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Hey, Answerman! [2009-03-20]


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vashfanatic



Joined: 16 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:20 pm Reply with quote
I've been watching ToraDora! and I've yet to see any guy fall on a girl's boobs, see her panties, or have a nose bleed. Maybe I missed it? Anyway, that's part of why I actually like that series.

I get sick of people arguing that modern anime sucks and older anime is perfection, but it is true that not enough people watch older stuff, focusing entirely on new shows. I think it's hard for people to adjust to the difference in animation quality; the original Macross is a great story, but the art is dreadful by modern standards. But the same thing happens in American movies and TV shows - most young people watch the new and as often as not ignore the old. It's a shame, but it's a reality that's hard to break. That's why I love the Buried Treasure column.
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maaya



Joined: 14 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:35 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
My question is this though: Can you think of any anime you have seen (either recently or in the past) that was not based on those three sources or were completely original, and if so how were they? Good? Bad? Mediocre?


I'll only mention the really good ones, classic and new, because nobody wants to see the rest. Wink There are quite a few ones available in english, so watch them now and see for yourself xD

Michiko & Hatchin and Ergo Proxy (seconded)
Samurai Champloo
Eve no Jikan / Time of Eve
Gurren Lagann
Neon Genesis Evangelion (!)
Noein
Denno Coil
Satoshi Kon's or Makoto Shinkai's works as well as quite a few Ghibli movies (Totoro, Chihiro, Mononoke, Nausicaa ...)
Cowboy Bebop
Figure 17
Haibane Renmei (more or less, based on a afaik never completed dojinshi)
Last Exile
Princess Tutu
Kaiba
Ga Rei Zero (more or less, completely different from the manga )
Eureka Seven
Xam'd

Gundam? Macross? Wink Code Geass is an "anime original" as well. Sorry for any mistakes ^^;

vashfanatic wrote:
That's why I love the Buried Treasure column.


so true. Very Happy


Last edited by maaya on Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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vashfanatic



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:41 pm Reply with quote
maaya wrote:

Satoshi Kon's (...) works


At least two of those are based off of previous material: Tokyo Godfathers is based off on an old John Ford movie, and Paprika is from a novel. To my knowledge, however, Millennium Actress, Perfect Blue, and Paranoia Agent are all original.

I think the writer meant recently, though, so some of those examples aren't helpful. But thank you for giving props to Kaiba, that series needs more attention.
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maaya



Joined: 14 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:45 pm Reply with quote
oh, you're right. But at least those are still different from the three sources (light novel, manga, game) mentioned above ^^;

Since in the question it said "either recently or in the past", I just mentioned all I came up with Smile
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The_Libertarian_Otaku



Joined: 11 Sep 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:46 pm Reply with quote
I never understood why younger anime fans don't appreciate the classics. (Case in point: When Adult Swim got Astro Boy a couple years ago, younglings on their boards were flaming the show, saying, "OMG ASTRO BOY SUXORZ because ITS LEIK SOOOOO OLD LOLOLOL".) Kids, if it weren't for Astro Boy, Bobby's in Deep, Gigantor, Gunbuster, Nineteen 19, etc., NONE of the anime you like would exist--not your precious Naruto, Bleach, Peach Girl, NANA, Code Pizza Hut a.k.a. Code Geass--NOTHING! Evil or Very Mad
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vashfanatic



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:47 pm Reply with quote
maaya wrote:
oh, you're right. But at least those are still different from the three sources (light novel, manga, game) mentioned above ^^;


In which case, let's add on my favorite series, Gankutsuou, based off the French novel by Alexander Dumah. Smile

Quote:
I never understood why younger anime fans don't appreciate the classics.


Like I said, I think it's:
1) adjustment to the difference in animation
2) a preference for "new" among young people that extends past anime into other mediums

(and now, having commented enough, I leave this to others)
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Unholy_Nny



Joined: 22 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:50 pm Reply with quote
I would like to mention again how off-base Brian was about Toradora!

Other than that brief rant, the article was great, as always. Especially loved the "flake" section this week.
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Splitter



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:50 pm Reply with quote
Off-handedly, Doug was 12, and the kids from Recess and Hey Arnold! were 10. Toradora!, with its cast of 17-year-olds is more like a quirkier version of those "pretty white kids with problems" series.
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minakichan



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:52 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
I just wanted to offhandedly mention that Toradora! and other shows of its ilk are like the highly sexualized anime equivalent of all those cartoons we had in the 90's about kids just bein' in school, doing school things. Y'know: Doug, Recess, Hey Arnold, and dozens more I'm currently unable to name off the top of my head. Except that occasionally, the main character-guy will fall into a girl's breasts, or perhaps accidentally see her panties, and his nose will bleed! By which I mean to say that I find those shows to be boring and predictable.


