Forum - View topicTransformers-American or japanese?
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jagozon
 Posts: 76 Location: Dallas,Texas |
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I've been reading about the original Transformers,and im a bit confused.Is it american or japanese?
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Canuckian
Posts: 184 |
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The Original "The Transformers"(1984) was a joint production between Hasbro(Everywhere minus Asia, somewhat) and TAKARA(Japan, and other bits of Asia) where the show would be often animated in Korea or Japan at times. The Original "The Transformers Movie"(1986) was completely hand-animated by Toei in Japan. The Japanese Continuity(Bypassing US's G1 Season 4) was mostly animated by Toei if memory serves.
Although the Characters' storylines were written by Marvel in the US. As the production of the show was a joint production between Marvel and Sunbow. In reality, "The Transformers" is a joint Production between the US and Japan. The show was animated in Japan/Korea so it's a joint. |
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Emerje
 Posts: 7548 Location: Maine |
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I disagree. It takes more than an animation studio to make something anime, otherwise shows like Thundercats, G.I. Joe, and just about every other cartoon in the '80's would also be anime, which they aren't. A certain amount of creative involvement should be required.
Originally Transformers was solely Hasbro's project. They bought all of the robot toys they could get their hands on from Japan (not just from Takara but from Takatoku, Toyco, and Toybox as well). They then worked with Marvel and Sunbow on characters and stories and then shopped around for animation studios (it's only by chance that they got involved with Japanese studios, it could have been all Korean or whoever). Takara didn't get involved with Transformers until a year later. Originally they tried to market a series called Henshin Sentai (Changeforce) which would combine Microman and Diaclone as one line. It failed horribly. Takara then decides to give in and start working with Hasbro on future Transformers projects. So while it didn't take long for the two to get together, Transformers was initially an American only production with Japan only acting as a faceless animation studio (common in the '80's) with no input and a source for robot toys. As for the movie, same idea. Despite being animated in Japan, Toei had no actual input on the production, they were just labor. Takara wasn't involved at all on the movie and didn't even pick it up until later. Originally Takara had their own plans for the post movie characters called Scramble City which was horrible and didn't get beyond one episode which mostly consisted of recycled animation. I still refer to both the series (up through our season four), the movie, and Beast Wars/Beast Machines as American cartoons and post season three Japanese episodes and shows as anime. I don't believe in midstream changes and where Hasbro, Marvel, and Sunbow were clearly the creative force behind Transformers in the first season I don't see where Takara's involvement suddenly turned the "cartoon" into "anime". Emerje (edit: changed the opening paragraph) |
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Nagisa
Moderator
 Posts: 6128 Location: Atlanta-ish, Jawjuh |
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As Emerje said. In simplest terms, the grunt animation work and some of the merchandising was done in Japan and some other locations in Asia, while the real brainwork behind the show (writing, directing, designwork) was done in North America. So really, the show's more American than anything. It's when you get to the horrendous CG Transformer shows from more recent years that it genuinely becomes anime.
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KyuuA4
 Posts: 1371 Location: America, where anime and manga can be made |
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Transformers is indeed anime because of its Japanese connection. Some will say it's a partial truth because the original was actually a co-production AND sold as a US "cartoon. However, there is a purely anime Transformers series. By the way, that one sucked balls.
So, is Transformers Japanese or American? Who frikkin' cares. It's both. 
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Nagisa
Moderator
Posts: 6128 Location: Atlanta-ish, Jawjuh |
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No, it's not. Because at that point Japan had no input in the actual creative direction of the show, the money that was going into it, or the fact that it had even come into existence. All they did was get a bunch of below-minimum-wage pencil jockeys to draw and color millions of robots so the American producers wouldn't have to spend a lot of money to have it done locally. G1 Transformers is not anime, because the Japanese end of it was exceedingly minor and insignificant with regards to the actual writing, directing, and funding of the show. All of that came locally, well outside of any Japanese studio's influence. |
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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Does it really matter whether it's American or Japanese? Because from what I know it's got some Korean people helping to make the series these days.
I'm sorry, did I hear you say that one correctly? Having watched it when I was little, I will tend to disagree with you on that one, because that was one of the many shows that raised me, on top of my getting all the toys as well. There was actually some good shows on there too. |
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Char_Aznable
 Posts: 33 Location: Philadelphia |
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I lost track of the CG Transformers shows after Beast Wars (which was a pretty nice after-school time killer).
