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NEWS: Kyoto Animation Streams 3rd Beyond the Boundary: Idol Trial Short


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CrowLia



Joined: 24 Feb 2012
Posts: 5505
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 9:12 pm Reply with quote
True, Amachan's gravure photos can't compare to Hiroomi's 7 minutes of nude, but there aren't that many girl-oriented shows to compare with to begin with, especially were KyoAni is concerned. Not to mention this short isn't even "oficially" part of the series, so it puzzles me someone decides to drop it based on a 7 minute extra that has nothing to do with series's plot.
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Kaioshin_Sama



Joined: 05 Feb 2005
Posts: 1215
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:55 pm Reply with quote
So mind-numbingly vapid and directly on the nose, as expected of Kyoani.
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Merida



Joined: 21 Feb 2012
Posts: 1945
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:20 am Reply with quote
The sheer predictability of some people's comments here is almost reassuring in these uncertain times.

I (predictably) love it, btw. Wink
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Rivailloli



Joined: 05 Jun 2013
Posts: 562
Location: Virginia
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:35 am Reply with quote
strawberry-kun wrote:
That lowered my motivation to finish the show. I'd rather they keep the manservice contained to their fujoshi oriented series.


Does an animated character make you that insecure about yourself?
It's not even a part of the main series, it's a seven minute short outside of it. Lol.
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Heinzendegger



Joined: 22 Jun 2012
Posts: 321
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 1:21 pm Reply with quote
That insecurity ad-hominem attack is what you girls always boil down to use.
However, in your hypocritic bullshit, you forgot that it's still women that complain the most about sexualization in general.

And you're using totally wrong examples. What they did here is like if Free (or any female orientated series) had only VERY tame male service, usually fully clothed, or at least muscle details left out, then all of a sudden, an episode focusing 5 minutes on a naked, very carefully drawn girl, her ass in our face and numerous sexual poses, whereas we'd never seen anything close to it from any guys.
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musouka



Joined: 09 Sep 2003
Posts: 707
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 1:43 pm Reply with quote
Heinzendegger wrote:
Well yeah.
Males can go fudge out, girls aren't for sexualizing, it's guys where it's at.
Kyoani has finally come into the open with that opinion.


You act as though there's something wrong with that.
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strawberry-kun



Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 301
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:26 pm Reply with quote
Rivailloli wrote:

Does an animated character make you that insecure about yourself?
It's not even a part of the main series, it's a seven minute short outside of it. Lol.

It has nothing to do with insecurity. It's just something that I'd rather never see. I cringed while I watched the short. 

Someone doesn't seem to be able to deal with others opinions. I may be complaining, but I've at least been civil.

Also:

Heinzendegger wrote:
And you're using totally wrong examples. What they did here is like if Free (or any female orientated series) had only VERY tame male service, usually fully clothed, or at least muscle details left out, then all of a sudden, an episode focusing 5 minutes on a naked, very carefully drawn girl, her ass in our face and numerous sexual poses, whereas we'd never seen anything close to it from any guys.

This. That's what I was getting at earlier.


Last edited by strawberry-kun on Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:34 pm; edited 1 time in total
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musouka



Joined: 09 Sep 2003
Posts: 707
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:31 pm Reply with quote
strawberry-kun wrote:
It has nothing to do with insecurity. It's just something that I'd rather never see. I cringed while I watched the short.


Would you have cringed if it was one of the girls instead? If not, then it might be a good idea to examine that reaction from the perspective of women who are confronted with that sort of thing regularly in many of the anime they consume.
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strawberry-kun



Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 301
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:41 pm Reply with quote
musouka wrote:
Would you have cringed if it was one of the girls instead? If not, then it might be a good idea to examine that reaction from the perspective of women who are confronted with that sort of thing regularly in many of the anime they consume.

Nope, I wouldn't have. I know female fans have to put up with a lot of that kind of stuff. I'm not opposed to the creation of more female oriented shows like Free! There's admittedly a lot of imbalance in the industry. I just don't want to see such a high degree of manservice in an otaku oriented show just as I wouldn't expect otaku oriented fanservice in shows aimed at women. Beyond the Boundary isn't even a fanservice show and hasn't shown anywhere near as much skin anywhere else except this short.
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Rivailloli



Joined: 05 Jun 2013
Posts: 562
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:10 pm Reply with quote
Heinzendegger wrote:
That insecurity ad-hominem attack is what you girls always boil down to use.
However, in your hypocritic bullshit, you forgot that it's still women that complain the most about sexualization in general.


I'm not a girl. Thanks though. Also, last I checked, most women complain about skeevy, fanservice that objectifies women. Not all fanservice in general. I also rarely see women in forums throwing a fit over something as dumb as a seven minute short that isn't even included in the series.
Heinzendegger wrote:

And you're using totally wrong examples. What they did here is like if Free (or any female orientated series) had only VERY tame male service, usually fully clothed, or at least muscle details left out, then all of a sudden, an episode focusing 5 minutes on a naked, very carefully drawn girl, her ass in our face and numerous sexual poses, whereas we'd never seen anything close to it from any guys.


It's a short, not an actual episode in the anime, and KnK has had plenty of fanservice aimed at men already within it with detailed bodies, so can it.

strawberry-kun wrote:
Beyond the Boundary isn't even a fanservice show and hasn't shown anywhere near as much skin anywhere else except this short.


This is laughable, cause I've seen plenty of the skin of the sister of this guy. Are you sure we're watching the same show? I know I saw quite a bit of skin of Mitsuki especially when she was sprawled out basically naked on the glasses frame, there was also an episode with them in the showers, and there was an episode where she hung around in a bathing suit. Also, I seem to remember Akkey's mom tits mom wearing a rather revealing outfit, not completely nude, but pretty close.

