Forum - View topicNEWS: Used Book Chain Offers 100M Yen to Manga, Book Authors
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samuelp
Industry Insider
Posts: 2231 Location: San Antonio, USA |
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100 million yen? That's it? 1 million bucks?
What's the total size of the manga market in Japan, 5 billion dollars (last time I checked, that was about right)? So they're going to pay them a whopping 1 million? That's pure symbolism. They might as well call it "reparations". If I were the book publishers I'd tell them I'd rather they send homemade cookies or something, at least then I'd know they were sincere about it  .
So if you take this payment as future precedent for copyright negotiations assuming first-sale law gets overturned, then this means that you'd need to pay only 0.02 percent extra than before. Aha... now I see why they are doing this. Although it might seem a hollow gesture now, it sets a negotiating precedent for the future... The used bookstores can claim that the publishers accepted the 0.02 percent rate in the past and use that as a negotiating chip for the perhaps eventual legal fight. It's true, though.... When everything goes digital, is there even such a thing as a "used" product? If a blu-ray really lasts for 100 years, is it any less valuable as long as all the 0s and 1s are intact? |
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domino
 Posts: 373 |
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And even with the lower used prices, Bookoff is more like a library than a bookstore... people just stand in the aisles, read their manga, then leave without buying them. Every time I buy from Bookoff I feel like I'm stealing from a public library...
And with libraries and manga cafes also in the picture, it really must be hard on manga publishers... |
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Fronzel
Posts: 1906 |
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I don't have much sympathey for publishers in this kind of situation. They have a copyright, and nothing's been copied.
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DavidShallcross
 Posts: 1008 |
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As someone who has bought a lot of books over the years, both new and used, I believe any weakening of the first sale doctrine to be a bad thing.
Remember Darth Brooks a few years ago, who tried to end the market in used CDs? But DVDs, at least, can suffer scratches that destroy entire scenes. (I am going to reconsider buying used DVDs over the internet.) |
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britannicamoore
 Posts: 2618 Location: Out. |
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This is whining if 've ever seen it. Used books sales? people bought the book once, or its damaged so if its resold it shouldn't be that big of a deal.
They're just being greedy now. You can't even sale used books. Sheesh. |
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BellosTheMighty
 Posts: 767 |
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Whining, no. Much worse, potentially. If they jump from stopping fansubs to attacking used bookstores, that appears to me to be indicative of a moral panic.
But, that's just a theory- and from a guy who learns about this stuff from the 'net. Is there a genuine sociologist in the house? It could also just be someone's idea of an April Fool's Joke, of course. This is why I traditionally just lurk the Internet on April 1... |
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SalarymanJoe
 Posts: 468 Location: Atlanta, GA, USA |
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I really hope this is an April Fool's joke. Sadly, though, it's about the most believable one I've heard today.
If it's not, I don't really think I can find words to express my irritation over something like this. As someone who's defended publishers/content providers for going after and enforcing copyrights this is getting ridiculous now. |
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Turkishproverb
Posts: 43 Location: Pergatorio. |
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If this isn't an april fools joke, I am goign to be nine levels of pissed at the sheer stupidity of the world around me.
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DavidShallcross
Posts: 1008 |
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The quoted source article on Asahi Shimbun's web site says something about BookOff using those numbers of yen, but I can't read most of it. Do the Japanese do April Fools? |
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kokuryu
 Posts: 915 |
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This will kill the manga market totally if they want residuals from USED products! That is NUTS! They got what they should have gotten from the initial payment of the item - if it changes hands, they dont get to second dip again. What type of stupidity is that? If people are able to buy it used in such quantities that it affects new book sales, what does that say? That says that PEOPLE DONT LIKE THE BOOKS ENOUGH TO KEEP THEM!!! Instead of blaming others like usual, they should look unto themselves and fix what is wrong with their own stuff first.
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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What also should be considered is books that are now out of print. Where else are you going to find out of print books, since you won't find them at a regular bookstore? This is a case of people wanting more money, but I think that in this case, Bookoff is probably shrugging this one off. The amount is not a lot compared to what they're making. Now the big thing from here is how will customers of Bookoff take this little event? And what about people who sell used stuff on Ebay? Are the authors going to go after them now?
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Hon'ya-chan
 Posts: 973 |
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It's a stupid idea to say the least. It's like saying that the auto manufacturer of your car comes by 10 years later, and demands you to pay the Original sticker price on your car.
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samuelp
Industry Insider
Posts: 2231 Location: San Antonio, USA |
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Wait just a second here. I hate to argue this side but that's an unfair comparison. Say I buy a copy of "naruto vol 1" new, read it, enjoy it. Now let's pretend I bought that volume used for half the price... would I enjoy reading it any less? It might last me a bit less when it comes to multiple readings, but at least for manga, I don't expect those types of cheap books to last for years anyway, really. With a car, there is a definite, palpable decrease in value as the car is used. Things begin to break, the interior deteriorates, the engine/transmission slowly break down due to wear. All those things directly effect the performance and enjoyment one gets out of the product. Whereas, if I compare the enjoyment I get out of a used manga volume from a new one, it's nearly the same, if not exactly. So, while I agree with the principle of first-sale because I also believe that the physical object itself has inherent value (possessing it enables multiple readings, for example), I can also see where in a digital world, the concept of the physical object might disappear and first-sale doctrine may have to be abandoned. |
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SalarymanJoe
Posts: 468 Location: Atlanta, GA, USA |
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I'm going to disagree on that point. The reason something goes out of print is that it has succeeded the law of diminishing returns. Why should printers keep printing a book indefinitely, even though there's no return on that investment? Used books, brought to the marketplace by private individuals should have the money go to those individuals, the printer/publisher is merely trying to double-dip without producing a new product. Also, what about used books that are still in print? A book like Lord of the Rings has had several printings since first publication and its two major waves of popularity, but I'm sure if I looked hard enough, I could find different used copies. They shouldn't be taxed extra, according to your theory, but Brunner's The Shockwave Rider should be?
Even though the amount is low, BookOff even entertaining the thought with a small amount of cash sets a dangerous precedent. If BookOff begins to entertain this idea, publishers might begin seeking out exclusive deals to have their product sold to BookOff eithre from warehouse or from other chain stores (returned products, etc.), knowing that they'll get the kick-back. It could hurt operations of competitors who don't have an advantageous deal worked out, which will lead them to copy-cat measures and could end up resulting in higher prices. As far as eBay sellers or other auctioneers who operate a "store" on the site, I could see them being next on the list, if the BookOff deal is more successful in the future but I think going after individuals selling off their private property is a bit much. |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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If I recall correctly this has been an issue in Japan for a long time now.
Also, those of you getting yourselves all whipped up into a frothing OUTRAGE!!!! over this need to settle down a bit. |
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