Forum - View topic

OEL manga jumping the shark

Frankly, I don't know anything about European comics in the US. I suppose series such as Tintin, Asterix & Obelix etc are available, but I don't know about the lesser known titles...

Tamaria wrote:

Frankly, I don't know anything about European comics in the US. I suppose series such as Tintin, Asterix & Obelix etc are available, but I don't know about the lesser known titles...

Sigh. I wish. If they are, they're either out of print to just not popular. I haven't looked for them in a while though. A friend of mine who visits family in German had picked up copies of Atstix & Obelix there because he couldn't find them here. Meanwhile, I've slowly been picking up volumes of the Metabarons from Humanoids. They're out of print now, but I can sometimes stumble across some.

the difference between American and Japanese comics’ storytelling methods is exactly why a term like “OEL Manga” is necessary. We’re at a point where there are plenty of western comic creators who grew up with both styles of storytelling and their approach to comics shows that influence. For me, OEL Manga isn’t an oxymoron. It’s a form that learns from two different approaches to comics and would fit poorly on either aisle. Perhaps there’s a better term that should be coined, but I do think it has a specific meaning.

You do know that X-men is already similar to Bleach or Naruto. The Japanese shonen genre in comics is quite comparable to the American superhero genre. Sure they dress different, but they share similarities too. There already is a manga about X-men. It's the comic book X-men. X-men is already a manga, just that we don't call it that because we're not in Japan. Actually, there are several. I only read one or two. Kinda giving up on Marvel lately. Plus why would you make X-men like something that it's not. X-men is X-men. Bleach is Bleach. A is A. A is not B, X is not B.

For its own good, OEL manga needs to stop calling itself that. I'm rooting for a number of them, just like many other upstarts in the industry, but I think calling it by a Japanese name weakens it in the long run. It weaken the future of the creators and the entire industry.

Good! The harem genre in manga is mostly misogynistic crap, if not by its very definition. It's outlandish male fantasy. I'm glad I don't see any American books taking up that torch. Many creators here seem to have a more realistic view of women and relationships. (Okay, controversial Dave Sim comments aside.) If you like it, fine. Yet I don't think it's a genre to hold up on a pedestal to show the merits of Japanese comics.

No. I've commented that Seven Seas is a piece of crap publisher too. They don't sell as well and aren't as big. I think they are worse than TokyoPop in that they actually print English books in the opposite way from which English is read. That's insane. Antarctic Press is pretty crappy too. Though I do like some of the books from these companies, their publishing standards and marketing standards are garbage.

You believe? Do you have any proof? I can believe that Jesus and the Flying Spaghetti monster put flaming bags of dog poo on Richard Dawkin's doorstep. Doesn't mean it happened. Doesn't help any arguments about evolution. Just the facts man. Just the facts. You aren't breinging any. Instead you bring prejudiced ideas and vague beliefs about what manga is. Is that all 'OEL manga' has going for it?

There is no manga in other countries. Well, there is. If we were speaking Japanese, then, sure, there are manga in other countries. Yet we're not speaking in Japanese. We're speaking in English. So you're talking about comics and graphic novels.

The only difference between manga and comics is that one word is Japanese and the other is English. That's it!

It's hard to say? Maybe because you don't know what you're talking about. You know in your heart? Seriously? Fine. Can you explain it with your brain? If not, then you don't know what you're talking about.

Anyway, my point was that it's pretty lame to cite this genre not being present in America as a sign that American comics are weaker. Like I said, I'm glad American comics have not adapted this bad idea for a genre. We're better off without it. We already have enough misogyny and trouble connecting to female readers.

Normal American comics like 'Superman' don't appeal to me that much. They focus more on superheroes and fighting evil. Manga has more fantasy and it's more romantic," That about sums up why girls long ago abandoned American superhero comics, a market increasingly dominated by adult male collectors saving mint-condition comics in plastic bags.

mdo07 wasn't the first person who compared Love Hina and Naruto to Watchmen and Love and Rockets. You're putting words in his mouth. He even says there are no american Love Hina equivalents and you sidestep it into a tirade about misogyny which was pretty much pathetic.