I flipped on whichever series is currently on Cartoon Network, and the dub is absolutely horrendous. It's really disconcerting to hear giant robots using American slang. There's some pretty cringeworthy dialogue; I wonder if even children can watch this without rolling their eyes. |
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Canuckian
Posts: 184 |
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You must be talking about Cybertron Soundwave, for some reason he is a DJ. Why? I don't know.
Either way dialogue aside, Hasbro intended the previous(Previous because of rumors concerning TF: Heroes) series, Galaxy Force/Cybertron to be a continuation of Superlink/Energon, However TAKARA gave Gonzo free-range because they aparently wouldn't mind what they did, so instead of continuing Superlink/Energon Gonzo rebooted the storyline(Much like Robots In Disguise, and Armada), Hasbro wanted a continuation so they dubbed it to fit Superlink/Energon. The first two episodes were edited together, but oddly enough the second half of the Combo-Edit episode would later apear as episode 52 "Inferno". |
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Emerje
Posts: 7548 Location: Maine |
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Yeah, funny thing is, after Takara gave Gonzo free range over Galaxy Force they realized what Hasbro was planning to do with it and took their lead. Takara has done their fare share of trying to explain the events of GF as part of Micron and Superlink as well. Unfortunately by this point it was too late to make changes to the show so the explanations only turn up in character bios and DVD commentaries.
Emerje |
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Canuckian
Posts: 184 |
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I liked Cybertron a lot, besides it's messed up continuity, it was undoubtly the best Transformers show we've had in a long time(Armada was good in it's second half, where as this show was constiantly good for me). Which makes me sad that there is conflicting rumors on who will develop Heroes, first we get rumors saying Gonzo, then some American Company, then people saying Cartoon Network is making it, Which I highly doubt, since when has CN taken on an existing Franchise it shafted it 6:00/7:00 AM Slots and had a major role in development, besides them giving us the crappy animation in Armada, they never had a big role in this franchise, so why now? Especially since I would think if this were to be made by a US channel Nick would be the one, because Paramount is making this movie.
Either way I liked Cybertron/Galaxy Force besides it's G1 Homages(Soundwave's G1 Form, G1 Prime, Rodimus, Magnus, and Jazz in "Fallen" or somethings"). |
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Emerje
Posts: 7548 Location: Maine |
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All three parts of the AEC trilogy had at least a few redeeming qualities.
In Armada, the first season was mostly forgettable, but there were some memorable parts in the second half like you mentioned. Things like the arrival of Tidal Wave, the first time Jetfire Powerlinxs with Optimus, the appearance of Nemesis Prime, Starscreams struggle with his conscience, the return of Unicron, and what might possible be the best fight between Optimus and Megatron in any continuity. In Energon we saw a colossal amount of G1 homages, more-so than any previous series has been able to produce. Most notable was the homages to Arcee, Omega Supreme, Wing Saber (entirely new to the US), and five member gestalt teams. Story-wise it did a few interesting things with the different planets that likely lead to the concept of the Cybertron series. Cybertron probably had some of the best toys. They also gave us our first look at Primus as a Transformer (we've seen him in other forms, but actually transforming was something entirely new. It did some nice stuff with the different planet's leaders (though I wish they hadn't changed all of their names, not calling them all Primes and turning Nitro Convoy into a girl somewhat weakened they're potential), plus gave us a great War Within style Starscream. This is also the first time we've seen Starscream actually act as a threat on his own and leading his own army. While it isn't likely that we'll ever see these characters again, the trilogy did have its merits that are often over looked. Emerje |
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Char_Aznable
Posts: 33 Location: Philadelphia |
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Wow, you guys really know your Transformers.
Was Armada the series where Optimus and Megatron grow incredibly large and fight each other in the clouds or something at the conclusion? Geez, sorry, that vague description might sound like five different series for all I know. Anyway, that was a pretty well done scene from what I remember. |
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KyuuA4
Posts: 1371 Location: America, where anime and manga can be made |
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Hey, wanna know something. I was torrenting Afro Samurai the other day. Over at Tokyotosho, whoever posted the torrent link - did not recognize it as an anime. What's your take on that?  
Anyways, back on this topic. There is at least ONE Transformers series that is indeed anime. It's the one involving mini-cons, the Transformers themselves, and their accompanyment of little children. I have no clue what that is all about. It's one of the latest Transformer series - just can't remember it right now because I last saw it 2 years ago. Heh, gimme a few minutes, and I'll Wiki it up.
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Emerje
Posts: 7548 Location: Maine |
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Here, I'll just break down the series into where they originated.
