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MsAdultPerson



Joined: 23 Jul 2010
Posts: 17
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 2:12 pm Reply with quote
I don't know what you're talking about, that video from the flake of the week was GOLD!
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prime_pm



Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Posts: 2078
Location: Your Mother's Bedroom
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 2:54 pm Reply with quote
MsAdultPerson wrote:
I don't know what you're talking about, that video from the flake of the week was GOLD!


...

*bitch slap*
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CCSYueh



Joined: 03 Jul 2004
Posts: 2707
Location: San Diego, CA
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 2:57 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
Look, here's my take on this: the only job the fans have, the ONLY one, is to support the things that they like.


Thank you.
That is THE MOST succinct answer on the subject.

The companies present the product.
Fans buy it.
Companies re-package the popular stuff again & again & again. (I could not believe my daughter when she informed me even though she knew Cameron was planning to release a super-duper Avatar set around August she was at Best Buy at midnight for the first BluRay & is set to get that special set. Director's cut/Special edition/whatever else-they're just another way of getting those registers ringing). It's what they do. It can be frustrating, but it's how it's been done forever.
We don't have to fall for everything. I remember somewhere in one of the countless Beatles documentaries I've seen a comment on Beatle sheets not selling well (actual squares of hotel sheets they slept on cut into 1-inch squares)
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MarthaC



Joined: 20 May 2006
Posts: 35
Location: U.S.A.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 3:00 pm Reply with quote
For now, forget about the Kindle for manga. I got it recently, (thanks to the lower price) and not only are the manga choices skimpy indeed, but it looked like most of the choices were from the "Adult" section of the store!
However, I was able to get for free some 19th century and early 20th century writings on Japan. Good times! Wink
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prime_pm



Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Posts: 2078
Location: Your Mother's Bedroom
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 3:14 pm Reply with quote
For me, I enjoy the feel of a good, weighty book in my hands, the touch of thin sheet paper as I turn each page.

Not the feeling of carrying a $200+ piece of reading material on a public bus.

Now, I still find the concept intriguing, however, as it opens up an alternate avenue of legally reading manga on your computer. I just hope they can work out all the kinks with distribution and whatnot. Because the Kindle's pc software reader is a tad bit confusing.

And that's one problem with legalized online manga: any distributor is going to want people to use their own software to read their own material, not our own programs like Windows Picture and Fax Viewer. Because everyone remembers what killed the Atari other than ET. Distributors are going to make sure their work stays licensed somehow. (other businesses may differently apply, I'm not sure)

Just look at Ubisoft.
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Penguin_Factory



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 732
Location: Ireland
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 3:29 pm Reply with quote
On the subject of E-readers and manga, if the infrastructure was up for a wide range of manga to be purchased digitally, I would totally buy an E-reader to use it. Make it happen, manga publishers.
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sailorneorune



Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 104
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 4:03 pm Reply with quote
I have a Kindle, and I will definitely say the manga offerings are slim at best. You have your extremes on the Sturgeon's Law Spectrum - one side has the Vampire Hunter D manga adaptations, the other side is badly-drawn, badly-written OEL yaoi-fantasy schlock. There is very little in between, and this knowledge makes me sad. I'd love to re-read Fullmetal Alchemist without digging the missing volumes out of my garage or forcefully retrieving them from my equally nerdy boss. I'd love to get the out-of-print stuff like Maison Ikkoku and Boys Over Flowers without having to give up a substantial portion of my paycheck to some vulture on ebay. Okay, I admit I already have HanaDan in book format, but I'd love to see other people be able to read it and maybe save some space on my bookshelf.

