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20 Years of KareKano


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prime_pm



Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Posts: 2013
Location: Your Mother's Bedroom
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 12:13 pm Reply with quote
I saw this show at my very first Otakon in 2000. Back then they ran the entire damn series, albeit in sections, from Friday through Sunday, and even replayed the first four episodes out of popular demand. Never before had I witnessed an anime so fun and innovative (and confusing as I got to the end, as opposed to Serial Experiment Lain which was just confusing beginning to end). Then it introduced me to Evangelion and the rest is history.

And holy shit! 2000th post! Very Happy
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rizuchan
Collector ExtraordinaireCollector Extraordinaire


Joined: 11 Mar 2007
Posts: 800
Location: Kansas
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 12:33 pm Reply with quote
Jesus Christ, I knew that the story turned... problematic, but until I read that Anime Feminist article I had no idea how bad the story really got.

I can't blame Anno at all for wanting to change the story, even just little nudges, to give Yukino some happiness. She deserved it. I never got to read the manga (I read the first volume, but it got hard to track down the rest), but when I heard echoes of how the story ends, which was consistent with the direction the final episodes of the anime alluded to... I was too angry to ever seek out the rest of it. 90s Shoujo manga just seemed to love spoiler[knocking up] their middle/high school protagonists and calling it "happily ever after". That's bad enough, but Kare Kano had to make the love interest an abuser to boot.

Anyway, great anime though. Laughing
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invalidname
Get off my lawn!Get off my lawn!


Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 1915
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 12:44 pm Reply with quote
rizuchan wrote:
I never got to read the manga (I read the first volume, but it got hard to track down the rest), but when I heard echoes of how the story ends, which was consistent with the direction the final episodes of the anime alluded to... I was too angry to ever seek out the rest of it.

Problematic though it may be, it’s a shame the KareKano manga is OOP and hard to find (I have like ⅓ of it, irregularly grouped). I keep expecting someone to license-rescue it sooner or later, and it keeps on not happening.
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Marzan



Joined: 29 Mar 2009
Posts: 358
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:10 pm Reply with quote
Kare Kano is the series that really opened up anime in all its possibilites for me. Before KK, I'd only watched old 70's 80's stuff and if it was modern, it was either mecha, sci-fi or dystopian. After enjoying the bejeesus out of Kare Kano (with all its faults and non existing ending) I started daring venture into shoujo and high school based stuff.
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Zhou-BR



Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Posts: 892
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:17 pm Reply with quote
I love this adaptation, incomplete as it is, and I intend to import the Japanese BD-box that just got announced, even I though I strongly suspect it will be upscaled from an SD video source.

As long as we don't get an official explanation from Anno, we'll have to keep speculating on why he left the show and when, but I applaud this article's writer for doing such thorough research on the many possible explanations, and for not buying blindly into the unsubstantiated claim that Kazuya Tsurumaki directed the show from episode 19 on.
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relyat08



Joined: 20 Mar 2013
Posts: 4086
Location: Northern Virginia
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:50 pm Reply with quote
It may seems sort of nitpicky, but I was confused when you referred to Tsuda as the manga artist, rather than the original creator, aka, both artist and author. Considering how many manga are a team with both an artist and an author, it might be worth specifying.

Anyway, I really loved this anime. I bought the entire manga, but never got to reading it before I sold it several months ago, and I don't know if I actually want to. Unlike a lot of people, I was pretty happy with where the anime stopped, it didn't feel that inconclusive, and was fitting for the story regardless. And as much as I am a fan of psychological content, and heavy emotional stuff, I don't know how much I really wanted to continue seeing the two of those kids suffer. I grew madly attached to both of them and related to them super intimately.
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Barciad



Joined: 11 May 2004
Posts: 94
Location: St Andrews
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:53 pm Reply with quote
One of my top ten anime of all time. So well written. So willing to go out and to take risks. Someone described it as 'opening up the mind and looking at all the naughty bits inside'. And above all was the way that (especially early one) rather than feel shame in its brazen cynicism, it positively glorified in it.
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whiskeyii



Joined: 29 May 2013
Posts: 1566
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:57 pm Reply with quote
At last, I finally know why Tsuda disliked the anime (though I honestly thought the popsicle stick puppet episode was a standout in terms of sheer hilarity and creativity). I feel like there was some kind of "epilogue" episode where we got confirmation that Yukino got pregnant as a teenager and the best friend fell for her daughter, but that's about all I remember of the ending.

