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INTEREST: 'Far From Perfect': Fans Recount Unwanted Affection from Voice Actor Vic Mignogna


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CrowLia



Joined: 24 Feb 2012
Posts: 5505
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 5:26 am Reply with quote
Dewey Donedidit wrote:


It sounds like you just want him to come out and say he wont sign them because it's against his religion. He's obviously trying to be polite to the people who want him to sign stuff and let them down more gently than saying it's against his views which might hurt them or cause a scene.



I don't think a guy who forces conventions to let him hold religious services during his panels or sells his Christian music at the same cons and told a Jewish fan that he could change his religion is particularly concerned about hurting people's feelings with his religion. And you completely ignored the part where he lied about CLAMP themselves telling him "Fai from TRC isn't gay" to support his religious views

Quote:
Where else would he do that?


Uhhh a public apology, for example? Like, directed at the general audience and specially at the people he hurt instead of a room full of fans who would just coo and clap at every word he said no matter what? It's not like he purposefully released his speech -he could've uploaded it on his twitter or post an actual apology letter unlike the drivel he tweeted when this first started-, someone recorded it and posted it in his fanclub facebook group. In principle, this apology is directed at none of the people he hurt because none of them were present in that room. Which makes it seem even less sincere
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xchampion



Joined: 21 Jan 2009
Posts: 370
Location: Idaho Falls, Idaho
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:47 pm Reply with quote
CrowLia wrote:


Uhhh a public apology, for example? Like, directed at the general audience and specially at the people he hurt instead of a room full of fans who would just coo and clap at every word he said no matter what? It's not like he purposefully released his speech -he could've uploaded it on his twitter or post an actual apology letter unlike the drivel he tweeted when this first started-, someone recorded it and posted it in his fanclub facebook group. In principle, this apology is directed at none of the people he hurt because none of them were present in that room. Which makes it seem even less sincere


You know that wouldn't have made a difference right? If he released his apology publicly on twitter instead of publicly at a panel the result would have been the same. The same people would be calling it fake and coerced and that he didn't really mean. Everyone has pretty much chosen sides in the court of public opinion. At this point we just have to wait to see what happens. On twitter Monica Rial hinted that she had physical evidence of abuse by Vic but she was not at liberty to reveal it yet. Her bfiance then went on twitter that he knows 4 people who were abused by Vic. Now whether if it's more of the same it will be awhile before we find out.
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Seif



Joined: 16 Nov 2004
Posts: 457
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:03 pm Reply with quote
I'm starting to wonder if there would ever be enough first hand accounts to convince these people. It doesn't matter if there are dozens of people coming forward saying the incidents occurred directly to them; if they don't have a signed photo of Vic playing grabass it's all hearsay.
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MorwenLaicoriel



Joined: 26 Feb 2006
Posts: 1617
Location: Colorado
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:11 pm Reply with quote
Dewey Donedidit wrote:

It sounds like you just want him to come out and say he wont sign them because it's against his religion. He's obviously trying to be polite to the people who want him to sign stuff and let them down more gently than saying it's against his views which might hurt them or cause a scene.


Frankly, as a bisexual Christian, I would prefer it. His "not canon" excuse is selectively applied (he signs fan art, Fai is canonically gay, etc), so it's disingenuous, and it also implies that a same-sex relationship is less valid than an opposite-sex one, and that is honestly MORE hurtful in my eyes than simply just being honest that you have a religious objection--which also implies a lack of validity, but at least it's honest about why he may think that and doesn't imply that he's speaking with any authority as someone involved with the production of the anime in some small way.

