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INTEREST: Artists Dare Each Other to Model Pokémon in Five Minutes Amid Pokémon Sword/Shield Backlas


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Aca Vuksa



Joined: 22 Mar 2018
Posts: 466
Location: Nis, Serbia
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:11 pm Reply with quote
Black and White parody!

I too feel frustrated about the old generation Pokemon not to appear as well, its too frustrated to see this happening. We are going on Black and White like now.
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StarfighterPegasus



Joined: 04 Oct 2013
Posts: 64
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:46 pm Reply with quote
Pokemon was going to run into the problem eventually, 1000 pokemon to catch. Also Balancing issues what's the point of having a thousand pokemon when most are just going to us the same overpowered ones? Never seen a Lincoon in competitive play
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Yuvelir



Joined: 06 Jan 2015
Posts: 321
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:27 pm Reply with quote
Aca Vuksa wrote:
Black and White parody!

I too feel frustrated about the old generation Pokemon not to appear as well, its too frustrated to see this happening. We are going on Black and White like now.

At least BW had the Poke Transfer to allow you to transfer the previous 493 pokémon while also letting you catch like a hundred or so of those.
SS will only feature the latter.

StarfighterPegasus wrote:
Pokemon was going to run into the problem eventually, 1000 pokemon to catch. Also Balancing issues what's the point of having a thousand pokemon when most are just going to us the same overpowered ones? Never seen a Lincoon in competitive play

And neither will you now (assuming linoone/silcoon/cascoon even make it). It just mean that instead of having a moderate selection of pokemon appearing over and over, you'll have a smaller selection of pokemon appearing over and over.
If they want this kind of balance, they could make rulesets that only allow Galar-obtainable pokemon to participate. Which is what they've been doing for the better part of a decade, actually.
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kotomikun



Joined: 06 May 2013
Posts: 657
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:50 pm Reply with quote
Obviously modeling a Pokemon takes a lot more than 5 minutes, even not counting the animations. With the amount of money the franchise makes, though, "it's just too much work to model them all" seems a bit of a stretch.

That being said, I also don't see why not having every single past character in the new games is such a big problem. Just from the hints we've gotten already, there are probably 300+ returning critters, likely covering all the favorites for most people. Reading between the lines of the official explanations, I suspect the real goal here is to trim out some repetitive and just-plain-bad designs that have piled up over the years. They can't say that because admitting that some Pokemon are uninspired or redundant (or unpopular, or don't fit in this game's setting, or whatever) makes them look bad, but it makes more sense than what we've been told.
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BadNewsBlues



Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 3769
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 7:47 pm Reply with quote
kotomikun wrote:

I suspect the real goal here is to trim out some repetitive and just-plain-bad designs that have piled up over the years. They can't say that because admitting that some Pokemon are uninspired or redundant (or unpopular, or don't fit in this game's setting, or whatever) makes them look bad, but it makes more sense than what we've been told.


They can't say that likely because that's most definitely not the reason. Being that dubious PKMN designs have been a thing since gen 1 and will be a thing until they stop making games this theory makes little sense.
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otastorian



Joined: 02 Aug 2018
Posts: 7
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 8:07 pm Reply with quote
kotomikun wrote:
With the amount of money the franchise makes, though, "it's just too much work to model them all" seems a bit of a stretch.


People keep saying this, and I really don't understand why. Even here, commenting on a trend that shows that just modeling the little bastards takes a good deal of work, people still want to say that they're lying about it being a good deal of work. Does Game Freak need to make a 30 page powerpoint presentation for everyone to understand why they've opted out of modeling and programming all 807 Pokemon into the game?
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Meongantuk



Joined: 03 Jun 2016
Posts: 158
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 9:28 pm Reply with quote
To put it simple, It is possible to put every single Pokemon in the game but the game will be delayed to maybe 2++ years (optimistic estimation). People complained about the a season delay for animal crossing game, now imagine this happen to Pokemon but with FFXV level waiting. This is HD 3D models we're talking about, not 2D sprites or lower definition models.

It's not money that they lack, it's TIME.

This is their choice:
1. Release on time with limited choice, but with quality they wanted.
2. Delay the game until they managed to finish everything.
3. Released on time, but either with questionable model quality for non-galadar pokemon or they just opt using the non-hd previous generation models (they'll look awful, but who cares?).
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Megiddo



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 7824
Location: IL
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:28 pm Reply with quote
Aw, I was expecting a teacup meme. Oh well. That's all I'd be able to get done in 5 minutes, but it'd be a perfect teacup.

Also, from what I've understood is that the bulk of the work was already done for 3D models of Pokemon when they did X/Y. All Pokemon games since then (including what has been shown of Sword/Shield) are mainly if not only just re-using the models found in X/Y (aside from new generation Pokemon of course or other new concepts not found in prior generations)

So as they're just reusing stuff from 6th/7th generation they're removing some arbitrary amount of Pokemon for no discernible reason as well as charging more money than a usual Pokemon game while keeping the exact same models as the 3DS games (though it should be noted, the shader is different).

Also it should be very amusing to note that this announcement came almost in tandem with the Pokemon Home service, where people will (almost certainly) be charged a fee to hold their Pokemon that can't be transferred since it's not on the regional Pokedex.

