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This Week in Games - The Old Frontier


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BadNewsBlues



Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 4339
PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:19 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
but publishers just don't want to because they're convinced that only photorealism will ever sell


Having a game with nice looking art is good but doesn’t mean squat if the gameplay and the writing therein is middling or just plain ass.
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El Hermano



Joined: 24 Feb 2019
Posts: 343
Location: Texas
PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2020 9:09 pm Reply with quote
BadNewsBlues wrote:
Having a game with nice looking art is good but doesn’t mean squat if the gameplay and the writing therein is middling or just plain ass.


Of course. The Last of Us II was hailed as the most graphically stunning and realistic game ever made when it came out, but it only sold 4 million copies and was generally called a miserable experience. Meanwhile Animal Crossing: New Horizons sold 26 million and was universally praised as fun and enjoyable. There's also Among Us currently blowing up everywhere despite it having graphics that are literal Microsoft paint drawings, and there's also Fall Guys for another popular, cartoony game about bean people. But this statement seems to be specifically talking about emulating Amano and Kobayashi's art for an RPG game. Something in the vein of Vanillaware's 13 Sentinels: Aegis Rim, I presume. That's more of a specific personal wish than developers choosing photorealism over everything else, though.
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Silver Kirin



Joined: 09 Aug 2018
Posts: 342
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:57 pm Reply with quote
- Sega: it would be great if sega could repurpose that Nomad prototype and make a portable Genesis with all the games they included in the mini version.
- KOF XV: I just hope that this new game has improved graphics over XIV, the last Samurai Spirits game looked great so perhaps SNK is doing better at modeling 3D characters, I just want them to do a sequel to Garou: MOW.
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varmintx



Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 1120
Location: Covington, KY
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:10 pm Reply with quote
El Hermano wrote:
The Last of Us II was hailed as the most graphically stunning and realistic game ever made when it came out, but it only sold 4 million copies and was generally called a miserable experience.

lol...only immediately sold 4 million copies making it the fastest selling PS4 exclusive. Oh, and only a 93 average on Metacritic. Why do I have a sneaking suspicion your motivation with this utter nonsense has nothing to do with graphics.
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lostrune



Joined: 09 Jun 2012
Posts: 312
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 5:10 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
I've heard people express concern that the Saudi ownership might force some of the more fanservicey female characters to cover up, which is a. unlikely to happen on a global scale, and b. seriously, that's what you're upset about and not the murder?!


It seems pretty simple to me: one actually affects the game itself and the other doesn't. If people try to avoid products or services due to ethical reasons they're not going to have a lot of choices to choose from. No Walmart, no Nike shoes, no diamond jewelery, no food products in general. Most people aren't going to choose to live that way and instead only focus on what affects them directly, which would be the quality of said products and services.

Silver Kirin wrote:
- Sega: it would be great if sega could repurpose that Nomad prototype and make a portable Genesis with all the games they included in the mini version.


Would be nice to have a proper handheld Sega mini. The Game Gear mini was a total gimmick and pretty much designed not to be played but displayed on a shelf which was a total bummer.

varmintx wrote:
lol...only immediately sold 4 million copies making it the fastest selling PS4 exclusive. Oh, and only a 93 average on Metacritic. Why do I have a sneaking suspicion your motivation with this utter nonsense has nothing to do with graphics.


Well someone sure is defensive.. Wink But I don't see the lie. For all the hubub about console specs it turns out people will flock towards what they like in the end. There's a lot of Switch exclusives hovering around the 20 million mark like Super Mario Odyssey and Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, which only Uncharted 4 comes close to at 16 million. And I say this as someone who found BOTW really boring.
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NeverConvex
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Joined: 08 Jun 2013
Posts: 980
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 5:22 pm Reply with quote
Comparing Last of Us II to Animal Crossing seems a stretch to me primarily because they're from two entirely different genres. I would expect a game like Animal Crossing to have a much larger but more casual target audience.
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AiddonValentine



Joined: 07 Aug 2006
Posts: 1868
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 6:04 pm Reply with quote
-Saga Frontier: Yeah, that's pretty bonkers for them to finally finish Saga Frontier. Also nice how it's looking to keep the charm with some good sprite work unlike the AWFUL remasters of FF6. And yes, I would like to see someone eventually tackle an Amano art style because at that point we can finally say "Pack it in, we've maxed out on graphics. Enough with the hardware arms race."

-SNK: Deeply troubling, so I don't blame anyone for not supporting them anymore and it should not be swept under the rug.

-SCVI: Not just Hwang, but the 2.30 update is adding more story bits. Seems like they're REALLY going somewhere crazy with the plot.
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varmintx



Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 1120
Location: Covington, KY
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 6:56 pm Reply with quote
lostrune wrote:
varmintx wrote:
lol...only immediately sold 4 million copies making it the fastest selling PS4 exclusive. Oh, and only a 93 average on Metacritic. Why do I have a sneaking suspicion your motivation with this utter nonsense has nothing to do with graphics.

Well someone sure is defensive.. Wink But I don't see the lie. For all the hubub about console specs it turns out people will flock towards what they like in the end. There's a lot of Switch exclusives hovering around the 20 million mark like Super Mario Odyssey and Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, which only Uncharted 4 comes close to at 16 million. And I say this as someone who found BOTW really boring.