While I can't say for sure what his motivations are, his hesitance to attribute it to his faith when he's so vocal about his faith otherwise honestly comes across more like saving face--the same self-centered sort of attitude that I think is reflected in his apologies. And if his motivation is really to avoid hurting LGBT fans, it's not working.
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Seif



Joined: 16 Nov 2004
Posts: 457
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:20 pm Reply with quote
Kadmos1 wrote:


The following are 23 other VA that have reacted to the #kickvic, #MeToo, or a similar tweet type of tweet. I base this off of tweets commenting about that tweet, a re-tweet, or a liked tweet. These are from activities I saw on their accounts between 1/25 and current. Obviously, there are a lot more VA out there that have responded in some manner:

Michelle Rojas, Alex Moore, Aaron Roberts, Alejandro Saab, Corina Boettger, Neil Kaplan, Tara Jayne Sands, Cassandra Lee Morris, Kellen Goff, Carrie Keranen, Chris Sabat, Amber Lee Connors, Chris Hackney, Sarah Anne Williams, Mary Elizabeth McGlynn, Steve Blum, Roger Craig Smith, Laura Bailey, Marianne Miller, Danielle McRae, David Wald, Greg Ayres, and Josh Grelle.


We can add Tatum and Neil Kaplan to that list.
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Arking



Joined: 31 Jan 2019
Posts: 10
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:39 pm Reply with quote
CrowLia wrote:


I don't think a guy who forces conventions to let him hold religious services during his panels or sells his Christian music at the same cons


Pretty sure it's been well stated that this isn't a forced situation but one that was born out of financial arrangements for conventions willing to allow it for a below standard price. I can see how it can be interpreted as him pushing the issue, sure. As someone who's hired talent to come in for a major event I do know theres extra fees you pay for exclusivity, set numbers, signings etc but they are all optional fees, never forced though it sure feels like a shakedown.
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shabu shabu



Joined: 25 Jan 2019
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Location: Tokyo
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:46 pm Reply with quote
This topic has been an interesting look into the American voice acting scene. From what I can tell, American voice actors having fanclubs is unusual and strange? It's actually really common in Japan where almost every voice actor has a fan page and club, often times run by themselves or more likely their management. It is also usually the fans who are criticized for being too aggressive towards the actors with sudden touching. Hugging is not really a big thing in Japan, but I always heard it was extremely common in the west.
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all-tsun-and-no-dere
ANN Reviewer


Joined: 06 Jul 2015
Posts: 606
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:21 pm Reply with quote
shabu shabu wrote:
This topic has been an interesting look into the American voice acting scene. From what I can tell, American voice actors having fanclubs is unusual and strange? It's actually really common in Japan where almost every voice actor has a fan page and club, often times run by themselves or more likely their management. It is also usually the fans who are criticized for being too aggressive towards the actors with sudden touching. Hugging is not really a big thing in Japan, but I always heard it was extremely common in the west.


American voice acting fandom does operate very differently from Japan, it's true. It's a niche within a niche - people who are not only fans of anime, but also big enough fans of dubs to listen closely and pay attention to who voices who. Anime dubbing is considered relatively low-tier on the voiceover pay scale, and other specialties, including video games, pay better but the fandom pays little attention to the voice actors. Ironically, the better an actor is doing, the less you'll probably hear about them.

The US is generally a more touch-oriented culture in Japan, but not as much as some places, and everyone has their own comfort zones and boundaries. This especially varies because our country is so big and regionally and culturally diverse, so in one part of the country hugs may be a normal greeting, while in others it would be strange and invasive. Due to socialization, men also tend to view touch as more sexual, and it's not uncommon for men in positions of power to try to take advantage of ambiguous boundaries to touch women who have no interest in being touched.
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SailorTralfamadore



Joined: 25 Feb 2014
Posts: 499
Location: Keep Austin Weeb
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:38 pm Reply with quote
Psycho 101 wrote:
Plus you also work in "the business" so many of these VA's are just normal people to you guys. The same way as Hollywood celebs often simply see other celebs as just people as they work with them and interact with them per their job. So while I may not agree with such emulation and "worship" I do understand why so many have it for VA's. I do think the level of some, as with Vic and many of his Rangers, goes way beyond anything that is healthy though.


