonstrated my observation is true. ANN is a business that depends on customers to stay afloat. It is customers like me that generate the income that pays you for your reviews and articles and pays the overhead to keep this website in existence.

This forum is specifically designed for customers to register either their praise or their criticisms over ANN's editorial content and/or policies. Smart businesses offer such a mechanism to find out what their customers are thinking. What they do with that information is up to them.

It is axiomatic in good customer relations that you never argue or be rude with a customer. It is doubly axiomatic that you don't do anything that actually INCREASES their original irritation/frustration. Everybody knows that when dealing with a customer you put on a blandly polite expression and try to defuse the situation. Note that doesn't mean being a push-over or agreeing with everything. You may be thinking in your head, "You are a total unreasonable dickhead" but what comes out of your mouth is, "I'm sorry you feel that way, sir/ma'am, but that's company policy and I'm not in a position to change it."

Reading an article in a printed medium is a static experience. You read it, but you have no method of instantly commenting on it or reading the comments of others. What sites like ANN offer is a dynamic - and I would say superior - experience in that you can read content and them comment on it and read the comments of others. That's one of the experiences that keeps me, and I'm sure others, coming back.

So I don't think it's all that unusual that somebody - in this case me - is frustrated when that experience is not offered. As I said in my original post, I get why it was done, but I don't like it. No doubt others disagree. There are people who are more than happy just to read something and leave it at that. I'm not like that and I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting to comment and read the comments of others.

ANN handled this badly. A few posters were allowed to comment before Zac cut off the thread and articulated a rationale that was then dismissed by Tempest and another rationale put in its place. That doesn't make ANN look good.

Not that I advocate cutting off commentary right from the get go, but if it has to be done, then it should be done right from the very first post so that a situation where some posters who get under the wire get their say but nobody else does is avoided.

Naturally, you take the most uncharitable view of why I am frustrated at not being able to comment. Yep, nothing says "excellent customer relations service" like accusing a customer of having a base reason for his or her complaint. Gosh, were did I get the wacky idea that you are unprofessional?

Since you don't have the insight or open-mindedness to actually spend two seconds trying to think of how I actually feel, let me spell it out for you:

The article enraged me and then reading the section on Rebecca Silverman brought me to tears. I was so profoundly touched by that stuff that I wanted to share what I had to say IN PUBLIC and read what others had to say, as well. Post at ANN long enough and you start to feel like it's a community you belong to and I wanted to hear from other people in my community.

But yeah, please persist in your smug arrogance that you know what I'm about and please continue to display the AWESOME customer relations skills you clearly possess. Rolling Eyes

By the way, choking off discussion of the article also means that fewer readers are going to see it. And all because ANN doesn't want to deal with x number of crappy comments. A pretty good victory for the anti-Semites, I'd say.

I've been more than charitable to someone who suggested that if they cannot interact with media the way they want, the feelings of a marginalized group should be ignored entirely. I don't think you understand the weight of what you said when you wrote that, and how it belittles Rebecca's experience, that this story shouldn't have been run because you, personally, cannot comment on it, and you can't seem to grasp how self-centered that suggestion is or why I would react defensively to it.

You also seem to keep falling back on how "I paid x monetary amount" as some sort of rationale for that. I get it, but you don't seem to understand the purpose of journalism in the slightest. It's true that ANN requires money to function, but journalism should never be beholden to the demands of paying customers and I strongly believe that.

Journalism is a public service and this story is for the public good regardless of whether they pay the site no money or thousands of dollars. Information for the betterment of the anime community, or any community shouldn't have a price tag and the very idea of "I get to say how you do this because money or everyone else doesn't get access" is atrocious.

But I, and the rest of the staff have heard you loud and clear about how important you feel comment sections are and your status as a paying customer.

No, you are the one who doesn't understand the purpose of journalism, apparently. A real journalist would want an important story disseminated as widely as possible. A real journalist would not be happy that an important story is going to sink into oblivion especially because the only reason it is doing so is that the place that pubished it can't be bothered to deal with negative comments... even though it has the resources to do so. Just too much trouble, I guess. Rolling Eyes

I'm done with you. You clearly don't have no desire to try and understand where I am coming from or to do anything but cast my frustrations in the most negative light possible. Bravo fo you, you're a real credit to the ANN team. Please hurry and write another article that we won't be able to comment on so that it can sink out of sight quickly, too. Such a grand use of your time, isn't it?

Blood- wrote:

No, you

This is literally why you're always on the precipice of being banned, bud. You got your answer plenty of posts ago but if you want to keep hurling abuse at me on a Saturday afternoon, that's cool. I've left the thread open in case any other of the readers have a similar opinion.

Whatever. I came to this forum to lodge a legitimate concern and I did it in a polite way. All I've gotten from you is crappy customer relation service and an impugning of my motives. If pointing out your incompetence gets me banned, so be it.

You have not pointed out anything politely in the slightest. If you get banned it's because of your own constant inflated ego and self importance Blood. You're the first to always cry foul or try to bully your vies across when you don't have the chance to sit and rant and make sure everyone can hear what you have to say. Yet when someone shows the first sign of that same behavior, especially towards you, you're the first to complain about that user. Being a subscriber also does not mean squat when it comes to conduct here, nor does it offer a user carte blanche to act however they want. That's akin to going to a grocery store and telling the staff there you can act however you want in the store simply because you shop there. No you can't.

You asked a question, it was answered by Tempest, and at this point you're simply being condescending and a bully towards Lynzee. So I'm locking this up. If you want to comment on the article so badly an avenue was provided to you and everyone else.

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