First of all comparing Love Hina to Watchmen or Love and Rockets makes me wonder how some of you were even able to finish reading Watchmen. It's a cheap argument since they're like apples and oranges compared to each other. Do you go around saying Iron Man is garbage versus No Country for Old Men? Of course not because they belong to different genres and were each created with different goals in mind and both successfully accomplished them. If you want to compare Iron Man with a movie you use Pirates of the Caribbean, Wanted, or Spider Man. Just cheap resorting to crap like this.

this article wrote:

Perhaps there’s a better term that should be coined, but I do think it has a specific meaning.

I think I know why OEL manga should keep it titles, if you don't like it call it something else, just don't attack people who like the name "OEL manga", it's their choice and mine too.

Did you forget there was a Captain Future anime, A lIttle Lulu anime, and a Witchblade anime. Oh and don't forget Batman: Gotham Knight movie. Oh Spawn had his own Japanese manga.

Then you don't have to call it OEL manga. No one is forcing you to call it OEL manga. You can call it whatever you want. Great now you're not a hater. That's all I needed to see. But please stop bashing Tokyopop and the name OEL manga. Stop complaining about the OEL manga market, it already happen and many people didn't mind that. You really need to stop your silly debate on this site, it's causing a flame war and I don't like it (I'm here because they are too many hates on OEL, and it's my spiritual duty to defend it). If using the Japanese name weaken it, why are we using foreign word in English like amigo, petite, and other word and they don't seem to weaken their language.

So you're ok with Shonen-Ai, Reverese Harem (Fruit Basket), Yaoi genre (are you a man or woman, Xenos? If you are a man and think harem sucks, then you are a disgrace to your own gender.), and *insert Sarcasm*I'm going to assume that Yaoi, Reverse Harem, and Shonen-Ai, and Yuri genres were created in American Comic Book before Japanese put those genres on manga.

Oh, now you're attacking other companies that made OEL manga. It's look like I can remove the "Spawn of Jack Thompson" title out of ya. But you still aren't bashing Germany, Brazil, France, Spain (yes, Spain does their own manga), Korea, and China for their own manga.

Well, Korean's Manhwa and China's Manhua (they both emulate manga) was created before Tokyopop's OEL manga and Antartic Press's manga-style comic (by the time Ninja High School came out, manga wasn't as popular until today). Look it doesn't matter where it originated, they're all comic. They're here to entertain us.

So that's mean we shouldn't be speaking English because English belong to England. Fine, let's come up with a new language.

Then we can't have:

Christmas, because it's from Israel and Europe can't have Christmas also. So you want to eliminate every holiday that is not American made.

Pizza, taco, Chinese Food, and other foreign adapted food shouldn't be here. Fine, let stick with Breakfast Cereal, egg and sausage, and other 100% true American food.

So ice cream are not allowed to be made in other part of the world, it should be American only.

Manga and comic are in the same medium. Manga is just another word for comic but with it's own art and style. I can just called it Japanese comic, manga, or komikku. It doesn't matter.

If you are a man and think harem sucks, then you are a disgrace to your own gender

Fine, let stick with Breakfast Cereal, egg and sausage, and other 100% true American food.

So ice cream are not allowed to be made in other part of the world, it should be American only.

Christmas, because it's from Israel and Europe can't have Christmas also.

Well, it looks like maybe some girls do still read comic like Wonder Woman and Supergirl. But the superhero started to become too overused for girls and decided to go with manga, because of the art and stories that girls can relate to. If only DC and Marvel could have come up with Shonen-Ai, and Yaoi genres before the Japanese did then female readers could still be reading it today. Don't get me started on the Mary Watson comic book, that's like a American Shojo comic book made after the arrival of Shojo manga. DC and Marvel should have pay more attention to what female readers wanted, pure romance and situation that girls can relate to. I wonder how the new X-men OEL manga will do for the nice ladies. Maybe DC should try teaming up with maybe Tokyopop or Seven Sea (Marvel team up with Del-Rey for the X-men OEL) and create Wonder Women and Supergirl, shojo style. That's how girls probably want it. A link I found many months ago had a anime-style DC superheroes figure.