This is fair, I know that my position as a writer here does probably make these people seem more down-to-earth for me (although I have not actually met very many VAs in-person myself). I guess I was speaking from the vantage point that even before I started reviewing for ANN or working as an anime academic or anything, "voice actor fandom" was a thing I never quite got into, I was usually more of a fan of the people involved in directing or writing whatever show. So even on a more fundamental level I don't really get the appeal of VA fan clubs like Risembool Rangers. But I do understand that they are probably the closest people get to feeling like they "know" their favorite characters, since they have the closest "physical" resemblance to the characters via their voice. But I think even then, for me when it's just the voice it's that much easier for me to be reminded that this person is not their character, unlike live-action actors who obviously have a much greater physical resemblance to their characters. There's a removal there which makes it hard for me to understand the level of hero worship. Like other than their shared hair color, Vic is really obviously not Ed or Tamaki, lol.

This also is a reason I have an easier time continuing to watch things with bad people in it who are actors, and especially voice actors, vs. directors, writers, etc. It feels like they're less integral to the ways in which I appreciate a work. Like I'm not finding it as hard to watch stuff that Vic or Todd were in as other people are, because it's easy to forget they're there, but if the director of FMA or Ouran turned out to be a creep that would be something that would impact my appreciation of those shows on a deeper level, like how I can't really watch Woody Allen movies anymore without being reminded of everything awful about him (ofc in his case, he's also an actor in a lot of his movies and they're very personal statements, too).

That's all on me, though, and my particular ways I engage with art. I'd be curious to hear how other people parse this stuff.
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castro123



Joined: 30 May 2012
Posts: 4
PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:52 am Reply with quote
Hmm I am very skeptical becuase in this P.C era things get taken out of context a lot (this comment prob will), the hugs and kisses can go either way as someone adoring his younger fans in a more nurturing way (some people are very affectionate). Or as someone using his status to get and do things that are wrong.
This day and age a simple hand on the shoulder can lead to assault accusations so we might never know whats true. I just want people to not condemn the man till true evidence comes to light otherwise this can ruin lives. If it is found true then have at him with everything.
PS while his roles are good tbh i never liked him, kinda looks like an a*se so yeah dont call me a fanboy. More of a Dan Green fan.
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AtelierTohka



Joined: 05 Feb 2019
Posts: 3
PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:55 am Reply with quote
I'm not sure how well this will contribute to anything, but I'm going to take the opportunity to admit that I was ignorant of a lot of the things this man was doing, and if I'm being totally honest, I really wish I had known everything about this. Several years ago, like four or five years ago, a younger, more foolish me actually took to Twitter to defend him with regards to the petition to have him removed from the Free dub, and after learning about his long history of harassment now, I really wish I hadn't. All I had known about the criticisms pressed against him at the time was "he said he didn't like yaoi"(and I'm really not exaggerating about that, that was literally all I knew), and at the time, I had only known him as the voice of Junpei Iori, Edward Elric, and Kurz Weber. Boy, do I feel really embarrassed now thinking about all that in retrospect. Sexual harassment cases are something that I would really prefer to take seriously, primarily because I have spoken with women who had experiences with sexual assault in the past, it leaves a permanent effect on its victims, and I'm more aware of that fact now than I was before. Not something I want to take lightly. Needless to say, I'm not even going to bother defending this person anymore. I try to be wiser compared to how I used to be, and if I'm going to be wiser, then that means I can't play devil's advocate or contrarian when I become aware of hundreds of victims sharing their stories. I understand now just how serious the whole issue is. I regret that it took me this long, and I also regret feeding into the toxicity that this sort of thing can invite from the fanatics. I may very well still have much to learn in that regard. Also, addressing the issue of him being homophobic, there is another issue that I try to take more seriously as I've grown more aware of how serious an issue it truly is. Someone shouldn't be judged or looked at with disgust because of their sexual orientation. It just isn't okay. While I do believe in benefit of the doubt to a certain degree, that can't always be afforded, and trying to use a get out of jail free card by saying you have LGBT friends is not necessarily grounds for benefit of the doubt. If anything, it tends to come off more like an excuse, a flimsy one. If someone really is pro-LGBT, then they shouldn't have to say "some of my closest friends are LGBT" to prove it. That's just words, and what will really send a greater message is actions, and well, I don't know of anything the guy could've actually done to prove his case.

