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Funimation Comments on Streaming Metrics in Crunchyroll Press Release


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Gasero



Joined: 24 Jul 2009
Posts: 939
Location: USA
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 8:54 pm Reply with quote
I believe the proper response to this press release is: "Oh snap!"
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garfield15



Joined: 06 Apr 2009
Posts: 1525
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 9:02 pm Reply with quote
CR: Oh yeah, well yo mamma is so dumb, she thinks that the financial growth of a common market share with ad revenue can't stand up to a larger market!
Crowd: OHHHH SNAP! No he didn'!
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hissatsu01



Joined: 08 May 2006
Posts: 963
Location: NYC
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 9:30 pm Reply with quote
Can we now expect another press release from Crunchyroll to continue this pointless exercise in dick waving? Two "leaders" in the US anime market acting like 6 year olds.
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egoist



Joined: 20 Jun 2008
Posts: 7762
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 9:32 pm Reply with quote
I hope people won't start flaming the companies involved, as they always do. If they always do, why to hope, then? Let's hope not, in that case.

Mistakes happen, and the anime industry tend to keep things to themselves(specially profits), and it's always hard to calculate those things. CR's press release did at least make Funimation step forward and reveal something.
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Dark Elf Warrior



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 228
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 9:33 pm Reply with quote
This is going to sound dumb, but what was the article trying to say? For some reason it made no sense to me. Yet, like someone said, I felt like "Oh snap!" why is that? Can someone fill me in?
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Paploo



Joined: 21 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 9:35 pm Reply with quote
Dark Elf Warrior wrote:
This is going to sound dumb, but what was the article trying to say? For some reason it made no sense to me. Yet, like someone said, I felt like "Oh snap!" why is that? Can someone fill me in?


It's basically Funi pointing out that Crunchy Roll had their streaming numbers wrong, and that their numbers actually work out to around 55 million. And that's probably not taking into account Funi's revenue streams from TV broadcasts, merchandise and dvd sales.
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Megiddo



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 8360
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PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 9:36 pm Reply with quote
Dark Elf Warrior wrote:
This is going to sound dumb, but what was the article trying to say? For some reason it made no sense to me. Yet, like someone said, I felt like "Oh snap!" why is that? Can someone fill me in?

If I remember right, Crunchyroll stated in a press release that it had a million unique visitors last year whereas FUNimation only got 150,000 or something.

FUNimation was just pointing out that this little tidbit (which really should not have been in Crunchyroll's press release to begin with) is skewed heavily because they're only counting one of a multitude of websites that FUNimation currently uses to stream anime.
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Sailor S





PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 9:42 pm Reply with quote
Seeing as Funimation's parent company is a publicly traded one, getting them to reveal things is quite easy, actually.
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Greed1914



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 4498
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 9:45 pm Reply with quote
Sailor S wrote:
Seeing as Funimation's parent company is a publicly traded one, getting them to reveal things is quite easy, actually.


Yep. Navarre, like any public company has to file financial statements with the SEC that anyone can look through. Just hop on over to the SEC site and search the EDGAR database. I'll warn everyone that financial statements can be tricky, but there is a lot of information to be had. Sure it's not going to be absolutely everything, and probably isn't going to include Funi's viewing data for online streams, but the point is that it's not like they hide or anything.
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egoist



Joined: 20 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 9:48 pm Reply with quote
Did Funi reveal how much they've been making with streaming? Because that's what I meant, since that's this thread's subject.
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Greed1914



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 9:55 pm Reply with quote
egoist wrote:
Did Funi reveal how much they've been making with streaming? Because that's what I meant, since that's this thread's subject.


That gets a bit too specific for what is made available. Unless you see Funi's books, you probably won't get specific streaming revenue. From what I can gather from the article, this was more about CR saying that they were bigger than Funi, and Funi pointed out that they had flawed numbers.
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_V_



Joined: 13 Apr 2009
Posts: 619
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 10:01 pm Reply with quote
1 - FUNimation is right to point out that Crunchyroll's numbers are a bit exaggerated, if you factor in all the other details.

2 - Crunchyroll nearly destroyed the R1 North American DVD market, and it deserved to destroy it due to the utterly hapless response to "the interent" by the R1 companies.


Think about it: ADV, FUNimation, all the rest: they *had* the resources to expand onto the internet, but they didn't.

The R1 companies are living in a fantasy where "DVD is the primary medium by which people watch anime"


Okay, to spell it out:

*During the 1990's when the R1 market developed, you were all basically "a hobbyist's industry". A handful of hardcore collectors buying things for large prices.

