Forum - View topicNEWS: One Piece at Viz
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Steventheeunuch
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I don't care. Viz are making an active desicion to put it out, Viz are the ones putting their name to the discs, and they're the ones who SHOULD be releasing it uncut. As such, they are as bad as 4Kids in regards to One Piece for simply taking it up the shoot.
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Tempest
 I Run this place.ANN Publisher  Posts: 10455 Location: Do not message me for support. |
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Absolutely. 4Kids could. But 4Kids doesn't. My point was not to defend 4Kids, it was to defend Viz.
Got ratings?
Look at it from 4Kids' point of view. They license a show for the mass-children's market. This is a smart business decision, the market is much larger than the anime enthusiast market. they edit the show to be acceptable to their market An unfortunate necessity. In addition to making it acceptable to children, they also make othe changes that "ruin" it for enthusiasts. This sucks. 4Kids thinks the changes make it more accessible to children, and that they will make more money this way. If they're right about it being more accessible, it's true that it improves their profit margin. But are they right? From what I've seen, some of the things they've done to One Piece have no benefit to their target market. This is where they're being stupid IMHO. they release the edited show on DVD Imagine the complaints they'd get if they released the unedited version on the DVD? Parents know their kids watch a kid-safe show on TV and suddenly the DVD of the same show has lots of stuff they don't want their kids to see. They complain to the stores, they complain to 4Kids, they complain to the TV stations and they complain to their friends. 4Kids has no choice but to release edited DVDs. They focus on a market. They do everything they can do to profit from that larger market. And they won't compromise that market for the benefit of a smaller market. The only working solution they've come up with, has been the unedited later releases. IMHO those were a good idea, and they've said they were happy with sales (but Vidscan numbers aren't very impressive). Hopefully One Piece will get the same treatment. Any other solution that would make you happy compromises their target market. They can't release unedited DVDs at the same time as the edited DVDs, it confuses buyers and merchants. They can't include an unedited version on the edited DVD because kids will watch it. They can't include a Japanese track because it won't sync up to the edited visuals. They can't cut bits & pieces out of the audio track because it would be audibly perceptible. There's no point for them to even try because enthusiast wouldn't buy an Japanese version if it was edited. Life sucks for the enthusiast. But 4Kids is pulling in a lot of money, so they apparently do know what they're doing. Their stocks have dropped because their big properties are fading and they haven't found the next big thing yet. But fact is, the company remains profitable and their profit versus sales margin is quite nice. Everything they can do for the enthusiast market either compromises their market, or doesn't pull in a lot of money. It'd be nice if they gave us what we wanted (actually, I don't give a damn, their shows are way under my age level, but I'd be happy for younger anime fans), but what would be illogical and incomepetant, from a business point of view, would be compromising their market for a secondary, unimportant (from their position) market. I hate what they're doing. But calling them Incompetant and illogical shows a real lack of understanding about what is really going on. -t |
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Space Goats
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I call for a boycott.
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Tempest
I Run this place. ANN Publisher Posts: 10455 Location: Do not message me for support. |
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4Kids will never let someone put it out uncut at the same time as the edited release, for reasons I specify in the above post. I agree with you, Viz could have saved their reputation a bit and said "We won't be the one's to release this edited." But it doesn't matter who releases / distributes it, it would have been the edited version. -t |
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Steventheeunuch
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On things you never would have bought in the first place? I think a boycott is a stupid idea, because it doesn't have a big enough swing behind it and all of the conditions for it are wrong. |
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Tempest
I Run this place. ANN Publisher Posts: 10455 Location: Do not message me for support. |
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Unfortunately Steven is right. 4Kids doesn't bank on enthusiasts buying this product in the first place. Since they don't expect you to buy it, you can't pressure them by not buying it. You could boycott all Viz products to punish them for working with 4Kids. But do you want to go that far? And would there be enough people who feel like you to make it an effective boycott ? -t |
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Steventheeunuch
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Their logic is a bit fallible (and yes, I realise people and stances do and will change over time, but bear with me), but Yugioh and Shaman King (which still, to this date, has no edited release) were out uncut at the same time as their respective TV versions were on the well.. TV. It's just there's only so much sympathy you can give out and only so much you "understand" before it becomes more like a gigantic, god-damn chore. |
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Steventheeunuch
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On top of this, you'd also have to establish it as people who would have definantly bought it in the first place, which is a bi hard to establish these days now with the internet and empty threats and all. Given that a lot of people who buy Anime DVDs quite regularly have fairly tough skin and deal with quite a few issues in regards to handling of anything, you wouldn't get many backers. |
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Yashouzoid
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Skipping other shows. FOX* (4Kids TV) 1.7/8 Avg. (8a-12n) One Piece 1.8/8 (10/9/05) *2005-2006 Season Premiere Weekend FOX (4Kids TV) 1.3/6 Avg. (8a-12n) One Piece 1.1/5 (17/9/05) FOX (4Kids TV) 1.1/5 Avg. (8a-12n) One Piece 1.0/4 (24/9/05) FOX (4Kids TV) 1.4/6 Avg. (8a-12n) One Piece 1.1/5 (1/10/05) FOX (4Kids TV) 1.4/7 Avg. (8a-12n) One Piece 1.3/6 (8/10/05) FOX (4Kids TV) 1.3/6 Avg. (8a-12n) One Piece 0.6/3 (15/10/05) Averages out to: 1.1/5 In case you're out of loop, that's underperforming.
