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Kurasaki



Joined: 29 Jun 2016
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:05 pm Reply with quote
Post in script removed ~ Psycho 101
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RAmmsoldat



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:09 pm Reply with quote
there was backlash against free? first I've heard of it.
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valoon



Joined: 01 Apr 2015
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:10 pm Reply with quote
I think fanservice overall is a sad thing, it's okay but sometimes the extent of it is just too much - but because most authors of such fanservice for males anime are mainly males themselves, they don't know how women feel about that.
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cg89



Joined: 21 Jan 2016
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:11 pm Reply with quote
the answer is its very common, usually pointless, and 9 times out of ten not at all titilating in any manor.
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DuchessBianca



Joined: 24 Apr 2015
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:15 pm Reply with quote
I know I'm in the minority but as a female I love and enjoy pretty much all the heavy fanservice shows whose target demographic is male, even ones which are literally just that. While it doesn't bother me as I enjoy it I can understand how people have gripes about fan service getting shoved into shows that aren't fanservice oriented for sales or whatnot.

Though like another poster this is the first I'm hearing about any Free! backlash, was there really? Thats just sad... Loved free and that S1 ED is still the most catchy ED I've ever heard and a treat to look at too Anime smile
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Levitz9



Joined: 06 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:17 pm Reply with quote
Another key difference is that many fujoshi-oriented shows are in on the joke (see: Gou in Free!). Male-oriented fanservice always has this disgusting presumptuousness to it, pure Kojima-style "there's a point to seeing her nipples bleed through her shirt/you will be ashamed of your deeds and actions!" crap. There hasn't been a female-oriented show with an equivalent to Cross Ange's "It's not anal rape, it's a medical procedure!"

It's still worth pointing out that fujoshi fanservice can be as hurtful as otaku fanservice in that it's still objectifying gay relationships. Just because people are super-into yaoi doesn't necessarily make them LGBT allies, especially if gay couples to them are just something to ogle. It's the very definition of objectification: ignoring the humanity behind individuals for the sake of their image. But, as Justin points out, it's nowhere nearly as endemic as the Ken Akamatsu model.

Also worth considering are the false equivalences a lot of men bring up: men think that characters like Kratos from God of War are female eye-candy. That kind of thing really twists what is/isn't fanservice for women.

EDIT:
DuchessBianca wrote:
I know I'm in the minority but as a female I love and enjoy pretty much all the heavy fanservice shows whose target demographic is male, even ones which are literally just that. While it doesn't bother me as I enjoy it I can understand how people have gripes about fan service getting shoved into shows that aren't fanservice oriented for sales or whatnot.

Though like another poster this is the first I'm hearing about any Free! backlash, was there really? Thats just sad... Loved free and that S1 ED is still the most catchy ED I've ever heard and a treat to look at too Anime smile


This was a really big deal when it came out. KyoAni fans were seriously ruffled when the studio responsible for making their waifu come to life suddenly made one show that wasn't aimed at them. It was like that comic where they pour soda into a woman's cup and a guy complains he isn't getting any soda when his cup is already full, so he forces the soda-bearer to pour more into his overflowing cup.

(Also, Splash Free is a damn catchy song. Anime smile)


Last edited by Levitz9 on Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
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CrowLia



Joined: 24 Feb 2012
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:17 pm Reply with quote
RAmmsoldat wrote:
there was backlash against free? first I've heard of it.


When the show was first announced there were at least a handful of threads in this forum that were 50+ pages of angry otaku telling women what they should like and being pissy because KyoAni had "betrayed them", swearing to boycott the company and guaranteeing that Free would be a failure because "women don't buy anime"
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Hoppy800



Joined: 09 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:22 pm Reply with quote
Fujoshi would be respected more if a lot of them didn't oogle over shipping and such non-stop (this was a MAJOR problem with the Hetalia fanbase). With male orientated fanservice, people just say they want to see it, want the girls and the haters will hate on it and move on and don't force it into people's faces.

Last edited by Hoppy800 on Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Beatdigga



Joined: 26 Oct 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:23 pm Reply with quote
No one can get an even targeting mix anymore. It's too far in one direction or the other. It's either raging myosigny or Ghostbusters 2016, where you're sexist if you dislike it instead of because it looks like a flaming dumpster.

We are so polarized in our opinions that this blowback is inevitable.


