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REVIEW: Ghost in the Shell: SAC_2045


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penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 7980
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:08 pm Reply with quote
The dodgy CG aside, I found this to be often as compelling as the first two seasons of Stand Alone Complex. I'm really interested in the "post-human" storyline, and the standalone with the bank heist was excellent. It's just that the CG is such a major hurdle, it can turn people off to a well-written series.

Well, okay, that Purin character can be a little irritating.
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meiam



Joined: 23 Jun 2013
Posts: 2666
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:20 pm Reply with quote
Well it's good to know that things improves after the first episode, cause wow that one was terrible. Starts on powerpoint presentation info dump that goes directly into an incredibly awkward (and I shit you not) Budweiser product placement before having all the character enthusiastically talk about beer while on the job. I guess that was their attempt at americanising the show for new viewer?

Otherwise the concept of sustainable war is one that I wish writer would stop touching. I get it, it sounds deep and all and let you philosophically wax about human nature and blabla. But the amount of money involved in the war industry is actually really small compared to most industry and most importantly, you don't need war to get country to spend money on war related stuff.
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Kicksville



Joined: 20 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:25 pm Reply with quote
As someone who was fully prepared to hate this show, I found myself hooked and pleasantly surprised. I'm definitely in the "this probably would look better if it wasn't 3D" crowd, but it wasn't nearly as bad as I was expecting, for whatever that's worth.

Even more surprising is that I guess I liked it a lot more than other people? I'm finding some of the complaints about the opening episodes a bit baffling, as I didn't find them to be anywhere near as awful as they're being made out to be. The character behavior in that first episode reminded me of the manga, honestly.

The one thing that didn't click with me was Purin, who is, dare I say, a bit of a "love me please" Scrappy Doo. Although that's something that could improve at least - I do wonder if the theory that spoiler[maybe she's actually a Tachikoma, given her exaggerated movements and infatuation with Batou, will amount to anything. Orrrr maybe that's all just exactly what it looks like...]
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penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:33 pm Reply with quote
meiam wrote:
I guess that was their attempt at americanising the show for new viewer?


"Americanization" is an actual plot point in this. But it's not exactly complimentary towards the US.
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Beatdigga



Joined: 26 Oct 2003
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:36 pm Reply with quote
The visuals are exactly why Netflix has been researching ways to upend the current production committee series. They don’t work for the story being told.

https://netflixtechblog.com/bringing-4k-and-hdr-to-anime-at-netflix-with-sol-levante-fa68105067cd
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myfairx



Joined: 29 Sep 2016
Posts: 32
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:22 pm Reply with quote
Kicksville wrote:
As someone who was fully prepared to hate this show, I found myself hooked and pleasantly surprised. I'm definitely in the "this probably would look better if it wasn't 3D" crowd, but it wasn't nearly as bad as I was expecting, for whatever that's worth.

Even more surprising is that I guess I liked it a lot more than other people? I'm finding some of the complaints about the opening episodes a bit baffling, as I didn't find them to be anywhere near as awful as they're being made out to be. The character behavior in that first episode reminded me of the manga, honestly.

The one thing that didn't click with me was Purin, who is, dare I say, a bit of a "love me please" Scrappy Doo. Although that's something that could improve at least - I do wonder if the theory that spoiler[maybe she's actually a Tachikoma, given her exaggerated movements and infatuation with Batou, will amount to anything. Orrrr maybe that's all just exactly what it looks like...]
Exacly what I'm thinking. I'm enjoying the first half ' of the story so far. I always have problem with overly philosophical nature of GITS and somehow the lack of it is a fresh breath IMO

CG choice makes 2045 look like they're using a game engine, but good animation save some grace. I also like how Togusa have more character depth among others.
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Dop.L



Joined: 23 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 2:21 pm Reply with quote
A few episodes in and it's just started getting the feeling of GitS:SAC (which I rewatched recently) for me, and I'll probably grit my teeth about the shonky CG for now.
The opening is one of the few anime openings on Netflix I'll happily skip though. Sadly Origa is no longer with us but I'd hoped for something in a similar style.

I suspect people would be a lot happier with this had it been traditionally animated in the same style as the earlier GitS:SAC series, that CG is a terribly big hurdle to get over.
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Key
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Joined: 03 Nov 2003
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Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 2:33 pm Reply with quote
Kicksville wrote:
The one thing that didn't click with me was Purin, who is, dare I say, a bit of a "love me please" Scrappy Doo. Although that's something that could improve at least - I do wonder if the theory that spoiler[maybe she's actually a Tachikoma, given her exaggerated movements and infatuation with Batou, will amount to anything. Orrrr maybe that's all just exactly what it looks like...]

Yeah, Scrappy Doo is an apt comparison.

While I doubt your theory is the truth, I can easily understand why people would get that impression.
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Zeino



Joined: 19 May 2017
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 2:44 pm Reply with quote
I've made it 9 episodes in, and so far, I'd say it's a pretty good sequel to the Stand Alone Complex series. A few thoughts:

As the others have said, the animation is oddly hit-and-miss: the body motions of the characters, especially when focused upon, are smooth and detailed. Yet background characters, particularly when viewed at a distance, often have stilted, wobbly movements that more resemble the quality which older CGI cartoons from the late 90s were at. Even stranger, the graphical quality seems to actually improve as the episodes go on: the very first scene introducing Major Kusanagi in the Californian desert has some really crappy background foliage and terrain, yet other episodes, especially those taking place in urban environments, have excellent lighting, colors and designs. Yet, one later episode uses a flat texture background for a mountain range that's so clearly obvious and forefront that you can't help but wonder if that was due to laziness or their time/budget running out. It's absolutely nowhere near the almost-slave-ish attention to detail and quality the first two animated seasons and the original film had sadly, but it's not as cruddy as the teaser trailers implied.