He's almost right. Ice cold desserts have been around for centuries, IIRC you could buy shaved ice flavored with fruit and honey in Greece hundreds of years B.C. However, the original ice cream recipe is considered American.

I'm a 17 year old girl, and I read American superhero comics. Not Wonder Woman or Supergirl, either. This dismissal of the superhero genre all having bad art is preposterous too. Are you saying that Karl Kerschl has the same art style as Bruce Timm or Rafael Albuquerque?
Lots of girls read and enjoy the more 'male oriented' superhero comics. What we don't enjoy is shoddy writing. Both American comics and manga have that in spades.
And I don't want pure romance. In manga, most of the romance I've seen is contrived. I want good characters that, even if I can't relate to them entirely, I can completely empathize with them (Jaime Reyes as the Blue Beetle, for example.)
And those anime-style figurines creep me right the hell out, excepting Batgirl. What did they do to Power Girl? She's a valued member of the JSA, and there she looks like some idiot child.

read this: http://www.crocodilecaucus.com/wordpress/2007/12/11/actually-oel-manga-makes-sense/
I think I know why OEL manga should keep it titles, if you don't like it call it something else, just don't attack people who like the name "OEL manga", it's their choice and mine too.

Did you forget there was a Captain Future anime, A lIttle Lulu anime, and a Witchblade anime. Oh and don't forget Batman: Gotham Knight movie. Oh Spawn had his own Japanese manga.

Then you don't have to call it OEL manga. No one is forcing you to call it OEL manga. You can call it whatever you want. Great now you're not a hater. That's all I needed to see. But please stop bashing Tokyopop and the name OEL manga. Stop complaining about the OEL manga market, it already happen and many people didn't mind that. You really need to stop your silly debate on this site, it's causing a flame war and I don't like it (I'm here because they are too many hates on OEL, and it's my spiritual duty to defend it). If using the Japanese name weaken it, why are we using foreign word in English like amigo, petite, and other word and they don't seem to weaken their language.

So you're ok with Shonen-Ai, Reverese Harem (Fruit Basket), Yaoi genre (are you a man or woman, Xenos? If you are a man and think harem sucks, then you are a disgrace to your own gender.), and *insert Sarcasm*I'm going to assume that Yaoi, Reverse Harem, and Shonen-Ai, and Yuri genres were created in American Comic Book before Japanese put those genres on manga.

Oh, now you're attacking other companies that made OEL manga. It's look like I can remove the "Spawn of Jack Thompson" title out of ya. But you still aren't bashing Germany, Brazil, France, Spain (yes, Spain does their own manga), Korea, and China for their own manga.

Well, Korean's Manhwa and China's Manhua (they both emulate manga) was created before Tokyopop's OEL manga and Antartic Press's manga-style comic (by the time Ninja High School came out, manga wasn't as popular until today). Look it doesn't matter where it originated, they're all comic. They're here to entertain us.

So that's mean we shouldn't be speaking English because English belong to England. Fine, let's come up with a new language.
Then we can't have:
Christmas, because it's from Israel and Europe can't have Christmas also. So you want to eliminate every holiday that is not American made.

Pizza, taco, Chinese Food, and other foreign adapted food shouldn't be here. Fine, let stick with Breakfast Cereal, egg and sausage, and other 100% true American food.
So ice cream are not allowed to be made in other part of the world, it should be American only.

Manga and comic are in the same medium.

Manga is just another word for comic but with it's own art and style.

So what about Yaoi, Shonen-Ai, and reverse harem? They have trouble with most man, they work like fanservice for girls. Just like that, the circle turns. Female readers are offended by harem and ecchi manga/anime, while there are male reader offended by Yaoi, reverse harem, and shonen-ai.

Well, if you didn't read the above, read this link, it's about girls and comic and manga: link
According to the article, this person said:

Quote:

Normal American comics like 'Superman' don't appeal to me that much. They focus more on superheroes and fighting evil. Manga has more fantasy and it's more romantic," That about sums up why girls long ago abandoned American superhero comics, a market increasingly dominated by adult male collectors saving mint-condition comics in plastic bags.

