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NEWS: Takeshobo, Manga Creator Sue Cloudflare for Offering Service to Piracy Sites


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Zimmer



Joined: 08 Jul 2015
Posts: 59
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 4:07 am Reply with quote
So anyone have a guess for which creator?
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ErikaD.D



Joined: 09 Jun 2019
Posts: 181
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 4:12 am Reply with quote
Zimmer wrote:
So anyone have a guess for which creator?

Maybe the manga author who works for WSJ(Shueisha)?
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Netero



Joined: 10 Jun 2018
Posts: 42
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 4:20 am Reply with quote
So are they going to sue Sprint, Verizon and AT&T next for enabling piracy, or maybe Western Digital and Seagate?
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GeorgH



Joined: 15 Mar 2016
Posts: 41
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:00 am Reply with quote
Netero wrote:
So are they going to sue Sprint, Verizon and AT&T next for enabling piracy

The main difference between Cloudflare and ISP is, that Cloudflare makes it impossible to take action against the sites, as one can't identify who is behind them (operator or hoster).
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Kougeru



Joined: 13 May 2008
Posts: 4551
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:09 am Reply with quote
Good luck with that. That's like sueing a landlord because someone is selling drugs out of a property they're renting out. They can't keep an eye on literally every site they host, that's unrealistic. All they can do is react to reported sites and even then only if they're legally obligated to from a court order (otherwise false claims could be used to shut down sites people didn't agree with).
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Blanchimont



Joined: 25 Feb 2012
Posts: 1972
Location: Finland
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:38 am Reply with quote
Wonder if this has anything to do with the recent spat between Viz and a prolific manga-aggregator site(disclaimer, I also use it) or if it's just a strange coincidence?;
https://torrentfreak.com/mangadex-targeted-by-dmca-subpoena-now-migrating-servers-200103/
https://torrentfreak.com/mangadex-returns-under-a-new-domain-confirms-legal-issues-200106/

Apparently the reason for the spat was a chapter of Boruto, someone uploaded a fan-colored version of an official chapter. Site's rules prohibit uploading official rips (the site is basically the successor/improved version of another now defunct site whose name started with 'B'), but by the time it was taken down the damage was already done...
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mgosdin



Joined: 17 Jul 2011
Posts: 1291
Location: Kissimmee, Florida, USA
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:10 am Reply with quote
I believe U.S. law is structured in such a fashion that ISP's are not responsible for the content they deliver. I rather doubt that this lawsuit will gain much traction, however it will make money for various lawyers...

Mark Gosdin
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ErikaD.D



Joined: 09 Jun 2019
Posts: 181
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:30 am Reply with quote
Blanchimont wrote:
Wonder if this has anything to do with the recent spat between Viz and a prolific manga-aggregator site(disclaimer, I also use it) or if it's just a strange coincidence?;
https://torrentfreak.com/mangadex-targeted-by-dmca-subpoena-now-migrating-servers-200103/
https://torrentfreak.com/mangadex-returns-under-a-new-domain-confirms-legal-issues-200106/

Apparently the reason for the spat was a chapter of Boruto, someone uploaded a fan-colored version of an official chapter. Site's rules prohibit uploading official rips (the site is basically the successor/improved version of another now defunct site whose name started with 'B'), but by the time it was taken down the damage was already done...

Off topic, and Viz should fix official English languages on mangas in their legal sites like MangaPlus. But Viz won't use cursed words in English versions because it's a taboo.
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Blanchimont



Joined: 25 Feb 2012
Posts: 1972
Location: Finland
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:27 am Reply with quote
ErikaD.D wrote:
Off topic...

Off topic? Confused Two incidents involving manga sites and and official entities happen within days of each other and I ask if there's any connection, and a little background.
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Tenbyakugon



Joined: 11 Jan 2012
Posts: 710
Location: Michigan, United States
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:00 am Reply with quote
So you can’t just sue a business because they provided their services to an unethical business. Only if that providence itself is legally outlawed could you, so good luck.
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Chrono1000



Joined: 05 Oct 2013
Posts: 1398
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:04 pm Reply with quote
mgosdin wrote:
I believe U.S. law is structured in such a fashion that ISP's are not responsible for the content they deliver. I rather doubt that this lawsuit will gain much traction, however it will make money for various lawyers...

Cloudflare is not an ISP that delivers internet to customers but a service that protects websites and they have deplatformed websites that they dislike so there is a strong legal case against them for supporting websites that allow for the illegal download of copyrighted content. I am somewhat surprised that it took this long for someone to sue Cloudflare since they are complicit in copyright infringement and I don't even see how they could argue against that in court.

Tenbyakugon wrote:
So you can’t just sue a business because they provided their services to an unethical business. Only if that providence itself is legally outlawed could you, so good luck.

Manga piracy websites are illegal because of copyright infringement.
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Stampeed Valkyrie



Joined: 10 Aug 2014
Posts: 617
Location: PA
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:17 pm Reply with quote
Chrono1000 wrote:
mgosdin wrote:
I believe U.S. law is structured in such a fashion that ISP's are not responsible for the content they deliver. I rather doubt that this lawsuit will gain much traction, however it will make money for various lawyers...

Cloudflare is not an ISP that delivers internet to customers but a service that protects websites and they have deplatformed websites that they dislike so there is a strong legal case against them for supporting websites that allow for the illegal download of copyrighted content. I am somewhat surprised that it took this long for someone to sue Cloudflare since they are complicit in copyright infringement and I don't even see how they could argue against that in court.


They can and they will. I'd recommend a little bit of googling and some basic law primer and you can see several avenues available.

As mentioned previously I foresee this getting tossed. But when it comes to law weird things happen frequently.
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DavetheUsher



Joined: 19 May 2014
Posts: 243
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 1:10 pm Reply with quote
Chrono1000 wrote:
[Manga piracy websites are illegal because of copyright infringement.


Manga piracy ain't close to the top of the list of illegal stuff Cloudflare works with. They provide service for lots of illegal activities and groups so a manga company being the one to try to sue them is kinda silly when you think about it.
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Tenbyakugon



Joined: 11 Jan 2012
Posts: 710
Location: Michigan, United States
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 1:40 pm Reply with quote
Chrono1000 wrote:
Tenbyakugon wrote:
So you can’t just sue a business because they provided their services to an unethical business. Only if that providence itself is legally outlawed could you, so good luck.

Manga piracy websites are illegal because of copyright infringement.


Obviously, but I mean that the law likely does not forbid CloudFlare from providing its services despite that.
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Chrono1000



Joined: 05 Oct 2013
Posts: 1398
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 2:52 pm Reply with quote
Stampeed Valkyrie wrote:
They can and they will. I'd recommend a little bit of googling and some basic law primer and you can see several avenues available.

Well limiting it to the legal systems of Japan and the United States how would Cloudflare supporting manga piracy websites be legal? Their service is protecting piracy websites that profit from copyrighted manga and it would be no different than if they were protecting piracy websites that stream Hollywood movies. Cloudflare has been careful not to anger the MPAA but they ignored manga piracy websites since they were getting money and didn't think that anyone would take them to court.

DavetheUsher wrote:
Manga piracy ain't close to the top of the list of illegal stuff Cloudflare works with. They provide service for lots of illegal activities and groups so a manga company being the one to try to sue them is kinda silly when you think about it.

Sure, and it is amusing that being complicit to copyright infringement is why Cloudfare gets taken to court but it is one of the easier crimes to seek damages over since it is a civil lawsuit.
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