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Answerman - How Do Blu-Ray Subtitles Work?


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Superfield



Joined: 13 Jun 2016
Posts: 76
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:00 pm Reply with quote
...is this a re-run of a previous Answerman? I could've sworn I read this before.
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invalidname
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Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 2434
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:13 pm Reply with quote
I kind of want to know whose Blu-Ray collection that is in the front page / sidebar photo for this story. Between Redline, Space Adventure Cobra, and Penguindrum, my guess is Zac & Jacob's.
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ChrissyC



Joined: 17 Jun 2015
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:22 pm Reply with quote
There is no creative program that doesn`t crash, dogma.
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azabaro
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Joined: 06 Jul 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:44 pm Reply with quote
Superfield wrote:
...is this a re-run of a previous Answerman? I could've sworn I read this before.


Yes, this appears to be a re-run from September 11, 2017 http://animenewsnetwork.com/answerman/2017-09-11/.121175
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MarshalBanana



Joined: 31 Aug 2014
Posts: 5294
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:33 pm Reply with quote
So in order to write a line, instead of writing the line "Do you know what they call a quarter pounder with cheese in France?" they would have to arrange each bitmap letter into a line like an old fashioned printing press and then use that image file, or does the authoring program create an image of that line and save it out as a bitmap.
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Triltaison



Joined: 03 Jul 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:10 pm Reply with quote
@MarshalBanana:

The full line. Think of it like a transparency on an overhead projector displaying an image, if you know how those work. It's basically a slideshow of images that happen to be in the shape of words that are displayed on top of a video.
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DmonHiro





PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:01 pm Reply with quote
I'm very curious why the text based part of the bluray ended up not working at all. I can understand not working right, but at all?
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Dark Absol



Joined: 09 Dec 2009
Posts: 813
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:20 pm Reply with quote
For Funimation/Sentai Filmworks, the subtitles work in Japanese Audio, but they don't work in English Audio. That's just lazy on their part for not including the subtitles in the English Audio.

This coming from deaf person.
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Zendervai



Joined: 06 Apr 2012
Posts: 197
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:45 pm Reply with quote
Dark Absol wrote:
For Funimation/Sentai Filmworks, the subtitles work in Japanese Audio, but they don't work in English Audio. That's just lazy on their part for not including the subtitles in the English Audio.

This coming from deaf person.


Eeh...that's probably a combination of a demand from the Japanese side (force subtitles under Japanese so to decrease the attractiveness of reverse importation) and the fact that the subtitles usually don't match the English dub. And putting the subtitles in is so much of a pain that I actually kind of understand why they don't put the effort in for a subtitle track people will just complain about. Because *someone* will put turn it on while watching the Japanese and not realize there's a second track there.
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Animegomaniac



Joined: 16 Feb 2012
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 8:13 pm Reply with quote
zendervai wrote:
Dark Absol wrote:
For Funimation/Sentai Filmworks, the subtitles work in Japanese Audio, but they don't work in English Audio. That's just lazy on their part for not including the subtitles in the English Audio.

This coming from deaf person.


Eeh...that's probably a combination of a demand from the Japanese side (force subtitles under Japanese so to decrease the attractiveness of reverse importation) and the fact that the subtitles usually don't match the English dub. And putting the subtitles in is so much of a pain that I actually kind of understand why they don't put the effort in for a subtitle track people will just complain about. Because *someone* will put turn it on while watching the Japanese and not realize there's a second track there.


No, close captioning is a different issue from subtitles. While being able to turn subtitles on while playing English audio isn't the same, it's at least better than doing no CC at all. Also, it should be a completely separate issue from being forced play subtitles on Japanese audio.

As for BD versus DVD HD, being the better or best format never had anything to do with winning the format wars in the end. I know nothing about the programming half of BDs but security encryption and copy protection can made playback an issue.

I was shocked with I tried playing a recent BD and it demanded that I input an access code so I could play it. Now that's progress- I just don't know which direction.
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TheAncientOne



Joined: 06 Oct 2010
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Location: USA (mid-south)
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 10:31 pm Reply with quote
I am curious if UHD Blu-ray addressed any of these issues.
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Tylerr



Joined: 13 Nov 2010
Posts: 475
PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 1:49 am Reply with quote
they should be using .ass subtitles.

it's rather hilarious unpaid fansubbers have been doing better work than professionals.

and they expect people to pay for this inferior work.
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fuuma_monou



Joined: 26 Dec 2005
Posts: 1816
Location: Quezon City, Philippines
PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 2:02 am Reply with quote
Tylerr wrote:
they should be using .ass subtitles.

it's rather hilarious unpaid fansubbers have been doing better work than professionals.

and they expect people to pay for this inferior work.


Do text-based subtitles render the same way across different operating systems?
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Zalis116
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Joined: 31 Mar 2005
Posts: 6864
Location: Kazune City
PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 4:03 am Reply with quote
Tylerr wrote:
they should be using .ass subtitles.

it's rather hilarious unpaid fansubbers have been doing better work than professionals.

and they expect people to pay for this inferior work.
Whether they want to use .ass or not, they simply can't:

animenewsnetwork.com/answerman/2015-04-24/.87349

Quote:
The main reason why has to do with the software. Fansubbers have developed their own software since the earliest days, and the current gold standard, Aegisub, is THE most powerful, flexible subtitling software that exists. Unfortunately it was developed in a bubble, completely oblivious to all of the standards and use cases in the professional world. There's no good way to import Aegisub scripts into any professional video program. None of its unique features, from text styling to animation effects, can be translated to any other format.
**
This is not something that the rest of the world will "catch up to" someday. These features aren't in mainstream subtitling software because nobody outside of the anime world cares about these features. It's a total case of "Galapagos Syndrome" -- a little self-contained corner of the internet that matured completely cut off from the rest of the world, only to find out later that it took a completely different evolutionary path. Fansubs will always be able to do things the professionals can't. It's the nice part about not having to care if your viewers can play your video or not.


More here.
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Superfield



Joined: 13 Jun 2016
Posts: 76
PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 4:12 am Reply with quote
This was addressed in the comments when this topic was first run a few months ago. The reason (if I understand it correctly) why they can't just use .ass or something similar is because every manufacturer's Blu-Ray player will run on a different OS, and have no way of knowing how to render the fonts consistently. PC OS's are much less of a Wild West than Blu-ray ones, so it's not as much of a concern.

But I'm sure someone with more experience can explain it better.
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