Clearly, you have not actually seen Toradora!. Don't be so quick to stereotype just because it happens to be a romantic comedy. It's not an ecchi show at all. The show is clean enough that I'd feel comfortable letting a 10-year-old kid watch it, and the plot actually revolves a bit more about teen friendship, struggles, and self-confidence than it does about romance and sexuality.
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vashfanatic



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:53 pm Reply with quote
Okay, I know I said I wouldn't do this, but yes: Toradora! is the exact opposite of what he described, i.e. sans the adolescent pseudo-ecchi humor, which is why I like it.
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penguintruth



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:53 pm Reply with quote
How garbage like Code Geass can be referred to by Answerfans as inventive while Gundam 00 written off for its repeated Gundam tropes is mind-boggling. I appreciate that the former shows mecha as a dressing, but the mecha is such a nonentity it might as well not have it at all, since it waves aside the Geass powers for the most dull mecha battles I've ever watched in my life. Patlabor did a better job back in the day at having mecha which were still instrumental to the plot, but that didn't take over.

The problem isn't that there's a merchandising frenzy. That's essentially the entire point of the mecha genre. That doesn't mean that there can't be thoughtful mecha programming, but don't pretend like the classics were any less about selling toys than today's mecha anime are.

Nor is the problem in the fan service, either bishonen or sexy women. That's been there as long as mecha programs have existed. Char Aznable and Garma Zabi were the bishonen of their time and many a male otaku hung pictures of Lynn Minmay on their walls for years.

The problem with the mecha genre, may be that it often relies on the old stalwart franchises like Gundam and Macross too much. I'm a big fan of both, but it may be time to let at least Gundam to take a rest for a while. I appreciate the new Gundam series, but Sunrise seems to hand down a lot of edicts to the production staff that stifle their creativity, and it may be time to rethink what the Gundam franchise hopes to accomplish, aside from model sales.

The companies that control the big mecha franchises need to either let the new blood they bring in have a little more creative control or find new ideas for entirely different types of mecha programming.

Likewise, viewers need to respect that, often, studios are producing mecha shows for a new generation of fans not familar with the old mecha tropes. They may not be aiming at you when they come up with them. Give it time, and you'll find a gem. It's the same with anime in general.
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The_Libertarian_Otaku



Joined: 11 Sep 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:57 pm Reply with quote
vashfanatic wrote:
Quote:
I never understood why younger anime fans don't appreciate the classics.


Like I said, I think it's:
1) adjustment to the difference in animation
2) a preference for "new" among young people that extends past anime into other mediums

(and now, having commented enough, I leave this to others)


Adjustment to difference in animation: If it weren't for hand-drawn cels, we WOULDN'T have this fancy-schmancy cel-shaded CGI. Also, hand-drawn cels provide a warmth to the animation and artwork that CGI just can't replicate. (Correct me if I'm wrong, but why do you think Sazae-San is still being animated with hand-drawn cels? That's what cowboys use, is ol' reliable cels!)

Preference for "new": Just because something's old doesn't make it bad or inferior. (Not just in anime, but also in video games--better graphics don't make a better game. Likewise, better visuals don't always make a better anime.)
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vashfanatic



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:59 pm Reply with quote
The_Libertarian_Otaku wrote:

Adjustment to difference in animation: If it weren't for hand-drawn cels, we WOULDN'T have this fancy-schmancy cel-shaded CGI. Also, hand-drawn cels provide a warmth to the animation and artwork that CGI just can't replicate. (Correct me if I'm wrong, but why do you think Sazae-San is still being animated with hand-drawn cels? That's what cowboys use, is ol' reliable cels!)

Preference for "new": Just because something's old doesn't make it bad or inferior. (Not just in anime, but also in video games--better graphics don't make a better game. Likewise, better visuals don't always make a better anime.)


*sigh* You're putting words in my mouth. I'm telling you why people don't watch older stuff; I'm not saying they're valid reasons!

I need to get off this forum if I'm ever going to get to sleep tonight, don't I?
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minakichan



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:01 am Reply with quote
Quote:
I need to get off this forum if I'm ever going to get to sleep tonight, don't I?


Considering that I've agreed with everything you've said in this topic so far, please don't. Anime smile

Or whatever, hahaha.
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vashfanatic



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:03 am Reply with quote
minakichan wrote:
Quote:
I need to get off this forum if I'm ever going to get to sleep tonight, don't I?


Considering that I've agreed with everything you've said in this topic so far, please don't. Anime smile

Or whatever, hahaha.


Then you do it for me! :p

Oh, random thought of an innovative mecha before sleep: Bokurano. I really like that series. It's like an anti-mecha.
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