This is easily the most action-packed of the SAC series, save for parts of ARISE. Only one episode made a point to avoid having any major action, and And it's good action, too: the fight animation is fluid, nor do they use that annoying Hollywood trope of rapid-cuts to hide animation issues or make the action hard to follow.

The plot so far seems to be the least philosophical. I'm pretty sure the last few episodes are going to make up for that, but the world-building is decent. Also feels strangely like Metal Gear Solid 4, what with the "Sustainable War" being a dead-ringer for the War Economy and endless PMC conflicts at the core of MGS 4's setting. Heck, I'd say SAC 2045 actually did a better job of showing what the world of MGS 4 should've been like, and all the damage that comes along with war being turned into a profitable venture central to the functioning of the world economy.

Also Ghost in the Shell 2: Innocence was good, Theron.
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AiddonValentine



Joined: 07 Aug 2006
Posts: 1787
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 4:22 pm Reply with quote
I will take weak SAC over Arise any day of the week (seriously, Ubakata sucks, the pretentious dweeb). For now I'm gonna wait for the dub because I REALLY want to hear Mary, Rich, Crispin, and William again
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TarsTarkas



Joined: 20 Dec 2007
Posts: 4401
Location: Virginia, United States
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 4:28 pm Reply with quote
I am half way through this season, so far I am enjoying it, as I do most Ghost in the Shell stuff, except Ghost in the Shell 2: Innocence.

Yes, the CG has to be gotten used to, that is a major detractor, but one I can live with. Sadly it is probably budget driven. In the opener, you have the poor man's Westworld opener. Not saying the Ghost in the Shell: SAC 2045 copied them, merely that they are similar scenes, which as mentioned earlier has been done in the Ghost in the Shell franchise. But it is a stark comparison.

The CG really reminds of certain bit torrent animated CG shorts (unofficial) of characters like Lara Croft, and others from several years ago with the movements of the characters. It is really noticeable in the background characters.

Poor Togusa, but you are right about we lose. Though even if you had a strong and loving marriage though, it probably wouldn't survive this job. She probably laid down the ultimatum, the job or me. Not an easy choice, as much as we would like it to be.

I hope that with time, they'll spruce up the CG animation. If not we will just have to live with Aramaki's hair frozen solid.
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Dynamic A



Joined: 18 Feb 2008
Posts: 37
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 5:15 pm Reply with quote
Music the quality of Kenji Kawaii or Yoko Kanno is obviously hard to come by... they certainly didn't come by it here.

-DA
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Mr. sickVisionz



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 2071
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 5:34 pm Reply with quote
I was a little bit let down. I got over the CG pretty quick but I just thought it wasn't all that great GITS content, not to mention that it's paced like a show that runs for 20 episodes back to back. It takes a pretty long time for the actual story to kick into gear and once it does, it oddly feels a little bit rushed to me. It's funny, on one hand it felt like they knew they had 20+ episodes and were going to take their time but then on the other hand, it feels like they crammed a lot into few episode like it was 1 cour and no more.

At the end of the day though, it was GITS and I liked GITS so I didn't drop it or actively hate it. It was far from the best and imo a little bit better than the worse (SSS) but nowhere near as good as the tv series or the Arise OVAs imo.
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gedata



Joined: 04 May 2013
Posts: 510
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 6:04 pm Reply with quote
I can't help but feel as though they gave the character designer that infamous plagiarist Ilya Kushnikov an insert here.


I'm not really sold on this new direction though, and let me get something straight

spoiler[The first half spent trying to rebuild S9 so it can handed Americans to deal with post-humans, but they need to be rescued, because former-S9 has been kidnapped by the Americans to work on post-humans. The main difference being how the NSA decided that the only people capable of the job have to be disposed of after, despite the possibility existing that they'll be needed later.

Also the end of SAC SSS definitely implied that Motoko is aware of what's going to happen in the next decade hence why S9 will be definitely needed. Then this abomination started started off with S9 being disbanded with Motoko and the squad without Togusa running their own PMC gigs. They could've started with S9 being directly needed by the americans to counteract the post-humans threat but they went through a whole 6 episodes of running in a circle. I really just don't buy the idea that the gang would suddenly end up as PMCs sans Togusa just like that.

This would function alot better as a complete stand alone (lol) work, with the end of the first half being the point at which S9 is established for the first time, making the first half more of an origin story. But this franchise doesn't need more splintered continuities so eh.]

Okaaaaay
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IanKen



Joined: 16 Mar 2018
Posts: 27
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:25 pm Reply with quote
I just couldn't make it. I'm willing to tolerate narrative mediocrity if it's technically well executed. And I'm willing to tolerate janky animation of the story is compelling.

Maybe it gets better, but EP1 did not hook me.
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