It is, perhaps. I'm not arguing 4Kids marketing One Piece to children, however, they should consider teens and older audiences, because they DO make up a good portion of the audience.
Indeed.
You know, if cookies and Navies were all I had to worry about, it'd be fine. I can tolerate minor localization. I can tolerate Japanese text being erased. What I can't tolerate is the story getting hacked up, the music being replaced for no reason, and hiring the most amateur voice work possible. There's no excuse for those kinds of edits, and if it's supposed to make the ratings higher, it's not working.
So then release them at the same time and plaster an uncut label (and make it huge for emphasis) on the DVDs. And keep in mind that this was NEVER a problem with Yu-Gi-Oh! or Shaman King when they were released on DVD, and those shows are both more successful with kids than One Piece is (okay, SK is a stretch but still).
Aren't you on the ANN staff? Shouldn't you be up to date with this stuff? Because Viz just confirmed that this wouldn't be happening.
Then release them in Naruto-style sets.
Not if they release the edited version at the same time as the uncut version. Or hell, I would be satisfied with Naruto, or even Zatch Bell treatment.
At this rate, they're not going to find their next big thing. They made 4Kids TV a primary source of income and then sold off Yu-Gi-Oh GX and Pokemon Chronicles to their competition right after. I'm really starting to think Al Kahn has this "I can do everything myself and I don't need help" thing going down.
Actually, you saying they're still profitable and that their business decisions are correct is what's really showing that. Guess what - Yu-Gi-Oh! DVDs are selling like shit now. The edited ones, that is. Uncuts? Different story. And when Yu-Gi-Oh started losing its steam, international sales for Shaman King and WinX Club - both their edited versions, may I add - partially offset that. And yet I don't see them trying to make those any bigger. Instead, all that was rambled about was how Yu-Gi-Oh was going to make some big comeback. That was 6-9 months ago? Yeah, never happened. As a matter of fact, Yu-Gi-Oh is getting the lowest ratings on Kids' WB right now. 4Kids relies on the past, never relies on the fans, and always tries to make sure their way is right and fail miserably at it. No matter how many suits or producers try to tell you otherwise, their way is not right, they're not doing well with their shows that they claim to be profitable, and they're not a good company period. |
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Steventheeunuch
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Aren't you on the ANN staff? Shouldn't you be up to date with this stuff? Because Viz just confirmed that this wouldn't be happening. [/quote] Woah, since when? |
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Yashouzoid
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If that's not sarcasm, it's right on the front page. |
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Chiyosuke
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Okay, there are a couple of things I want to point out:
I don't see how this (VIZ distributing OP) is news to anyone. I pointed this out when it was first solicited (not here though). I guess no one listened. Toei was the home video licensor from the get go. In unison with Steven, I have to say that Viz really doesn't give a shit about the fans. Last edited by Chiyosuke on Thu Oct 27, 2005 7:03 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Steventheeunuch
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Sorry, wasn't looking. |
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hikaru393
Posts: 525 Location: champlin MN |
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yeah but it's the only way to see uncut plus the bootlegs i buy have good animation and subs so i dont really care.
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Steventheeunuch
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The animation wouldn't be afected by either official or unofficial rleases, and the subtitles on the more-common One Piece bootlegs are absolutely appauling (Bed fellows? Roof? Sunkist and Sauron? Please!), so please know what you're talking about before you post. |
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