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This Week in Games - DualSense... tingling!


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Vizo



Joined: 19 May 2015
Posts: 110
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 2:44 pm Reply with quote
I look forward to E3 every year and would hate for it to be canceled for good. It's an exciting time to preview new games and plan out my shopping list for the next year. Though I never go to conventions and could live with it being a large digital event, I think it would silly not to have a convention. Aren't videogames the most interactive media industry? Hands-on play is key! I don't think the same can be said for events like Comic-Con and Anime Expo. Could you imagine if those events were completely online?

However, I hope E3 will do more to support publishers and consumers.
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El Hermano



Joined: 24 Feb 2019
Posts: 218
Location: Texas
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 3:03 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
Late last week, Naughty Dog posted a notice that The Last of Us Part II was almost done, but was being delayed due to “logistics issues,” as in “we want to make sure this is a global simultaneous release so some obnoxious dinguses online aren't going to spoil everything for those whose Amazon preorder is held up.”


You're definitely giving them the benefit of the doubt there. I, and many others, read that statement more like "so many people are out of work right now and we don't want to risk this not selling millions so we'll wait until people have money to spend on games again before we release it" It's not as if people didn't already predict everything leaked about TLOU2 already anyway as soon as the trailer dropped. It's just Naughty Dog being their greedy selves.

Vizo wrote:
Aren't videogames the most interactive media industry? Hands-on play is key! I don't think the same can be said for events like Comic-Con and Anime Expo. Could you imagine if those events were completely online?


The only benefit to live conventions is first-hand being able to play the game, and that's something that can easily be done at home these days with a demo being put up on PSN or Nintendo eShop like we got with Bravely Default 2 and Trials of Mana. Otherwise, there's nothing to them that can't be just as effective as an online presentation. in fact, I'd say online is actually better, because you don't get pointless gap fillers like that guy playing a banjo at the last E3, or the or the shakuhachi flute guy, or those sports commentators no one cared about who were stalling for time as they set up the next panel. Everything being recorded and done in advance saves so much time and there's also no chance of things going horribly wrong like the infamous Skyward Sword E3 reveal.
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Greed1914
It's Over 9000!It's Over 9000!


Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 3489
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 3:57 pm Reply with quote
Overall, I'm fine with the new controller, though it's undeniable that it's following the design of the Xbox controller. The main problem I have is the color. I'm not a fan of white for electronics, and it seems like a poor choice for something that is handled a lot. Grime accumulates, even if you aren't munching on Doritos while playing.


I think it says something about the number of physical pre-orders for Last of Us if Sony is willing to delay what is bound to be a massive seller. It wouldn't be a good look for them if they put customers in a position of choosing whether to cancel their order and get it digitally instead. And I'm sure retailers wouldn't be happy if they saw pre-orders canceled while Sony reaped the benefits of selling on the PS Store.
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AiddonValentine



Joined: 07 Aug 2006
Posts: 1787
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:03 pm Reply with quote
-Dualsense: It looks like someone took a Switch Pro Controller and bleached it

-Delays: Not surprising. Companies like ArcSys have also been switching to working from home. As for CERO, a lot of it also has to do with the bizarrely archaic process they have for submission.

-E3: We're going to see whether or not E3's absence makes any difference for gaming hype.
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DavetheUsher



Joined: 19 May 2014
Posts: 355
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:11 pm Reply with quote
Greed1914 wrote:
I think it says something about the number of physical pre-orders for Last of Us if Sony is willing to delay what is bound to be a massive seller. It wouldn't be a good look for them if they put customers in a position of choosing whether to cancel their order and get it digitally instead. And I'm sure retailers wouldn't be happy if they saw pre-orders canceled while Sony reaped the benefits of selling on the PS Store.


What makes you think it's Sony? Plenty of other anticipated PS4 came out recently like Resident Evil 3 and of course Final Fantasy 7 . If it's only affecting one game it's more than likely the developer making the call.
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Cam0



Joined: 13 Dec 2009
Posts: 4174
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:13 pm Reply with quote
El Hermano wrote:
"so many people are out of work right now and we don't want to risk this not selling millions so we'll wait until people have money to spend on games again before we release it" It's not as if people didn't already predict everything leaked about TLOU2 already anyway as soon as the trailer dropped. It's just Naughty Dog being their greedy selves.


Aren't video game sales soaring right now? Animal Crossing sold a lot, Doom Eternal at launch sold like twice as much as Doom 2016. So I'm not sure if that reasoning makes sense.
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OtherSideofSky



Joined: 19 May 2016
Posts: 72
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:55 pm Reply with quote
DavetheUsher wrote:
Greed1914 wrote:
I think it says something about the number of physical pre-orders for Last of Us if Sony is willing to delay what is bound to be a massive seller. It wouldn't be a good look for them if they put customers in a position of choosing whether to cancel their order and get it digitally instead. And I'm sure retailers wouldn't be happy if they saw pre-orders canceled while Sony reaped the benefits of selling on the PS Store.


