Forum - View topicCharacters you think are overrated?
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Chiibi
 Posts: 4829 |
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Um YEP, that's why he has like six crying/ break-down scenes all through the series. That's why until Asuna insists he stay with her, he never stayed in a party since Sachi died. That's why he has to rely on other people for emotional comfort. That's why once you take those people away, his willpower completely disappears.
Okay, you're being either stupid or stubborn or both. Kirito's risked his life for every. single. one. of them. He watched over Asuna for hours as she slept to make sure nobody would kill her and she was touched by that. He continues to protect her and she just falls deeper. Girls fall in love with guys who are nice to them and put their safety first above their own. That's just what Kirito does; that's why girls like him. |
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ChibiKangaroo
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In SAO1, I recall one scene where he even showed a hint of real emotional disturbance, after Sachi died. The rest of SAO1 he was mostly a stoic badass. If you watch Accel World, you will see the immediate difference between Kirito and Haruyuki on that front. It will be like night and day. You will see Haru's internal thoughts, his lack of self-confidence, his fears. You will see it several times. You will see him cry many times. He was portrayed as a real boy, struggling with real problems of adolescence. For Kirito, reality was just an annoyance that barely touched him. Nearly everything for him was the idealized world where he was the unstoppable badass. Like I said, I did think that changed in SAO2 a bit where we do see Kirito's emotional struggles. That's why I've been mostly giving good grades to SAO2. However, the character as originally created did not have this depth. He was originally created as a pure gary stu, and I think it is possible that Kawahara learned a little bit after that first experience and moderated the character a bit.
So, like I said, he is an unstoppable badass so they fall in love with him. We are talking about the same thing here  We aren't talking about him going out on dates and learning about their personalities and wants and engaging in recreational activities with them. We are talking about him being a badass who saves them repeatedly, so therefore they just have to fall in love with this teenaged hunk.
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Touma
 Posts: 2651 Location: Colorado, USA |
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No, they did not. This certainly is an interesting thread. And I really do mean that. I am not being sarcastic. Since it is somewhat relevant to the topic of overrated characters, I am curious about what people think of the Mary Sue litmus test. It seems to be made so that writers can evaluate their new characters. Does it really have any value for rating an established character that was created by somebody else? Is there any consensus of opinion on the accuracy of the results? |
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ChibiKangaroo
Posts: 2941 |
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Yes they did. For almost all of them they just gave excuses as to why those things were okay.
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Bugnin
Posts: 575 |
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You're in denial. It boils down to this: A gary Stu character is perfect at everything, in every conceivable way. Even at his best, Kirito was not perfect. He makes bad decisions and fails on a personal level. His mistakes get people killed and nearly himself. There's nothing to dispute either of these facts. We can move on now to arguments that make sense. I could just as easily call Hariyuki a gary stu because Kuroyukihime falls in love with him before he ever says a word to her. If your standard for a gary stu is anything less than perfection (which by definition does not make it a gary stu), then literally every protagonist ever created is arguably a gary stu. It's become twisted from its actual intent into "that character from that popular series I don't happen to like." Hariyuki is no less a chick magnet than Kirito. It's just that he's a small fat slob so he comes off as less threatening to certain male readers. And thank god he doesn't have a sister. FYI, I really like Accel World, but Hariyuki is hardly some everyman that struggles through life like the average kid. Last edited by Bugnin on Thu Oct 09, 2014 3:18 pm; edited 5 times in total |
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Chiibi
Posts: 4829 |
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Then I suggest you rewatch the first series because he spends a good deal of time crying in girls' arms.
*facepalm* You said he "didn't do anything." "Unstoppable badass" doesn't equal "committment, kindness, or compassion." And he kind of DID go on small dates with a few of the girls. He accompanied Sillica for...three days I believe, he accompanied Liz; he DID get to know them and was courteous and chaste. And he's NOT "always unstoppable" anyway; he could not have won several battles without the aid of other players! I don't know how many times I've pointed this out.
............are you serious? Girls liking Kirito are WAY more believable in that case! Last edited by Chiibi on Thu Oct 09, 2014 3:18 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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ChibiKangaroo
Posts: 2941 |
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No. Garu Stu is not perfect at everything. Sometimes the author's fantasy does not involve perfection. Like I said before, the only thing required for the Gary Stu is that it is an extreme version of the author's avatar. It's usually not difficult to figure out what the author's fantasies in relation to that character are, and if the story and other characters are positioned in a way that appears to make them all subservient to those "author avatar" fantasies, then it is likely a Gary Stu. Kirito fits that bill for Kawahara. Done.
I don't recall a "good deal of time," but perhaps you can enlighten us to how extensive that "good deal of time" was.
Nope, again, you weren't paying attention to Accel World. She wasn't really in love with him at that point. She was using him because she believed he was the one who had the ability to achieve something that had eluded her. She doesn't actually fall in love with him until much later. |
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Chiibi
Posts: 4829 |
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Chibi Kangaroo, I suggest you leave this Kirito debate to us novel readers since we know the character better than you do.
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Bugnin
Posts: 575 |
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LOL http://www.t-ono.net/biographies/REKI-KAWAHARA-川原-礫-Biography.html
Did someone mention "author avatar fantasies?" "done" indeed.... |
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ChibiKangaroo
Posts: 2941 |
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Actually, you just proved my point. You are now admitting that Kirito is his fantasy self, whereas Haruyuki is much closer to reality. As such, Kirito is the Gary Stu and Haruyuki is a realistic representation of a boy struggling with self esteem. Thank you for agreeing with me
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getchman
 He started itPosts: 9121 Location: Bedford, NH |
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this serious debate over an animated person has put me in a much better mood. thank you, all three of you
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Chiibi
Posts: 4829 |
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Hey.....fandom, you know...
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ChibiKangaroo
Posts: 2941 |
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ROFL
Oh man, Bugnin WHY did you link that article to me??? Don't you know that (unlike some stubborn people) I actually read evidence that people provide? I like to be fully informed, you know. This article is like a gold mine for my position.
DON'T link articles to me unless you have read the whole thing! I will read it and smack you over the head with the contrary evidence in it ;0 |
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Chiibi
Posts: 4829 |
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I don't think writing a character that you'd like to be is the same thing as a Mary-Sue though.
Mary Sues are supposed to be wondeful at everything and personality-less. |
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Bugnin
Posts: 575 |
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*sigh* it isn't
They are.... But it's just easier to make up your own definition to fit your own argument. That's why I'm done here. The whole concept of gary stus is a lazy criticism used only by people who lack complex thought.
No, you're just the kid that feels the need to declare himself the winner of every argument. I'm long past the point of caring about this. Last edited by Bugnin on Thu Oct 09, 2014 3:44 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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