Forum - View topicI'm feeling cautiously optimistic about the direction anime is heading.
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ikillchicken
 Posts: 7272 Location: Vancouver |
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If you know me, you probably know that I'm someone who has often criticized the state of modern anime and complained about how few and far between worthwhile shows are these days. And I largely stand by that. I found that anime went through a pretty rough patch for a while there. 2007 was probably the best year for anime in a decade but after that the bubble burst, the western industry collapsed, and things got really bloody lean for a few years. I'm sure a lot of modern fans will disagree with me here, but personally, I found very little to watch from about 2008-2010 and the exceptions were almost all on noitaminA. (09 and 10 were especially brutal in this regard). But you know what? I'm feeling fairly positive about the last couple years. 2011 wasn't great overall (namely I think because there wasn't a ton on noitaminA) and there were a lot of letdowns but for once there was actually some stuff I liked in terms of regular programing. And 2012 was a really good year for anime. Between a couple really good noitaminA shows and a bunch of other stuff I really found it to be one of the best years in quite a while. And so far 2013 is off to a fantastic start. At this point I'm pretty consistently finding at least something that I quite like every season or at least on average.
Also, it's really nice to see that a lot of this stuff isn't just niche stuff for people like me. I mean, I loved House of Five Leaves in 2010 but I was one of the few. Arty shows like that just aren't for most people. And it's tough to feel too positive about the direction of your hobby when the things you actually enjoy are just these fringe exceptions that make virtually no impact with anyone else. But these days we're seeing a lot more accessible stuff too. There's some stuff there like Psycho-Pass, Fujiko Mine and maybe Fate/Zero that, when confronted with an old jaded fan who thinks everything sucks now, I can actually hold up as something they might want to check out. And it seems like we're actually seeing a bit of stuff that could theoretically bring in new fans too. I mean, I'm not saying Attack on Titan is gonna turn into some huge mainstream thing or anything. But it at least seems like something that has the potential to reach out to new fans. If nothing else, it's an anime show that I'm actually seeing come up outside of the usual strictly anime circles and that's not something that I've seen in a while beyond maybe the big established shounen franchises. Plus, on the financial side, things seem to be improving. The R1 industry has rebuilt and now seems to have found a steady business model that actually works. Companies that were on the brink of death like Sentai are healthy and licensing like crazy. And we're even seeing a few new companies pop up. And in Japan things are looking better too. The number of TV shows per year fell every year since 2007 and bottomed out in 2010. But the last few years its gone up every year. I'm not sure what the total will be for 2013 but if the absolute monster chart for fall is any indication it is going to be a lot. And speaking of that, I'm really looking forward to next season. It's looking really solid. And the future in general is bright. Watanabe is working again and so is Keiko Nobumoto. They've got a new original project in the works. Yasuhiro Yoshiura is getting a shot at a full length movie. Hell, we might even get another season of Flowers of Evil at some point what with the manga's big bump in sales. Of course, I'm not gonna lie. I still don't like a lot about modern anime. There's a ton of content out there that no matter how you slice it is just fetish erotica (overt or otherwise). And that stuff immediately sinks a show way faster than anything else I can think of. In the end though, that's not especially important. As much as I may scoff at these shows the important thing is that there are ultimately other good shows that aren't marred by this stuff that exist for me to watch. And we're doing okay in this regard these days. Or at least way better than we were. Hopefully this is a trend that will continue. |
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Galap
Moderator
 Posts: 2354 |
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As someone who freely admits that in some ways his tastes are somewhat strange, I too have held the notion that the anime industry has been steadily drifting away from them for some time now.