The manga from one of Jason Thompson's earlier House of 1000 Manga columns, Kazan, is available in e-book format, but sadly it will not work on the reader I have. This defeats the purpose of having one. Sad

I'd like to hear from the publishers on making manga available for portable-reader use. I think it would work, especially for those of us who are lacking in the shelf space department.
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edzieba



Joined: 13 Dec 2006
Posts: 704
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 4:31 pm Reply with quote
My chief beef with the current crop of e-readers is the resolution: it's far too low for acceptable graphics. The 'standard' 800x600 electrophoretic display is not sufficient for a manga page, and even the Kindle DX's 1200x826 is at the minimum I'd consider for a single page (let alone a two page spread).
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Zin5ki
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Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 6680
Location: London, UK
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 4:34 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
Look, here's my take on this: the only job the fans have, the ONLY one, is to support the things that they like. You like something? Hey, great, support it.

If you don't like something, well then, don't pay for it.

This is certainly agreeable for cases in which a subject is aware of the titles and franchises she likes.

The matter becomes somewhat more complicated, however, for cases in which she is not yet acquainted with a title to the extent that she can claim to like or dislike it.

Is she expected to make a purchase prior to holding an acquaintance with the work she considers? If the normative imperative you put forward is to suffice to govern a fan's behaviour in general, you must supplement it with additional commands accounting for cases such as this.

It is presumed that these supplementary commands would make reference to the legal means by which content can be trialled, though an appeal to these means is hindered by the plentiful instances in which they do not yet exist.

(I might also make mention of titles for which a localised license is either yet to materialise or else practically impossible. In the former case, your maxim could be adhered to once a local release exists, but not typically in the latter.)
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wandering-dreamer



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 1733
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 5:07 pm Reply with quote
I was actually thinking about manga and ereaders the other night, there are a number of series that I read as scanlations which I thought were okay, not horrible but not something I wanted to run out and buy immediately. Plus I'm running out of shelf space so I'd love to be able to buy those series on an ereader (and I'd imagine all the manga companies already have the manga in a digital format for printing purposes). So, somebody, MAKE IT WORK!
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Myaow



Joined: 20 Dec 2007
Posts: 1068
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 5:10 pm Reply with quote
Zin5ki, I think that Brian was pushing for less of a "pay for what you think is good" model than a "pay for what you want to see" one (which is why he used The Expendables as an example; he didn't think it was good, but he wanted to see it with his friend, so he paid for it anyway.)

I often see people on these forums protest that they can never "blind buy" something becase they are determined to only give their ~*~economic vote~*~ only to works of the highest quality, and they can't determine if a show/manga fits that criteria without consuming it for free in its entirety first. But Brian seems to be saying that it's just as legitimate to look at, say, a summary or a review of something you've never watched, and be like "Oh hey, that sounds kinda cool, and I like the genre/director/art style/whutev" and then buy it. You know, putting down money because it looks like it might be interesting, not because you already know first-hand that it is a masterpiece.

Anime publishers seem to be encouraging both models, though: they send out review copies of shows to sites like ANN so that people who buy based on "woah sounds good" can get what they want, and they offer a lot of free streams to R1 viewers so that people who NEED to know that it's totally worth the money can get their fix in a profitable way. Everyone goes home happy!
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CCSYueh



Joined: 03 Jul 2004
Posts: 2707
Location: San Diego, CA
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 5:14 pm Reply with quote
Zin5ki wrote:
The matter becomes somewhat more complicated, however, for cases in which she is not yet acquainted with a title to the extent that she can claim to like or dislike it.

Is she expected to make a purchase prior to holding an acquaintance with the work she considers?