Well, it looks like maybe some girls do still read comic like Wonder Woman and Supergirl. But the superhero started to become too overused for girls and decided to go with manga, because of the art and stories that girls can relate to. If only DC and Marvel could have come up with Shonen-Ai, and Yaoi genres before the Japanese did then female readers could still be reading it today.

Don't get me started on the Mary Watson comic book, that's like a American Shojo comic book made after the arrival of Shojo manga.

DC and Marvel should have pay more attention to what female readers wanted, pure romance and situation that girls can relate to.

I wonder how the new X-men OEL manga will do for the nice ladies. Maybe DC should try teaming up with maybe Tokyopop or Seven Sea (Marvel team up with Del-Rey for the X-men OEL) and create Wonder Women and Supergirl, shojo style. That's how girls probably want it.

A link I found many months ago had a anime-style DC superheroes figure. They don't look that bad, but I hope they don't push the fanservice a little too extreme.

He's almost right. Ice cold desserts have been around for centuries, IIRC you could buy shaved ice flavored with fruit and honey in Greece hundreds of years B.C.

Yes, and why are those anime and manga? They were produced IN JAPAN.

Plus, as I keep saying and you keep ignoring, even TokyoPop doesn't even use the term OEL manga anymore. Not to mention that most of their 'OEL manga' creators have been let go or have their OEL books canceled or in development limbo. Who knows if any of them are going to keep the rights to their creators. It was a bad deal if not a scam from day one. Why are you supporting these scam artists and their BS marketing, kid?

Spiritual duty? Time to find a new religion pal. Feels like I'm trying to tell Tom Cruise to take his medication. Again, I think the whole OEL manga label is harming the industry. It's feeding an unhealthy mentality among fans. For the sake of this material you claim to love, stop calling it by such an absurd name. It hurts the very books you're trying to promote. It's like I see some kid hitting himself in the head with a baseball bat. I tell him to stop and he tells me that it's his opinion and his right to do so. No. Just stop

Someone needs to read the works of Gail Simone and other fan favorite writers who can write strong female characters. Plus a bigger problem is that comics in general were not sold to the general populace like in Japan. In order to survive they sadly had to become this niche market for superheros. Do you even know the history of comics in America? Do you know about Wetham? Do you know why books were forced into the superhero genre?

You think you know what girls want? You think you know romance? This from the guy promoting the harem genre?

I think they're pretty bad. Very cliche. Is that what you want? Cliches? Also, couldn't they have removable clothing like a number of Japanese figures? I mean.. Joking aside, the fetishistic Japanese bishojo figure market isn't something DC should aspire to.

That does raise a good point about the core audience for Marvel and DC. Though, again it ignores the growing readership at other publishers with diverse books like Image, Dark Horse, Oni, and others.

I'm a 17 year old girl, and I read American superhero comics. Not Wonder Woman or Supergirl, either. This dismissal of the superhero genre all having bad art is preposterous too. Are you saying that Karl Kerschl has the same art style as Bruce Timm or Rafael Albuquerque?
Lots of girls read and enjoy the more 'male oriented' superhero comics. What we don't enjoy is shoddy writing. Both American comics and manga have that in spades.
And I don't want pure romance. In manga, most of the romance I've seen is contrived. I want good characters that, even if I can't relate to them entirely, I can completely empathize with them (Jaime Reyes as the Blue Beetle, for example.)
And those anime-style figurines creep me right the hell out, excepting Batgirl. What did they do to Power Girl? She's a valued member of the JSA, and there she looks like some idiot child.

I'm kinda surprised he used the (bad) example that way, he could have said something about the Japanese version of Christmas, which is a commercial holiday for couples.

I think he meant the eggs in combination with the sausages, but isn't that more of a British thing?

Anyway, I'll try to explain it to mdo7 again.
1.We do not hate the comics you call OEL manga
2. What we do not like is the marketing of said comics
There's a difference, understood?