Transformers Season One - Entirely American aside from the various Asian animation studios. This season would later be altered with mechanical frames and screen transitions and coined Generation 2 to coincide with the toy release. Transformers Season Two - Same as above, but now Takara is on-board, but input is probably still limited at this point, otherwise they likely wouldn't have introduced characters that Takara didn't own the mold to like Shockwave or Omega Supreme. Transformers the Movie - Another American creation outside of Toei's involvement as an animation studio. Japan wouldn't get it until 1989. Transformers: Scramble City - Japan's attempt to introduce the new characters present in the movie and Season Three. While much of it was just recycled animation from the previous seasons there was some new animation not seen in the US. Only one episode is made and finishes on a cliffhanger that is never explained in the series. Transformers Season Three - Probably the only true season and toy series that Hasbro and Takara worked together on as it featured nearly all new characters based on all new toys. Transformers Season Four - All American again, this season wasn't shown in Japan. Last G1 animated season in the US. Transformers: Headmasters - First completely Japanese series that can be called anime. Features many of the same characters as Season Four, but an entirely different story. Most of the characters from this series did see release in the US in toy form, mainly the Headmasters. New characters included Soundblaster and Twincast, new forms of Soundwave and Blaster respectivly. Transformers: Super-God Masterforce - Second all Japanese series. This one revolved mainly around Pretenders, Powermasters, and more Headmasters. Featured some new characters and toys never seen in the US like God Ginrai and Metalhawk. Transformers: Zone - The final G1 series in Japan. Almost entirely consisting new characters that weren't seen in the US in toy form such as faction leaders Star Saber and Deszaras, but did include familiar characters like Perceptor and Wheeljack. Beast Wars - First new concept since Season Four in the US (not counting the G2 abomination). Entirely Hasbro's doing with no Japanese involvement whatsoever. Lasted for three seasons this way. Beast Wars the Second - A Japanese anime that was shown between the first two seasons of Beast Wars, mainly acting as time filler while the second season was being translated. The story takes place in the future of the series causing some continuity errors later on. Introduces a lot of characters not seen in the US like LioConvoy and a new Galvatron. This series also featured many vehicle characters as Predacons that were actually repainted from the G2 toy line. Beat Wars Neo - A sequel to Second, but this time not featuring any vehicles. Almost entirely consisting of new toy molds, some of which did see release in the US much later as parts of other lines as repaints. While Unicron existed in Second, he became more prominent of a character in Neo. A Unicron toy was made in the prototype stages for Neo, but never released. Beat Machines - Hasbro's sequel to Beast Wars, again no involvement from Japan. This series was created on a smaller budget than Beast Wars (the results of splitting its budget with the CGI Action Man cartoon) which is reflected in a drastic change of style. Probably the series that divided fans the most due to it's streamlined look and heavy religious undertones. Transformers Car Robots (Robots in Disguise in the US) - The first Transformers anime to get a North American release. An entirely new series made to profit from the popularity Beast Wars the Second and Neo featuring Autobots (vehicles) vs Predacons (animals and later vehicle Decepticons). The toys in Japan were a mix of new figures and repaints of G2 Go-Bots (Spychangers) and other figures, Beast Wars Transmetal 2 figures, and G1 Fortress Maximus. In the US the same figures were released (except for Fortress Maximus which failed current safety tests) along with several other toys that came from various other lines such as unproduced Beast Machines toys and some Japanese repaints. The name Car Robots is a homage to a Takara pre-Transformers line of the same name. Armada, Energon, and Cybertron (aka AEC Trilogy or Unicron Trilogy): The first true joint venture between Hasbro and Takara. Probably the results of the popularity of RID, Hasbro's first time importing a Transformers concept other than their own. Much of the animation was handled by Takara while toy designs were heavily influenced by Hasbro. Time frame on toy release and animation broadcast were separated by a mater of months between Japan and North America though broadcast delays wouldn't make it seem that way in the US. Transformers: Heroes - We can probably expect an official announcement about this one in June/July during Botcon '07. What we do know is that it is being produced by Cartoon Network, it won't involve Takara, it might have a Japanese animation studio involved, but like not on the same capacity as AEC, and David Kaye (who has been almost exclusively the voice of Megatron/Galvatron since Beast Wars) will be playing Optimus Prime. People point at Star Wars: Clone Wars as a Cartoon Network project that might be similar to Heroes. Fun stuff. I wish I had an answer for Char_Aznable though, I don't recall an episode like that. Emerje |
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