I did once binge all of KareKano at a birthday party when I was also in middle school; I remember liking the characters and the comedy, but the romance, not so much. I don't know what it was, but something about Arima bothered the crap out of me, and their relationship never felt like it really jived with me. I kept wanting Yukino to strike out her own or something. Laughing
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John Thacker
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Joined: 28 Oct 2013
Posts: 706
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:42 pm Reply with quote
Should make people uncomfortable, absolutely, but I don't see how the manga is problematic. It depicts people with issues and sometimes flawed responses to it. I suppose for people who hate anything other than idealized representations it's a problem.
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reanimator



Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 1249
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 7:55 pm Reply with quote
Okay..time for me to check KareKano Japanese LD Box and check its liner notes when I visit my parents this holiday.

Speaking of Hideaki Anno, Anime Style's Yuuichiro Oguro did in-depth, 20,000 word interview with Hideaki Anno in 1999 and it's been published in the book for several years.

Source:
Anime Creator's Interview: I want to hear his/her Story 2001-2002
アニメクリエイター・インタビューズ この人に話を聞きたい 2001-2002 新書 – 2011/1/26
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Kicksville



Joined: 20 Nov 2010
Posts: 633
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 10:38 pm Reply with quote
When I think of the best anime of the 90's, this is one of the titles that floats around, which is saying something. For all the production problems and over the top comedy bits, there's a realness to it that's rare in, well, anything.

The stuff the manga gets into later would be more interesting to talk about if it weren't such dime novel pablum - just melodramatic indulgence at that point.
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animefan1238



Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 243
Location: Ma
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 11:42 pm Reply with quote
This was my first rom-com and bought the show as it was coming out on DVD. As a young teen I strived to have a connection with some girl like how they clicked especially early in their romance. Also how Yukino grows as a person got to me as well. She started to become her true self. It took me until junior year to truly be my true self. Wearing Inuyasha Beads of Subjugation all through senior year and finally having that person to love. In a way I have to thank that show. Great show and the opening song is the ring tone for my wife. Love that song.
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CatSword



Joined: 01 Jul 2014
Posts: 1178
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 12:42 am Reply with quote
I'd love a remake or continuation of the Kare Kano anime. I watched it earlier this year (Starz, of all places, has it for streaming/on demand) and thought it was quite good up until the last handful of episodes, in which Yukino and Arima's relationship stopped developing entirely in favor of a side story.
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all-tsun-and-no-dere



Joined: 06 Jul 2015
Posts: 50
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 1:16 am Reply with quote
CatSword wrote:
I'd love a remake or continuation of the Kare Kano anime. I watched it earlier this year (Starz, of all places, has it for streaming/on demand) and thought it was quite good up until the last handful of episodes, in which Yukino and Arima's relationship stopped developing entirely in favor of a side story.


I'd support a continuation up until the conclusion of the arc it ended on, and no further. The manga doesn't really have anything worth continuing after that. Now, if it ended up departing completely from the manga and ended with Yukino dumping Arima for being a possessive, controlling trash heap... I'd watch it.

As for a remake? I'm pretty opposed. The Kare Kano manga, at least up until a point, was good but not great and not particularly remarkable for its time. Anno's direction elevated the material and is what made the anime such a landmark series. There are so many more interesting and unique 90's shoujo series that could do with a new adaptation instead!
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Errinundra
Moderator


Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Posts: 5042
Location: Melbourne, Oz
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 8:11 am Reply with quote
John Thacker wrote:
Should make people uncomfortable, absolutely, but I don't see how the manga is problematic. It depicts people with issues and sometimes flawed responses to it. I suppose for people who hate anything other than idealized representations it's a problem.


That last comment is uncalled for. Post about the anime or manga, not their viewers or readers.
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