Why do we not like the marketing scheme:
-The marketing suggests that the word "manga" is needed in order to sell comics
-Many manga fans believe Japanese comics are superiour to comics from other countries and the OEL marketing strategy is making use of this
-People are twisting the common definition of the word (manga = Japanese comics) to suit their own needs, which causes a lot of confusion.

That's an asinine argument. By your logic, English belongs to German which belongs to Germany but Germany used to be the Holy Roman Empire so it should actually be Latin but wait that's a dead language so we should instead speak Italian.

We are basing our argument on the "manga = Japanese comics" definition. This is a very clear definition, since the word manga only says something about the country of origin.

mdo7, your argument is based on the "manga = artstyle" idea, but this argument will only work if you can define this style. The definition of this manga style is the foundation of your argument. If you do not provide a definition, your whole argument will collapse.

This is what you could do to support your argument:
-Give a written definition of "manga style" (extremely difficult)
-Provide examples of comics drawn "manga style" (shouldn't be to difficult, if you have punt some thought in this manga = artstyle idea)

I know they don't call it OEL manga anymore, but I still call it OEL manga because I think it sounds fitting to me. It's not a scam man. If you say that, that means all the Grand Theft Auto clones video game are nothing but scam, some games like True Crime, Scarface: The world is yours, The Godfather game, and Mafia should've got bad ratings and gameplays.

I do have a religion, it's called buddhism. If you never have heard of it, that religion is also in Japan (along with Asia) along with Shinto, and Daoism. If OEL manga is harming the industry why is the manga still selling when OEL is doing bad or worse or OK. There are many people beside me who like OEL manga. See this is why I called you "Jack Thompson" earlier, because you're saying that OEL manga is harming the industry. Well, how come Japanese manga along with OEL manga isn't dead yet. How come manga are still doing good. Just like how Jack said that Cho play Counter-Strike (which he never or maybe once played), and also said that 80% of college student played video game and said video game are danger, so how come those 80% hasn't commit School shooting. That's prove both you and Jack Thompson have no true cause and effect.

I grew up with DC and Marvel. Never heard of Gail Simone.

I believe ya, Tamaria. When I first saw this forum. All I see from the tone of the message in a hateful kind of way. Even the title sounded a little bit hateful. I keep seeing people from page 1 saying that they shouldn't be called manga. They said that they should let Japan do the manga, America stay out. I see death to these people when I kept reading. It makes me upset, that's why I wanted to get involved.

I know you don't like the marketing scheme that OEL manga is doing. There are good and bad marketing schemes in a lot of industry. So what, there are marketing scheme like this before, but not only in manga. But in video game, TV, Internet, and other entertainment. It's like that. Let me show you:

Blah
Blah
Blah

Tamaria, OEL manga is just a marketing scheme just like other media do. It's how economy and stuff works. So far, I like the marketing OEL manga. I don't see it offending me and other people who like seeing OEL manga. I know some or more people don't like the name OEL manga. But I do and so do other people. I'm not forcing people to call it OEL manga. You don't have to like it or it's marketing scheme.

one last thing:

SharinganEyes wrote:

That's an asinine argument. By your logic, English belongs to German which belongs to Germany but Germany used to be the Holy Roman Empire so it should actually be Latin but wait that's a dead language so we should instead speak Italian.

Che va bene con me, penso che l'italiano è qualcosa di fresco e mi piace parlare accanto inglese. (Translation: That's fine with me, I think Italian is cool and something I like to speak beside English.)

What's wrong with adding manga as another loanword? One loanword can't hurt anyone.

Xenos wrote:

Yes, and why are those anime and manga? They were produced IN JAPAN.

Yes all of them are produced in Japan. But they all have western origin, did you forget that. Captain Future, Little Lulu, Batman, and Spawn were originally Western. Japan adapted these anime and manga. Saying " X-men like something that it's not", is just like you don't want to see Little Lulu, and Captain Future as a anime (it's already been done).