I am attracted to anime as a storytelling medium because I think that more than any other, it's willing to go places that nothing else does, and its creativity knows virtually no bounds. However, that doesn't mean that the majority of it is any good. Most of it is really stupid crap. The stupid crap doesn't really bother me; I just don't watch it. What does bother me is what seems to be the waning creativity, that fewer of the projects that are made take themselves seriously than before. I'm happy if there's at least one thing that I like each season and look forward to watching. But I am happy that some of them do get made, and that the creativity allows for enough exploration to produce the things I like. Even though they're the exception rather than the rule, they still happen, and while I wish it could be better, it's not all bad. My absolute favorites tend to be true oddities, complete outliers if you will, the likes of which had never appeared before and never will since, and they don't really feel representative of their time period at all. Something like that can only come around once or twice a decade, anyway. I'll be very (pleasantly) surprised if something gets made before 2020 that has as massive an impact on me as From the New World did. Something like that can only come around once or twice a decade, anyway. Last time was Birdy the Mighty: Decode in 2008 and before that it was Geneshaft in 2001. None of those really made any waves, especially in Japan. There's plenty of great stuff a notch or two below that level, and that's what my main concern is about; I do think that stuff at this level is being squeezed out by bullshit. Personally I blame manga, and otaku media in general. Most of the things I like a lot are originals, or at least not based on manga/games/VNs/LNs etc. You can't deny that most of that stuff is pretty insular, which isn't a bad thing per se, it's just that my tastes don't go there really. In the past we really did have more serious science fiction and the like than these fetish erotica. That all being said, I'm also tentatively optimistic. I think that the bad won't ever drown the good out completely, and that in time the balance will shift again. Honestly it will probably take an upturn in the economy in Japan, but that will happen eventually, too. |
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Blood-
 Bargain Hunter Posts: 25637 |
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Whenever I read a claim like this I know I'm dealing with somebody who has no idea what they are talking about. There are usually about 30+ new shows per season which means there about 120+ new shows per year. Of those, only a small minority have erotica content. So please list this "ton" of fetish erotica or simply admit that your sensitivity to this kind of material makes you give it a outsized presence in your mind that is not backed up by reality. |
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ScumbagYoshi
 Posts: 140 |
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Creativity comes at a price, and I think the most famous of anime tends to fall in the trap of having really interesting concepts but end up just being really poorly written works. Code Geass and Death Note are examples are anime that are incredibly fun but lack the proper writing to really stand out as anything more than an action packed summer blockbuster-level TV show. There's nothing inherently wrong with that, but it does irk me when so many people call CG and DN masterpieces with intelligent characters and, in the case of DN, great themes pertaining to the moral dilemma of right and wrong.
I think there are a few exceptions to this rule, but a lot of times those exceptions are written off as boring/pretentious/douchebaggery anime, and/or ignored entirely without getting much spotlight because the audience that likes these kind of shows are just too few. While I haven't watched it, Aku no Hana is an example given the explosion of discussion on that anime here on ANN. There's little discussion of Aoi Bungaku or Kuuchuu Buranko. I, for one, am a firm believer that a plot can be asinine or characters can be awful, and you can still like a show, and Ergo Proxy falls into that category, but I'm sure most people will disagree with me on that. People herald Serial Experiments Lain and Haibane Renmei as masterpieces, but where's the love for Texhnolyze, arguably the best of the three? People talk about Space Bros all the time, but where's the love for Planetes? I think some of the anime you listed just have a sense of scale, an epic feeling, and a great soundtrack to boot, and that's what makes them popular. Think about Sword Art Online. Or Guilty Crown. They still ended up being fairly well received because of those elements. Fate/Zero, Attack on Titan, Psycho Pass. I think F/Z is great, but the latter two are kind of subpar and uninspiring in my opinion, with Psycho Pass demonstrating how one can attempt to be deep but ends up just being superficial in its execution. If that's the direction that anime is headed, I'm not surprised, because it's really easy to replicate the formula for any of these anime and make it something decent at the very least. Still, I'm not pessimistic. I just think the current trend just means that anime I think are not any good are going to be super popular....which is basically how it's always been with the exception of a few. |
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Ignatz
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Made my day.  No offense, but reading this super serious post and at the same time seeing your avatar is just way too funny.