Oh yeah, sure, it's not seven minutes straight of fanservice, but there is plenty for men still in it and it's funny how you try to say it isn't actually there.
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Heinzendegger



Joined: 22 Jun 2012
Posts: 321
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:23 pm Reply with quote
Rivailloli, it is an objective fact that the girls hardly showed any skin.
It can't be even compared to the level Hiroomi got in the special, not to mention the details.
The closest that came to fanservice was Akkey's mom, but really, none of the others were sexual, or explicit.
There isn't "plenty for men", there is hardly any little bit even.

Get your eyes or sex drive fixed.
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musouka



Joined: 09 Sep 2003
Posts: 707
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:24 pm Reply with quote
strawberry-kun wrote:
Nope, I wouldn't have. I know female fans have to put up with a lot of that kind of stuff. I'm not opposed to the creation of more female oriented shows like Free! There's admittedly a lot of imbalance in the industry. I just don't want to see such a high degree of manservice in an otaku oriented show just as I wouldn't expect otaku oriented fanservice in shows aimed at women. Beyond the Boundary isn't even a fanservice show and hasn't shown anywhere near as much skin anywhere else except this short.


Two things.

1) The assumption that Kyoukai no Kanata is an "otaku-oriented" show. KyoAni usually goes on record as saying they make shows for "everyone" and while I might not personally agree either, I don't think it's as simple as saying, "you girls get Free!, we get everything else in the catalog."

2) The assumption that what was in the short was supposed to count as "fanservice" in the first place. Look at the girls' reactions. Did they look titillated or excited by what Hiroomi was doing? Showcasing male nudity as "weird" and "funny" is something that shows up in a ton of series. The fact that Hiroomi is well-built and not ugly in no way negates the fact that the entire joke of the sequence is "lol he has a penis and penises are gross lololol".
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strawberry-kun



Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 301
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:46 pm Reply with quote
Rivailloli wrote:
I also rarely see women in forums throwing a fit over something as dumb as a seven minute short that isn't even included in the series.


How many shows aimed at women have a 7 minute short of a girl in the series running around with barely any clothes on? I'm going to guess none.

Rivailloli wrote:
This is laughable, cause I've seen plenty of the skin of the sister of this guy. Are you sure we're watching the same show? I know I saw quite a bit of skin of Mitsuki especially when she was sprawled out basically naked on the glasses frame, there was also an episode with them in the showers, and there was an episode where she hung around in a bathing suit. Also, I seem to remember Akkey's mom tits mom wearing a rather revealing outfit, not completely nude, but pretty close.

Oh yeah, sure, it's not seven minutes straight of fanservice, but there is plenty for men still in it and it's funny how you try to say it isn't actually there.

I never said that there was no fanservice. I said that it's not a fanservice show. Highschool DxD is a fanservice show. Strike Witches is a fanservice show. Free! is a fanservice show. Beyond the Boundary is not. You even admitted that there's nothing near as ridiculous as the 7 minutes of nudity in this video which was exactly my point.

musouka wrote:


Two things.

1) The assumption that Kyoukai no Kanata is an "otaku-oriented" show. KyoAni usually goes on record as saying they make shows for "everyone" and while I might not personally agree either, I don't think it's as simple as saying, "you girls get Free!, we get everything else in the catalog."


Like I said, I'm not opposed to KyoAni or whoever making more female oriented shows. Free! was a huge success, so you'll likely get more. It's only an opinion I guess, but personally, everything about Beyond the Boundary screams otaku show to me. And, yeah, I don't buy that they make shows for everyone. At all. There's always demographics.

musouka wrote:
2) The assumption that what was in the short was supposed to count as "fanservice" in the first place. Look at the girls' reactions. Did they look titillated or excited by what Hiroomi was doing? Showcasing male nudity as "weird" and "funny" is something that shows up in a ton of series. The fact that Hiroomi is well-built and not ugly in no way negates the fact that the entire joke of the sequence is "lol he has a penis and penises are gross lololol".


Are you really trying to make the argument that that wasn't fanservice? I don't mean any offense, but I'm not even going to dignify that with a response.
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musouka



Joined: 09 Sep 2003
Posts: 707
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:58 pm Reply with quote
strawberry-kun wrote:
Like I said, I'm not opposed to KyoAni or whoever making more female oriented shows. Free! was a huge success, so you'll likely get more. It's only an opinion I guess, but personally, everything about Beyond the Boundary screams otaku show to me. And, yeah, I don't buy that they make shows for everyone. At all. There's always demographics.


My point is that it's not necessarily "either/or". KyoAni's shows are no longer adaptations that we can easily point to as being clearly for one demographic or the other because of the "magazine it ran in" or the "label it was published under".

strawberry-kun wrote:
Are you really trying to make the argument that that wasn't fanservice? I don't mean any offense, but I'm not even going to dignify that with a response.


Are you trying to make the argument that any sort of nudity is fanservice?
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Heinzendegger



Joined: 22 Jun 2012
Posts: 321
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 4:01 pm Reply with quote
musouka wrote:


Are you trying to make the argument that any sort of nudity is fanservice?


Not any kind of nudity is fanservice.
See Mirai and Ai in the shower scene? Nude, but camera is cut off above the ass so that nothing explicit is shown, and the bodies are drawn without much detail, tone or shadowing so that it isn't erotic.
However this special, now this is pure, blatant, maximum fanservice. As simple as that. You can take the angles and the poses as a measure if you wish.
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