I know they don't call it OEL manga anymore, but I still call it OEL manga because I think it sounds fitting to me. It's not a scam man. If you say that, that means all the Grand Theft Auto clones video game are nothing but scam, some games like True Crime, Scarface: The world is yours, The Godfather game, and Mafia should've got bad ratings and gameplays.

I do have a religion, it's called buddhism. If you never have heard of it, that religion is also in Japan (along with Asia) along with Shinto, and Daoism. If OEL manga is harming the industry why is the manga still selling when OEL is doing bad or worse or OK.

There are many people beside me who like OEL manga.

See this is why I called you "Jack Thompson" earlier, because you're saying that OEL manga is harming the industry. Well, how come Japanese manga along with OEL manga isn't dead yet. How come manga are still doing good. Just like how Jack said that Cho play Counter-Strike (which he never or maybe once played), and also said that 80% of college student played video game and said video game are danger, so how come those 80% hasn't commit School shooting. That's prove both you and Jack Thompson have no true cause and effect.

Quote:

Someone needs to read the works of Gail Simone and other fan favorite writers who can write strong female characters. Plus a bigger problem is that comics in general were not sold to the general populace like in Japan. In order to survive they sadly had to become this niche market for superheros. Do you even know the history of comics in America? Do you know about Wetham? Do you know why books were forced into the superhero genre?

I grew up with DC and Marvel. Never heard of Gail Simone.

Quote:

You think you know what girls want? You think you know romance? This from the guy promoting the harem genre?

So James Bond movie and the Notebook didn't teach me how to be good with girls. That's strange, I had a lot of girls liking me and all of them said they like me because I know how girls operate. I also help guys how to treat girls nicely. Xenos, do you have any girlfriends or does your girlfriends doesnt want you to do anything racy.

It's called a "What if". I guess many DC Comic fan who are also anime/manga fan wanted to know what their favorite DC comic superheroines would look like as anime/manga? That's why they make those figurines for, to answer their questions.

Quote:

That does raise a good point about the core audience for Marvel and DC. Though, again it ignores the growing readership at other publishers with diverse books like Image, Dark Horse, Oni, and others.

At least that something we can agree on.

Infinitebeauty wrote:

I'm a 17 year old girl, and I read American superhero comics. Not Wonder Woman or Supergirl, either. This dismissal of the superhero genre all having bad art is preposterous too. Are you saying that Karl Kerschl has the same art style as Bruce Timm or Rafael Albuquerque? Lots of girls read and enjoy the more 'male oriented' superhero comics. What we don't enjoy is shoddy writing. Both American comics and manga have that in spades. And I don't want pure romance. In manga, most of the romance I've seen is contrived. I want good characters that, even if I can't relate to them entirely, I can completely empathize with them (Jaime Reyes as the Blue Beetle, for example.) And those anime-style figurines creep me right the hell out, excepting Batgirl. What did they do to Power Girl? She's a valued member of the JSA, and there she looks like some idiot child.

Well, I guess there are still girls who read male superhero comic. I guess I got that wrong for this part. About that figurines, as I said it's called a "What if". you might not like it, some other people might like it.

Tamaria wrote:

I'm kinda surprised he used the (bad) example that way, he could have said something about the Japanese version of Christmas, which is a commercial holiday for couples.

Yeah, I should've used that instead of what I said.

Quote:

I think he meant the eggs in combination with the sausages, but isn't that more of a British thing?

Whoops, made a little mistake there. But the ice cream I know is 100% true American food.

I believe ya, Tamaria. When I first saw this forum. All I see from the tone of the message in a hateful kind of way. Even the title sounded a little bit hateful. I keep seeing people from page 1 saying that they shouldn't be called manga. They said that they should let Japan do the manga, America stay out. I see death to these people when I kept reading. It makes me upset, that's why I wanted to get involved.

I know you don't like the marketing scheme that OEL manga is doing. There are good and bad marketing schemes in a lot of industry. So what, there are marketing scheme like this before, but not only in manga. But in video game, TV, Internet, and other entertainment. It's like that. Let me show you:
-Grand Theft Auto 3 and so on: Since GTA 3, a lot of "GTA Clones" such as True Crime, Driver 3, Scarface: The world is yours, The Godfather, Total Overdose, Crackdown, and Saint Rows. Most of them did good (not counting Driver 3, 187 Ride or Die)
-Street Fighter 2: What happen after Street Fighter 2? We got games cashing in on success like Fatal Fury, Final Fight, even Mortal Kombat was a "Street Fighter clones" but with blood & gores.