Last edited by Beatdigga on Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:24 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Valhern



Joined: 19 Jan 2015
Posts: 916
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:23 pm Reply with quote
RAmmsoldat wrote:
there was backlash against free? first I've heard of it.


There surely was. Even I myself was like "oh my god it was a frigging commercial KyoAni you've never done anything out of any other commercial" and I honestly feared that it would've been a heavy fanservice show but with guys and everyone would've been like "yooo progressive!!" but I think they've done a very good job in that regard, it's not annoying nor becomes an obstacle. As homoerotic element, it was pretty much the "We COULD go there but we leave that for fanfiction", pretty much like anything KyoAni has done.

And I had reasons to fear it since everytime KyoAni tried to go a more ecchi route, it hasn't gone very well.

PD; I thought that the girl on the thumbnail was wearing some kind of boxing gloves before taking a good look at it. Wow.


Last edited by Valhern on Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Asturaetus



Joined: 28 Apr 2014
Posts: 20
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:23 pm Reply with quote
There was fanservice in Real Drive? I remember a lot of people being put off that Aoi - the female main - was chubby, but I don't really remember fanservice. Sure you didn't mean Mardock Scramble with the nude diving and the gay dolphine?

Last edited by Asturaetus on Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Cam0



Joined: 13 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:25 pm Reply with quote
CrowLia wrote:
Is this sarcastic? When the show was first announced there were at least a handful of threads in this forum that were 50+ pages of angry otaku telling women what they should like and being pissy because KyoAni had "betrayed them", swearing to boycott the company and guaranteeing that Free would be a failure because "women don't buy anime"


It's the first time I've heard of it. Of course I didn't pay much attention to Free! news or threads so it makes sense. Sounds ridiculous. I need to go looking for these threads.
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Parsifal24



Joined: 20 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:25 pm Reply with quote
I find fan service boring more than offensive as you can only see the same tired tropes recycled again and again. I guess from a design point it can be interesting in either a morbid curiosity sort of way or out of some interest in the minimal story. I tried to watch Free and good visuals aside I found it boring same goes for High School D X D.

It would be nice to see more female-centered fan service shows but then you risk getting into the same writing problems and accusations of pandering series such as Miricle Train and Brothers Conflict being two examples that come to mind. Along with the creepy romanticization of abusive relationships that creeps up in some series.

So neither is perfect but a fan base exists for both it would just be nice to see women get something as well even if I don't watch it. The problem is when fans feel they are "owed" something by creators.

This was the problem with the Free "controversy" as fans felt they had some kind of stake in what Kyoto Animation made because they loved their works. That kind of reaction is just immature to me.
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Themaster20000



Joined: 05 Aug 2014
Posts: 712
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:27 pm Reply with quote
Solid answer. It's definitely the worst when your watching a show that's serious in tone,and the director decides to throw in a bunch of pointless fanservice. That said,I do enjoy the occasional one like Monster Musume,which works due to being to about it's intentions,good animation,and most importantly it's creative with it's premise; which is one of the biggest issues with these shows.

Last edited by Themaster20000 on Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:38 pm; edited 1 time in total
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FenixFiesta



Joined: 22 Apr 2013
Posts: 2576
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:32 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
and has virtually no thought put into writing, animation quality, visual technique, or pretty much anything else that people watch anime for.

The issue becomes multi faceted, it isn't just about exploiting fictional characters with oversized (or in some cases undersized) breasts and flashing a panty shots at every opportunity, it is that the media creators just give up and believe that "the idiot otaku audience will eat up ANYTHING as long as it has cute enough girls in compromised positions".

Quote:
We don't see "mean-spirited sexy" much in female-oriented anime fan service.
We don't see it "as often", a glance at a few fujoshi aimed Doujin and one will soon come across the often used "rape means loves" as a dominant seme completely molests an uke, and the usual end result is the uke completely falls for the seme even if the relationship is effectively an abusive one.


Characters that have actual thought in there production usually last longer in the fandom cognitive, any trained artist or mangaka can draw our a "titillating character" but to make a character resonate with the target audience they have to be more than there drawn curves.

As for why a vocal portion of the community goes nuts when there is intentional female pandering, that is a social issue that would need more than a full page response but the short of it is due to "societal conditioning".


Last edited by FenixFiesta on Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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