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danilo07
 Posts: 1580 |
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What are you blaming manga for again?Do you really think that majority of mangas are insular?This is very bizarre claim to make since the manga market is vast(because manga is cheap to produce) and it includes works from every single genre existing.If you want serious science fiction I can tell you 10 great sci fi mangas currently running.There a lot of crappy mangas that get adapted into anime and really good ones often dont,but that doesnt tell you anything about mangas in general. Also there is really good trend that I noticed and that I am optimistic about.Which is the creation of anime solely as a promotion to existing works.Usually manga audience and the otaku are separated,so if there is going to be an adaption of manga,the ones that would have the biggest chance of getting adapted are the ones that anime audience would like.So stuff that manga audience likes wouldnt necessarily be getting an adaptation.That has changed in recent years,as now we get animes are with purpose of increasing manga sales.Which is great cause now this trend allows for more diversity. I have also noticed a trend in which actual novels get adapted.This year every single season had one real novel adaptation in it.I am thinking that again, they are adapted into animes so that those novel sales could increase. |
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EricJ
 Posts: 876 |
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We have to get back to a sense of story and mainstream genre (fantasy, action, comedy, etc.), and my worry was about taking the genre back from the mid/late-00's "Here, otaku, unzip to THIS!" niche-ification of catering their series to more specific fanservice audiences. Our movie-reboot craze in the US has felt like a subconsciously frustrated attempt to find out what we lost from the 80's and 90's, and with the last few years' return of Slayers, Tenchi and Rozen Maiden, seems like there's been a feeling of wondering where the classic shows from the early 00's and before went off the rails. (Although even Slayers' return had to throw in a robot maid.) When even Sword Art Online throws in a subplot for the appeal of spoiler[little sisters with big-brother complexes], we're not out of the woods yet, but feels like story ideas have been returning to the series premises. |
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FenixFiesta
Posts: 2581 |
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[/spoiler] At most that was a symptom, the entirety of the Fairy Dance arc was a mediocre execution, even if one enjoyed the entirety of SAO, it can't be said the main arcs of the series were equal as the second arc was inferior due to comparatively weak world building, a seemingly arbitrary narrative, and a rather straw man feeling villain. |
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Cam0
 Posts: 4978 |
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Obviously people are going to talk about an ongoing show more than a decade old show. The love for Planetes is definitely there. |
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EricJ
Posts: 876 |
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(Oh yeah--I wouldn't say SAO had a "botched" S2 they "shouldn't have continued" like Princess Tutu had, but introducing Oilcan Harry in the first second-arc episode, before we even get to the Fairy plot, didn't do the series any favors-- I put the addition of the "Brother complex" sister down as a lot of cheaper roads it was taking after maybe a change of writers to go with the change of arcs.) |
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter Posts: 25637 |
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@ Ignatz - touche!
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Galap
Moderator
Posts: 2354 |
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Sure, manga is very varied, I agree, but the observation that I'm making is that for whatever reason most of the anime I like more tend to be originals and not manga adaptations. With respect to my tastes, that trend definitely does exist. Why? I don't really know, but maybe part of it is because the manga that tend to get adapted tend to be the more insular 'otaku' ones? |
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ScumbagYoshi
Posts: 140 |
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Yeah, Planetes was my worst example. |
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Jose Cruz
 Posts: 1828 Location: South America |
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I watched Planetes a couple of years ago. Very good show overall: I loved the realism of their depiction of space colonization but for me the drama/human side of the show was quite pedestrian and derivative of other works.
About the topic of this thread: I haven't watched enough anime to have an opinion but I think that nobody here has watched more than 10% of the anime made in each of the past 10 years and so nobody can really given a very informed opinion on the general quality of anime shows (ideally a person should watch like 100 anime shows and 50 movies every year to have a good idea of the total number of great stuff from each year to be able to compare and that's impossible: such a person would need to be a professional anime critic that watches 40 hours of anime per week). |
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Jen Bigby
 Posts: 112 |
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You consider it a great success if you can find only 1 show a season to watch  You must not be that much of an anime fan. I usually find like at least 20 every season to watch and enjoy. Seems like just another 'all modern anime sucks' kinda troll threads.
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Whenever I read a claim like this I know I'm dealing with somebody who has no idea what they are talking about. There are usually about 30+ new shows per season which means there about 120+ new shows per year. Of those, only a small minority have erotica content. So please list this "ton" of fetish erotica or simply admit that your sensitivity to this kind of material makes you give it a outsized presence in your mind that is not backed up by reality. 
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