What makes you think it's Sony? Plenty of other anticipated PS4 came out recently like Resident Evil 3 and of course Final Fantasy 7 . If it's only affecting one game it's more than likely the developer making the call.


RE3 came out on everything and FF7 is PS4 exclusive, but published by SE. Last of Us, on the other hand, is a first-party exclusive published by Sony, meaning that Sony makes the call on publishing decisions like this in a way it doesn't for those other two games.

Quote:
I do like the shape of the controller a lot, but ughhh, why can't Sony make a decent D-Pad for a change? Hard, clear plastic with segmented directions makes my thumb weep.


Honestly, I'll still take Sony's weird segmented D-pads over the imprecise mushiness of anything else this generation (especially the Switch Pro Controller with its horrible ghost inputs). It's pretty easy to tell that D-pad quality has been a decreasing priority across the board for a while now.
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Northlander



Joined: 10 Feb 2009
Posts: 796
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:27 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
I do like the shape of the controller a lot, but ughhh, why can't Sony make a decent D-Pad for a change? Hard, clear plastic with segmented directions makes my thumb weep.


What are you talking about? The playstation joypads are the only joypads where the digital direction... thing... isn't complete shit. Well, aside from the handhelds -- those are usually pretty solid, but for most modern consoles, only Sony has given me anything good since the Playstation 1 era. (Well... the Saturn pad was also pretty good in that respect.)

But not ANY of the Xboxes, nor the Gamecube or the Switch has decent digital control options unless you buy very specialized pads... if any is available.
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El Hermano



Joined: 24 Feb 2019
Posts: 218
Location: Texas
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:43 pm Reply with quote
Cam0 wrote:
Aren't video game sales soaring right now? Animal Crossing sold a lot, Doom Eternal at launch sold like twice as much as Doom 2016. So I'm not sure if that reasoning makes sense.


That's sort of my point. People are buying games now more than ever and no one cares about spoilers given FF7's entire story was known for almost a month now and streamed on Twitch for weeks. The fear of losing money by releasing it now makes no sense.
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ATastySub



Joined: 19 Jan 2012
Posts: 164
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 11:14 pm Reply with quote
El Hermano wrote:
Cam0 wrote:
Aren't video game sales soaring right now? Animal Crossing sold a lot, Doom Eternal at launch sold like twice as much as Doom 2016. So I'm not sure if that reasoning makes sense.


That's sort of my point. People are buying games now more than ever and no one cares about spoilers given FF7's entire story was known for almost a month now and streamed on Twitch for weeks. The fear of losing money by releasing it now makes no sense.

So you put out a conspiracy theory, someone says that sounds dumb, and you agree that it doesn't make sense, but this somehow proves your made up point? The article even explains what it means by "logistics issues" if you bothered to read the sentence after the one you quoted.
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omegafinal



Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 65
PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:46 pm Reply with quote
Northlander wrote:
Quote:
I do like the shape of the controller a lot, but ughhh, why can't Sony make a decent D-Pad for a change? Hard, clear plastic with segmented directions makes my thumb weep.


What are you talking about? The playstation joypads are the only joypads where the digital direction... thing... isn't complete shit. Well, aside from the handhelds -- those are usually pretty solid, but for most modern consoles, only Sony has given me anything good since the Playstation 1 era. (Well... the Saturn pad was also pretty good in that respect.)

But not ANY of the Xboxes, nor the Gamecube or the Switch has decent digital control options unless you buy very specialized pads... if any is available.

While more responsive when compared to modern controllers, there is one problem with the segmented D-Pad, if you've played on it for an extended amount of time, it will hurt. Especially with fighting games, where you have to perform some complex movement combinations, where you have to slide from one side to another instead of lifting your thumb. Thankfully, the Dualshock 4 improved on it, the center of the pad was better designed, and it felt smoother, and it didn't hurt as much when playing for a similar amount of time. There was a reason why one of the Street Fighter games on the PSP came with a D-Pad cover as a preorder bonus.

It is somewhat hard to see, but it appears the Dualsense has reverted to the one found on the earlier controllers.
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Vizo



Joined: 19 May 2015
Posts: 110
PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2020 3:19 pm Reply with quote
El Hermano wrote:
Vizo wrote:
Aren't videogames the most interactive media industry? Hands-on play is key! I don't think the same can be said for events like Comic-Con and Anime Expo. Could you imagine if those events were completely online?


The only benefit to live conventions is first-hand being able to play the game, and that's something that can easily be done at home these days with a demo being put up on PSN or Nintendo eShop like we got with Bravely Default 2 and Trials of Mana. Otherwise, there's nothing to them that can't be just as effective as an online presentation. in fact, I'd say online is actually better, because you don't get pointless gap fillers like that guy playing a banjo at the last E3, or the or the shakuhachi flute guy, or those sports commentators no one cared about who were stalling for time as they set up the next panel. Everything being recorded and done in advance saves so much time and there's also no chance of things going horribly wrong like the infamous Skyward Sword E3 reveal.