I don't know if I can look at Kurz Weber from Full Metal Panic the same way anymore, to be totally honest. o_o
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Ali07



Joined: 01 Jun 2014
Posts: 3333
Location: Victoria, Australia
PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 6:39 am Reply with quote
SailorTralfamadore wrote:
That's all on me, though, and my particular ways I engage with art. I'd be curious to hear how other people parse this stuff.

To be honest, it's not something that spoils my enjoyment. I still love Recovery of a MMO Junkie, and I remember the story around the director (I think) came out while I was still watching that show.

At the same time, the instances of coming across something like this is rare for me. Celebrity news isn't something I usually look up.
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Castien



Joined: 21 Oct 2013
Posts: 6
PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:33 pm Reply with quote
Okay, so, a few weeks before the story came out, I mentioned to some facebook friends that I don't like Vic. In fact, seeing his signature on a DVD fills me with a urge to burn it.



I've never stood in line for his autograph because my very first experience with him was enough to ruin any future appreciation for his work.

I was already high school age when I started going to conventions. After a few years, I was tired of going as a fan and started attending as volunteer staff, working registration lines, doing tech, and security for over 8 Southeast conventions in the past 15 years I've been a fan. Vic attended about 6 of those. I am not one of those people who makes waves. I was sexually harassed by a director at one convention, who trapped me alone and showed me his junk to try and sell the idea to have sex with him. I had one of the married hosts of Wasabi in Florida solicit me for sex at Anime Weekend Atlanta. I had a good laugh at them and walked away, reported it and moved on.



I'm an adult and was well into my 20's at the time, so I can handle idiocy. So when I say they didn't bother me with their weak nonsense, my opinion on Vic's behavior is on another level entirely, because his behavior is directed at CHILDREN. I tell people, even at a family friendly place like conventions and theme parks, there are always going to be creeps and bad people taking advantage of a disarming environment. Be cautious. Talk to people you trust about anything that doesn't seem quite right. MOST IMPORTANTLY, REPORT IT TO STAFF!!!

First of all, Vic is a diva.



He's HORRIBLE to staff. I've run panels for drunk voice actors more reasonable than him. Getting his way is more important than inconveniencing everyone in the process. He treats staff like human furniture or dogs, to the point where most of my regular conventions stopped asking him to come. More than once, events did not start on time because of him, and he didn't follow anything he was supposed to when hosting events. If he didn't get his way, he'd turn around and scream at people. So even without sexual allegations, I'd refuse to be a fan just from the unprofessional attitude.

Secondly, the inappropriate contact being currently reported isn't even scratching the surface. It's not just the Christian plugging he did to one guy. He was running a Sunday Worship with Vic service which warps the very nature of church in the first place. It wasn't about God at all, unless Vic thinks he's God. It was a sales opportunity and a chance to be adored by 200 underage girls that he would touch and fondle. Fans who wouldn't dare complain because they were bedazzled by his seductive Edward anime glitter.



Not a lot of them are mature enough to realize when a 40+ year old man is rubbing their 12-15 year old butts and/or breasts, it's inappropriate. Even more so, following them to hotel rooms or elevators and trying to get them to join his fan club or take his cell number for more "personal contact" got no few complaints from parents and minors. If an adult suggested that he might be going over the line, he acted all contrite and innocent. However, multiple young girls were removed from his fan club if they objected to his "affections" and it's wasn't just kissing and hugging, but more so along the lines of "grooming". A young lady once confided in me (when I said he was a creep in public) that she used to be his fan, but that he had insisted on taking a selfie where he shoved his face against her chest and then wanted her personal contact so he could "send her something just for her". She got the stranger danger vibe, because he seems to be so insistent that it had to be "their secret". That's probably the 50th time I had to hear something along that vein about him from a fan young enough to be MY kid at this point.