-Medal of Honor and WW2 games: After MOH did well, games like Call of Duty, Return to Castle Wolfenstein, Brothers in Arms, and other WW2 games cash in on success.

-Kingdom Hearts 2 and crossover video game marketing: After KH2, we just have a sudden rise on crossover games. Like Mario & Sonic at the olympic, Chaos War (a crossover of multiple licensed characters), Soul Calibur 4 with Star War character, then MK vs DC superheroes.

-superheroes flick: After Spiderman and X-men did their success, a lot of other superheroes flick join in to the market, they revive Batman and Superman after few years of hiatus, but still looking good as ever. There were some not good superheroes flick like Elecktra, Daredevil, Hulk (which was given a second chance as the Incredible Hulk). The Dark Knight did really well during the "superheroes flicks fad"

Myspace: After the popularity of Myspace, other webste decided to use this scheme. Facebook, Xanga, Friendster and other "myspace clones" were created to put their success along with Myspace. So far and I think, Facebook is the best "myspace clones" up to date.

Tamaria, OEL manga is just a marketing scheme just like other media do. It's how economy and stuff works. So far, I like the marketing OEL manga. I don't see it offending me and other people who like seeing OEL manga. I know some or more people don't like the name OEL manga. But I do and so do other people. I'm not forcing people to call it OEL manga. You don't have to like it or it's marketing scheme.

Japan has marketing scheme also. Like after the mecha, Mazinger Z. A lot of super-robot anime was created to cash in on the success. But a lot of super robot anime that cash in on Mazinger Z were mostly good in Japan. This is how market work, you either like it or hate it.

Don't forget there are other marketing scheme when anime/manga are getting popular, like:
-Jeopardy has a category on anime in June

-Kanye West's "Stronger" music video was influenced by Akira (West stated he's a anime fan)

-Madonna music video (I forgot the name of the title), she cosplay as Mello from Deathnote.

-Deathnote will be parody in a The Simpson comic.

Tamaria, this is a part of the fad. Just like anything else. OEL manga are part of the anime/manga fad for American pop culture. This market is trying to get anime/manga out of "niche" territory and on to pop culture.

Xenos, if you've been saying that OEL manga is a scam, so that's means:
-Mortal Kombat should be forgotten because it's a Street Fighter clones.
-Jason Voorhees, Freddy Krueger, Pinhead, and Ghostface should not be on the horror movie icon because they are "scam" from Michael Myers.
-All "GTA clones" are crap, only GTA is the best "go anywhere" game.
-All myspace clones should not have been created, that include Facebook, the most popular "myspace clones".
-Madonna and Kanye West should be hated even from their fan because they had anime influence and references in their music video.

If that's what you mean. I guess that means all people around you are stupid because they are liking this market scheme including OEL manga. That's make you more intelligent then other, so that's saying people have low IQ because they are getting involved with this scam you said. I guess it means you, SharinganEyes, and Moomintroll don't like this scam not only OEL manga, but video game.

I'm trying to come up with a good definition of "manga=Artstyle". Just give me more time, but I'll tell you this.

We use loanword all the time. we use word like Coup d'etat (french), Protege (French also), and..well you get the idea. Even the word corridor came from the italian word corridoio. Even Japanese have loanword also, Komikku come from the work comic. What's wrong with adding manga as another loanword? One loanword can't hurt anyone.

So Xenos, if we can't use the word manga on OEL manga. That means we're not allow to use the word protege. OK, let use the word "smart-ass" to replace protege since loanword like manga is bad and other loanword is bad, we might as well be creative for our language.

Tamaria, this is a part of the fad. Just like anything else. OEL manga are part of the anime/manga fad for American pop culture. This market is trying to get anime/manga out of "niche" territory and on to pop culture.