Sort of yes.
God knows it's what I've done most of my 50 yrs on this planet.
Not blind buy but reasonably researched. As they tell one before goingon a car lot-know what you want. Don't shop at the grocery store hungry. Etc. Etc.
There are many, many, MANY other means other than reading the entire book to getting a clue one might like something.
I saw Saiyuki at Best Buy back when-did I want to buy the box+dvd or just the dvd or not at all? I looked around the net for info in the title, looked thru Newtype USA & whatever mags I had on anime & went back before the sale ended to buy that vol 1 dvd (actually should have & did indeed buy the box later).
Reviews, talk on the boards, etc.
Cast & crew do anything else I liked that might also indicate how this would be?
In fact, as someone who has long used cast & director to pick her movies, I find it works a lot for anime. A lot of these VA's do get typecast into certain roles so when one sees them in the cast, one can read up on the plot, look at the rest of the VA's to decide maybe how much money was spent on the title (the more veteran VA's, the more one can assume the felt the title was worth spending some cash on. In the commentary on Area 88, the directotr or producer commented the vets came in & spat out their lines, even complex technical term, in one take while the newbs were the ones who stumbled most often & forced the re-takes. Basically, the longer the credits list over on the encyclopedia side on a VA+ the number of VA's with longer listings outside of man/cop/etc on the title is a good thing. Director, character designs & music affect the look & sound. Atsuko Nakajima did character designs for GetBackers, Princess Princess & Trinity Blood & it shows.
Zin5ki wrote:
(I might also make mention of titles for which a localised license is either yet to materialise or else practically impossible. In the former case, your maxim could be adhered to once a local release exists, but not typically in the latter.)

This one is hard, but realistically it isn't a real good excuse.
When I married my husband one of his favorite movies was Smokey & the Bandit. My vague memory of the plot (which really wasn't all that important. It was a chase movie) was something to do with importing a brand of beer from a state where it was legal to sell it to a state where it wasn't legal to sell the brand. (I believe they considered it a form of bootlegging in the movie, but it's been too long)
With manga & anime, one's options are wait for the license, or buy the legal product from Japan or some other country it is licensed for.

So actually, this also touched on the VA thing.
Back when I was first getting back into anime, I read several interviews on the subject & the reality is VA's in Japan have always had a certain amount of celebrity status. The basic idea around 2002 was anime was usually the land of scab labor pay vs the union pay for American cartoons, but in one interview I saw Bob Bergen, the voice of Porkey Pig, commented that the recognition anime VA's get here in the states was enviable considering most cartoon character VA's were largely unknown to American fans.
Not to mention, just LISTEN to the Japanese VA's with the longer listings. Many are AMAZING. Here we seem to have the director putting his/her mark on the roles at times so even if one likes most of the work by a VA, there's no guarantee one will like the next will be good. I recall the commentary on Gokudo (funny title people. If you missed it, you really missed a good Slayers-style title) the title character VA commented on the director not being happy, then finally picking a voice.
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Moomintroll



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 1600
Location: Nottingham (UK)
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 5:52 pm Reply with quote
Zin5ki wrote:
This is certainly agreeable for cases in which a subject is aware of the titles and franchises she likes.

The matter becomes somewhat more complicated, however, for cases in which she is not yet acquainted with a title to the extent that she can claim to like or dislike it.

Is she expected to make a purchase prior to holding an acquaintance with the work she considers? If the normative imperative you put forward is to suffice to govern a fan's behaviour in general, you must supplement it with additional commands accounting for cases such as this.


You realise there were fans of all sorts of things before the advent of internet piracy?
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belvadeer



Joined: 11 Jun 2006
Posts: 4678
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:00 pm Reply with quote
Beast Player Erin has giant lizards!? Why the heck didn't anyone tell me!? D:
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WolfLoner



Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Posts: 13
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:25 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
I learned about how sites profited running them), but you know what? They are “easy access,” which can lead to reading a bunch of stuff that in retrospect wasn't worth your time.



Quote:
I won't deny that I've done some downloading in the past (I may be buying it now, but I read all of 20th Century Boys in scanlation in less than a week about a year before the first volume came out) or used online readers (stopped once I learned about how sites profited running them), but you know what? They are “easy access,” which can lead to reading a bunch of stuff that in retrospect wasn't worth your time.



Quote:
once I learned about how sites profited running them

Nothing more then spreading lies like on a cake

You are accusing one manga and other manga viewing running for profit? you cant accuse someone without proof.


Quote:
once I learned about how sites profited running them

Let me guess you learned from trusted blogs? lol people spreading accusations through the blogs shouldn't be trusty worthy.


no offense but i will rather let the manga industry die.
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