Maybe that's not enough to condemn him as a pedophile, but he knew exactly what he was doing and relied on the hero worship to keep his worse offenses under radar. He was told, repeatedly, that he was crossing the line. By staff, by parents, and by his own industry peers. His career should have been over a decade ago...



I don't care what his sycophantic fans say, most of them aren't mature enough to understand that people that are attractive and excessively nice to them one moment might be complete monsters and do worse things to them than kisses and hugs when there's no one there to save them. If a guy who uses his popularity to grope preteens is enough to raise some awareness, GREAT. I'd rather they learn to be cautious now than after another Ted Bundy.


Last edited by Castien on Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Alestal



Joined: 22 Apr 2005
Posts: 605
Location: Dallas, Texas
PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:58 pm Reply with quote
Castien wrote:

Secondly, the inappropriate contact being currently reported isn't even scratching the surface. It's not just the Christian plugging he did to one guy. He was running a Sunday Worship with Vic service which warps the very nature of church in the first place. It wasn't about God at all, unless Vic is God. It was a sales opportunity and a chance to be adored by 200 underage girls that he would touch and fondle. Fans who wouldn't dare complain because they were bedazzled by his seductive Edward anime glitter. Not a lot of them are mature enough to realize when a 40+ year old man is rubbing their 12-15 year old butts and/or breasts, it's inappropriate. Even more so, following them to hotel rooms or elevators and trying to get them to join his fan club or take his cell number for more "personal contact" got no few complaints from parents and minors. If an adult suggested that he might be going over the line, he acted all contrite and innocent. However, multiple young girls were removed from his fanclub if they objected to his "affections" and it's wasn't just kissing and hugging, but more so along the lines of "grooming". A young lady once confided in me (when I said he was a creep in public) that she used to be his fan, but that he had insisted on taking a selfie where he shoved his face against her chest and then wanted her personal contact so he could "send her something just for her". She got the stranger danger vibe, because he seems to be so insistent that it had to be "their secret". That's probably the 50th time I had to hear something along that vein about him from a fan young enough to be MY kid at this point.

Maybe that's not enough to condemn him as a pedophile, but he knew exactly what he was doing and relied on the hero worship to keep his worse offenses under radar. He was told, repeatedly, that he was crossing the line. By staff, by parents, and by his own industry peers. His career should have been over a decade ago and I don't care what his sycophantic fans say, most of them aren't mature enough to understand that people that are attractive and excessively nice to them might be complete monsters and do worse things to them than kisses and hugs when there's no one there to save them. If a guy who uses his popularity to grope preteens is enough to raise some awareness, GREAT. I'd rather they learn to be cautious now than after another Ted Bundy.


He was following people (more than once?) to their hotel rooms? As someone who has worked for 6 hotels and studied hospitality management, I can assure you that this would have been reported and recorded at some point.

It seems that his arrogance has made him a lot of enemies over the years. Though his behavior is clearly distasteful, some of it comes with the territory (a lot of mainstream anime is sexualized and does market towards a younger audience), and there needs to be evidence to support these claims. We have a legal system in place to deal with these matters.
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Castien



Joined: 21 Oct 2013
Posts: 6
PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:48 pm Reply with quote
Alestal wrote:
Though his behavior is clearly distasteful, some of it comes with the territory (a lot of mainstream anime is sexualized and does market towards a younger audience), and there needs to be evidence to support these claims. We have a legal system in place to deal with these matters.


I agree to some degree we've given a lot of passes on the adultish content, but a lot of it is clearly for young audiences. People who allow their kids to attend conventions without supervision need to be aware that stuff like this happens. Back in the 2000's there were a lot of serious, criminal things going on at anime conventions that changed the way we handle security now. Stalking was the least of it. The legal system does nothing if the victims don't want to report it. Staff needs to know, because if you don't want that person around, WE definitely don't.
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