That's a fair point. For software, digital demos would solve that problem. I do love efficiency and the elimination of pointless and awkward filler and have no complaints with Nintendo's direct approach.
But why stop there? Couldn't the same thing be done for conventions like Comic-Con and Anime Expo?
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Northlander



Joined: 10 Feb 2009
Posts: 796
PostPosted: Sat Apr 11, 2020 6:14 pm Reply with quote
omegafinal wrote:
While more responsive when compared to modern controllers, there is one problem with the segmented D-Pad, if you've played on it for an extended amount of time, it will hurt. Especially with fighting games, where you have to perform some complex movement combinations, where you have to slide from one side to another instead of lifting your thumb. Thankfully, the Dualshock 4 improved on it, the center of the pad was better designed, and it felt smoother, and it didn't hurt as much when playing for a similar amount of time. There was a reason why one of the Street Fighter games on the PSP came with a D-Pad cover as a preorder bonus.

It is somewhat hard to see, but it appears the Dualsense has reverted to the one found on the earlier controllers.

Fair enough. While I did play some Street Fighter games on the PS1 and 2, my bread and butter on pretty much all consoles since the PS1 has been classic collections, mostly arcade ones. For those, the Playstation pads were all pretty much fantastic, especially the ones that were fairly fast-paced games where quick diagonal movements are important, like a crouch turn. And since the Playstation 2 in particular was a treasure trove for that sort of thing, that is why I like their digital direction controls the best by far. And this is still the case with PS4, for whichever arcade archives and other kinds of collections I buy on it. In fact, it irks me that Rygar is only available in Europe on the Switch, and the default or the pro controller are both awful for that game. As is the Xbox360 controller for whichever arcade collections I got for that console. (Well.... they could be workable for shoot 'em ups, but still not the best.) Analogue controllers are usually great for modern games, but usually always middling to terrible for retro games, depending on how hectic they are. So that's my take on this.

It's particularly irksome, given that Nintendo are actually very good at releasing older games nobody else wants to touch -- at least quite a bit more than Sony or Microsoft.
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jellybeanbandit



Joined: 18 Jun 2019
Posts: 99
PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:02 am Reply with quote
ATastySub wrote:
The article even explains what it means by "logistics issues" if you bothered to read the sentence after the one you quoted.


That was Heidi's own theory, not an official confirmed statement by a company. One you could say is equally dumb since delays often lead to online spoiler leaks. Which, indeed, we've already had the entire plot of the Last of Us 2 leaked at this point. I usually err on the side of corporate greed, myself. The idea Sony would care about people being spoiled over profit is extremely optimistic.

Northlander wrote:
While more responsive when compared to modern controllers, there is one problem with the segmented D-Pad, if you've played on it for an extended amount of time, it will hurt. Especially with fighting games, where you have to perform some complex movement combinations, where you have to slide from one side to another instead of lifting your thumb. Thankfully, the Dualshock 4 improved on it, the center of the pad was better designed, and it felt smoother, and it didn't hurt as much when playing for a similar amount of time. There was a reason why one of the Street Fighter games on the PSP came with a D-Pad cover as a preorder bonus.

It is somewhat hard to see, but it appears the Dualsense has reverted to the one found on the earlier controllers.


The only thing d-pads are used for these days are hotkeying guns and items in shooters. Not much reason for companies to put out good d-pads anymore when everything uses an analog stick. Any serious fighting game enthusiasts will use a fight stick, and any retro game enthusiast probably picked up Nintendo's NES or SNES Classic controller. Or at the very least an 8bitdo.
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omegafinal



Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 65
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:33 pm Reply with quote
jellybeanbandit wrote:

The only thing d-pads are used for these days are hotkeying guns and items in shooters. Not much reason for companies to put out good d-pads anymore when everything uses an analog stick. Any serious fighting game enthusiasts will use a fight stick, and any retro game enthusiast probably picked up Nintendo's NES or SNES Classic controller. Or at the very least an 8bitdo.


Unfortunately the sad truth of the D-Pad being turned into more of a second set of action buttons nowadays, I have to agree. Even though I use a fightstick myself (an X360 SxF Fightstick Pro), one of the things I would love to see is a very good six-button fightpad for modern systems. Last time I used one was an X360 MadCatz Fightpad, worked out pretty well for me, would leave on button side on my lap, almost like using that side as a mini fightstick in a way. For a classic-style controller, the HORI Pokken Controller for the WiiU/Switch works amazing well for me. (Though I'm talking a more on what I use on PC. Consoles? Only got the usual controllers for those.)


Last edited by omegafinal on Thu Apr 16, 2020 10:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
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