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/nintendo/comments/aveoo9/pokémon_swordshield_lets_go_shader_comparison/

Do let me know if this is incorrect, but if you do, be sure to provide a source for the correct information so I can learn more. I'm not the biggest Pokemon fan but I do enjoy following it and seeing the fandom go nuts for various things.
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Kurohei



Joined: 13 Dec 2010
Posts: 543
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:06 pm Reply with quote
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AmpersandsUnited



Joined: 22 Mar 2012
Posts: 189
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 12:31 am Reply with quote
Gamefreak specifically cited "combat balance" as the reason why not all Pokemon are available in Sword and Shield. Whether you want to take that at face value or not is up to you. I never felt the games had much balance at all personally. Most competitive battling is decided in one or two moves and consists of people switching back and forth between Pokemon constantly. It's part of the reason double battles became the standard in modern competition, although the problem still exists.

It might be worth noting Junichi Masuda has gone on record stating he does not see the need to put much content into modern Pokemon games because he feels modern audiences having access to smartphones and other devices mean they can play many games, and he doesn't think many people will dedicate themselves to one game like they do in the past, so they feel less inclined to focus on content in the modern games like before. That mindset makes it easy to see why they do not see it as an effort to program every Pokemon into the newer games if they don't feel the modern games need to be as content filled as older games.

Megiddo wrote:
Also it should be very amusing to note that this announcement came almost in tandem with the Pokemon Home service, where people will (almost certainly) be charged a fee to hold their Pokemon that can't be transferred since it's not on the regional Pokedex.
.


Pokemon Bank already had a service fee attached to it. The national encyclopedia was removed in Sun and Moon and Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon with the excuse that it was in Pokemon Bank now, so there was no need for it in game. Whether Home will have a similar role in future games not having every Pokemon in them is unclear.
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Feli1



Joined: 25 Dec 2017
Posts: 196
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:05 am Reply with quote
man this really backfired in their faces lol stop being cheap and lazy nintendo

#ALLPOKEMONLIVESMATTER
#BRINGBACKTHENATIONALDEX
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kotomikun



Joined: 06 May 2013
Posts: 657
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 6:32 am Reply with quote
BadNewsBlues wrote:
They can't say that likely because that's most definitely not the reason. Being that dubious PKMN designs have been a thing since gen 1 and will be a thing until they stop making games this theory makes little sense.

So... you agree there are lots of bad designs... but you also think that can't possibly be why some are being left out? And you didn't explain why. I mean, I'm used to people going after literally everything I say that doesn't align perfectly with the prevailing internet opinions (which happens more often than not, unfortunately), but you gotta at least put some effort into it.

Anyway I'm gonna go back to not actually caring about this because I had no intention of transferring mons from other games. Don't think I even have anything compatible with Pokemon Home or whatever it's called, other than Let's Go.
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Sekaro



Joined: 12 Nov 2018
Posts: 121
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 8:21 am Reply with quote
Despite how big of a controversy this has become (Did you guys see the dislike bar on that E3 Pokemon SnS Live presentation video on YT? Yikes Shocked), I don't really feel all that upset about this. Sure, I understand people are pissed off about not being able to transfer ALL of their pokemon from previous games especially since they've recently introduced new services that should be able to do all this stuff.

However, unlike most people, I have no interest in bringing pokemons from previous games to SnS. I want to see new pokemon from the Galar region and play with said pokemon. I want to see what kind of team I can make using only new pokemon and not having that tempting option to rely on familiar and more reliable pokemon. As long as there is a varied selection of new Pokemon in SnS and they actually look cool, I think I'm fine with the game as is.
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Cardcaptor Takato



Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 1559
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 4:33 pm Reply with quote
I wish Pokemon fans were as sympathetic to Game Freak's designers as people were sympathetic to the Sonic movie designers. Surely it takes less time to redesign one character for a two hour movie than it does to redesign 700+ Pokemon in such a large game.
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Pandsu



Joined: 16 Sep 2017
Posts: 43
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 4:41 pm Reply with quote
While I personally don't even know if I would transfer many old Pokemon over in the first place, I still would've liked to have the option and still can't help but feel like their explanation for why they are not doing it is a cop-out.
Of course it takes time to model and animate Pokemon, but they are also making enough money to hire 3D artists to do so. It's not like this wasn't a problem they couldn't see coming anyway, so they had loads of time to prepare. And it's not like their animations are great anyway.

Plus, they've been using the same assets and animations for old Pokemon from X&Y all the way up to Let's Go and I don't think that has changed here? They don't really look much better, if at all, than they did in the previous few games. Am I missing something?

Speaking of X&Y, that game is pretty much proof of why this is all bullshit. That game had a completely new engine and approach due to being the first fully 3D Pokemon game, had plenty of new Pokemon and still included all of the old ones, some with new Mega Evolutions. All at an asking price of 20 bucks less than this one's gonna be.
Home come that was possible, yet it's not with Sword and Shield when they even had a filler year with Let's Go, which wasn't exactly the most high-effort production either, leaving plenty of time to already be working on the next game to make a triumphant return to form.

Plus, it only makes sense for people to be upset when they were paying for Pokemon Bank and will most likely be asked to pay for Pokemon Home as well, which I also barely see the point of now too since transferring your Pokes to that app will probably mean a lot of them are gonna be stuck there with nowhere really to go.
They have cashed in on a hoarder attitude with fans. Before Bank there was Pokemon Box and such. The Virtual Console versions of the Gen 1 and 2 games made a big deal about being able to transfer those Pokemon into Pokemon Bank so that those would be future proof too.
So they should either stick to that status quo or fully reboot the thing and impress in other ways and reinvent the franchise a little.

The way it is now, it really doesn't feel like that much of a step up from how Pokemon was on the 3DS and it really makes me wonder if they really just do this so that special offers, like that paywall-Mew and version exclusive Mons, have more of an impact than they would've had if people could just grab those from older games.
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