*In the 2000's, anime tried to shift to pulling in "mainstream numbers", to permeate general pop culture...yet it retained the business model of a hobbyist's industry.

*the result was that it *turned back into* a hobbyist's industry in size.


Every single anime fan cannot possibly buy EVERY DVD. You act as if every single one of us is a hardcore collector.

This is specifically what caused the comics industry crash of 1993.

FUNimation: I *want* to watch your products legally, and online, for the price of some commercials. Why just earlier today, I watched "Hetalia" on your website.



If "online distribution isn't profitable"...HOW THE HECK DID CRUNCHYROLL DO SO WELL?

They did nothing wrong, you refused to advance with the times.


"We have to teach new fans that anime is meant to be watched on DVD"

1 - no it isn't.

2 - what are you going to do, set up summer training camps where we instruct noobs on how to watch things?


There is money in internet streaming. If you can't make a profit on it YET, its because you don't really seem to be trying hard enough.

YES you have better numbers than Crunchyroll, but the fact remains that DVD simply isn't the primary medium of anime anymore.

Having just watched Hetalia, legally on your website, for the price of watching a few ads (i.e. free, but now I want Doritos...)....why would I have ANY need to buy the DVDs now?
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Greed1914



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 4498
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 10:08 pm Reply with quote
_V_ wrote:
1 - FUNimation is right to point out that Crunchyroll's numbers are a bit exaggerated, if you factor in all the other details.

2 - Crunchyroll nearly destroyed the R1 North American DVD market, and it deserved to destroy it due to the utterly hapless response to "the interent" by the R1 companies.


Think about it: ADV, FUNimation, all the rest: they *had* the resources to expand onto the internet, but they didn't.

The R1 companies are living in a fantasy where "DVD is the primary medium by which people watch anime"


Okay, to spell it out:

*During the 1990's when the R1 market developed, you were all basically "a hobbyist's industry". A handful of hardcore collectors buying things for large prices.

*In the 2000's, anime tried to shift to pulling in "mainstream numbers", to permeate general pop culture...yet it retained the business model of a hobbyist's industry.

*the result was that it *turned back into* a hobbyist's industry in size.


Every single anime fan cannot possibly buy EVERY DVD. You act as if every single one of us is a hardcore collector.

This is specifically what caused the comics industry crash of 1993.

FUNimation: I *want* to watch your products legally, and online, for the price of some commercials. Why just earlier today, I watched "Hetalia" on your website.



If "online distribution isn't profitable"...HOW THE HECK DID CRUNCHYROLL DO SO WELL?

They did nothing wrong, you refused to advance with the times.


"We have to teach new fans that anime is meant to be watched on DVD"

1 - no it isn't.

2 - what are you going to do, set up summer training camps where we instruct noobs on how to watch things?


There is money in internet streaming. If you can't make a profit on it YET, its because you don't really seem to be trying hard enough.

YES you have better numbers than Crunchyroll, but the fact remains that DVD simply isn't the primary medium of anime anymore.

Having just watched Hetalia, legally on your website, for the price of watching a few ads (i.e. free, but now I want Doritos...)....why would I have ANY need to buy the DVDs now?


So they were right when they were charging people to watch fansubs that weren't even their own? Not to mention streaming shows that were licensed by R1 companies. Sure, the R1 companies should have been faster, but in no way did Crunchy Roll "deserve to destroy" the DVD market.
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agila61



Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 3213
Location: NE Ohio
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 10:08 pm Reply with quote
Greed1914 wrote:
egoist wrote:
Did Funi reveal how much they've been making with streaming? Because that's what I meant, since that's this thread's subject.


That gets a bit too specific for what is made available. Unless you see Funi's books, you probably won't get specific streaming revenue. From what I can gather from the article, this was more about CR saying that they were bigger than Funi, and Funi pointed out that they had flawed numbers.


First, the information in the annual report will include overall financial performance, but not proprietary-in-confidence information.

I noted at the time (at AnimeVice) that Crunchyroll was making an Apples and Oranges comparison, since Funimation streams over so many distinct channels ... and others had already made the point.

The best outcome for building the actual market audience outside of Japan would be for Crunchyroll to cross-stream Funimation content in the R1 market and gain rights to stream the same series directly into R4 and R2-ex-Japan markets.

Meanwhile a large number of series in any given series are not going to have immediate interest from R1 licensing houses, and they are going to be streamed one way or another - the only question is whether there will be a legit simulcast stream with reasonable video quality or just heavily compressed bootlegs hosted on free video sharing sites.
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Seif



Joined: 16 Nov 2004
Posts: 458
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 10:11 pm Reply with quote
In the words of Hans Landa

How fun!
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