I'm not defending the game, I haven't even played/bought it and have no intention of doing either anytime in the near future. I'm demonstrating what they said about it is wrong while very much insinuating they had a different reason for specifically going after LotU 2 as opposed to simply pointing out the most popular games around are Minecraft and Fortnight. As for me, I'm currently playing Bloodstained...also not exactly on the cutting edge of graphical fidelity.
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BadNewsBlues



Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 4339
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 8:21 pm Reply with quote
El Hermano wrote:


Of course. The Last of Us II was hailed as the most graphically stunning and realistic game ever made when it came out, but it only sold 4 million copies and was generally called a miserable experience. Meanwhile Animal Crossing: New Horizons sold 26 million and was universally praised as fun and enjoyable.


Animal Crossing and Fall Guys are casual all ages type games so that gives them something of a chip on their shoulder.

lostrune wrote:


It seems pretty simple to me: one actually affects the game itself and the other doesn't. If people try to avoid products or services due to ethical reasons they're not going to have a lot of choices to choose from. No Walmart, no Nike shoes, no diamond jewelery, no food products in general.


While that is true to an extent paradoxically putting money into the hands of companies that screw over their employees, openly discriminate/ donate to other groups that support such behavior against certain people, don’t ensure employee safety, are implicit in extrajudicial killings is kinda...problematic.
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BlueAlf



Joined: 02 Jan 2017
Posts: 869
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:04 pm Reply with quote
I love SaGa Frontier, but I agree it's the kind where you kinda 'grow' into it instead of liking it outright. Yeah, the game is sorta hard and uneven. But once you figure your way around, it has a lot of really interesting things (which some sadly got cut).

I know Square Enix have lost a lot of faith recently, with poor ports and the whole Avengers fiasco. But I imagine they can get easy money just by re-releasing games from their golden era (even their uneven ones). Even more if they fix stuff.

So, yeah, I think this is a their step in the right direction.
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AmpersandsUnited



Joined: 22 Mar 2012
Posts: 313
PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2020 8:50 am Reply with quote
BlueAlf wrote:
I know Square Enix have lost a lot of faith recently, with poor ports and the whole Avengers fiasco. But I imagine they can get easy money just by re-releasing games from their golden era (even their uneven ones). Even more if they fix stuff.


People shouldn't blame Square-Enix for Avengers. Crystal Dynamics and Marvel themselves are behind that one. Square-Enix just published it.

The SaGa Frontier remaster will be useful for the extra content , even if it suffers in other areas. More often than not remasters seem to always be inferior to the original versions, but if they can offer something like new content then at least they have a reason to exist alongside the original. It would be nice if it was one of the good remasters like Chrono Trigger DS.

BadNewsBlues wrote:
Animal Crossing and Fall Guys are casual all ages type games so that gives them something of a chip on their shoulder.


I think you mean the chip is on the shoulders of the people who dismiss those games, rather than the chip being on the shoulders of those games themselves.
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BadNewsBlues



Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 4339
PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2020 2:24 pm Reply with quote
AmpersandsUnited wrote:


People shouldn't blame Square-Enix for Avengers. Crystal Dynamics and Marvel themselves are behind that one.


With Square Enix publishing the game and then likely greenlighting the game’s live service model if not outright pushed for it which is one of the key reasons the game lost so much money think you can put some of the heat on them. Personally I’d rather see how the game continues on after this before offering up a post mortem.


AmpersandsUnited wrote:
I think you mean the chip is on the shoulders of the people who dismiss those games, rather than the chip being on the shoulders of those games themselves.


Thinking it about it more my usage of the analogy was wrong but not exactly the conclusion I was shooting for. That said they’re are a a lot of people whose hurt feelings towards certain franchises and publishers can border on excessively petty and the absurd.

Aside from that, the point I was trying to make was if you make an all ages game you’re more likely to have a massive seller on your hands compared to a game whose audience is a bit more focused and narrower.
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phia_one



Joined: 15 Jan 2012
Posts: 1526
Location: Pennsylvania
PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2020 9:26 pm Reply with quote
I've been meaning to check out SaGa Frontier for a long time so I'll be getting the remaster at some point.
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El Hermano



Joined: 24 Feb 2019
Posts: 343
Location: Texas
PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 10:25 am Reply with quote
varmintx wrote:
lol...only immediately sold 4 million copies making it the fastest selling PS4 exclusive. Oh, and only a 93 average on Metacritic. Why do I have a sneaking suspicion your motivation with this utter nonsense has nothing to do with graphics.


I'm not sure what you're accusing my "motivation" of being, but you should know that metacritic scores are pointless and when a company doesn't report updated sales numbers after an initial launch it is usually pretty telling of how the game performed in the following weeks. But I'm not really sure what any of this has to do with graphics and gameplay though. All I did was agree that graphics are nowhere near as important as people make them out to be and gameplay and fun will always win out in the end.

NeverConvex wrote:
Comparing Last of Us II to Animal Crossing seems a stretch to me primarily because they're from two entirely different genres. I would expect a game like Animal Crossing to have a much larger but more casual target audience.


There's nothing inherently disadvantageous about shooters in terms of popularity. Many AAA shooters achieve those numbers of sales figures. The obvious example to use is the original Last of Us which reached 20 million copies sold so it's perfectly doable. Likewise, a "casual" game does not guarantee success and many have underperformed and flopped. I think it does these games a great disservice to dismiss their success and accomplishments as just being because they're 'casual' games.
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Cam0



Joined: 13 Dec 2009
Posts: 4379
PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 10:47 am Reply with quote
El Hermano wrote:
The obvious example to use is the original Last of Us which reached 20 million copies sold so it's perfectly doable.


If we are to use your metrics then the original Last of Us "only" sold like 1.3 million units in its first week. The 4 million units you stated that Part 2 sold were achieved in the first few days. Hard to say whether Part 2 will ever exceed the original's numbers, but your clearly just cherry picking facts that fit the narrative your trying to sell.
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