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Suggested amendments for "Teh Rules"




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nobahn
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 10:14 pm Reply with quote
There are 2 rules that are not referenced in "Teh Rules." Therefore, I respectfully submit the following:

[*]Speculating in the fora is prohibited.
[*]Requesting recommendations is prohibited outside of designated recommendation threads. (See here for Tony K.'s guidance on the subject.)



Tony K. wrote:
EDIT: This is the one and ONLY rule you must abide by. You may ask about one title, and that's it. More than likely, most of you will fail in at least doing this much, but this is all I will offer in terms of negotiation. If you can't do it, then take an English class and work on your writing skills.
----------------------

1. If asking for a (single) particular title, for example: "Is Azumanga Daioh any good," make sure you tell everyone what you've heard about that title so far (if anything, even if it's just a plot summary), what your expectations might be, and also mention series of the same genre you think could be a good reference source.
[*]Requesting recommendations in the fora is mostly prohibited.

Last edited by nobahn on Tue Jan 14, 2014 9:10 am; edited 2 times in total
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Dessa



Joined: 14 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 10:23 pm Reply with quote
How about "Requesting recommendations is prohibited outside of designated recommendation threads"? Instead of just "mostly prohibited"?
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Tony K.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 7:02 am Reply with quote
My explanation for using the Recommendations Index and being able to ask for certain recommendations is explained here. I think I'd go with that as my final draft for the actual policy.
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Nayu



Joined: 23 Dec 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 7:17 am Reply with quote
I'm sorry but since when has speculation been frowned upon? We have thread after thread about speculating dub casts, release dates, content of future programming, meaning of currently airing anime, potential second seasons (with of course the caveat that these aren't their own threads and are part of a broader line of discussion) and what do the sales numbers mean. Banning speculation would be unnecessarily harmful to pretty much all aspects of the discussions on this site.

And although it can be argued that it isn't helpful, it certainly isn't harmful and since the forums are separate from the news aspect of the site and are user created for the most part, these do not speak for ANN. The argument that this is "The Internet's Most Trusted Anime News Soure" is endangered by posts in the forums is silly. (Of course claiming that is also silly since the news here is mostly reposts of news posted on other sites, much like the Drudge Report.)
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Tony K.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 8:49 am Reply with quote
Nayu wrote:
We have thread after thread about speculating dub casts, release dates, content of future programming, meaning of currently airing anime, potential second seasons.

The main annoyance with speculation is the when people just come out of nowhere and ask questions without any kind of obvious answer.

"Will there be another season?"
"When will it be dubbed?"
"Do you think there should be another season? [again, essentially asking if another one is even possible]"

Questions like this (often asked by forum newbies) are frequent enough to the point of tiresome. The simple answer is that "nobody knows when," hence the advice of keeping your eyes posted on the front page for official (i.e. not a "maybe") announcement. And yet we still get the same kind of questions on a regular basis. Otherwise, users wouldn't report said threads.

The difference between asking out of the blue and within, say, a dedicated discussion thread is the presence of continuity, dozens of posts corresponding to an already current topic (or at least, "current" in the sense of the buzz they carry for that particular time), and (usually) enough information from various users and sources that can logically corroborate said conclusions and conjecture.

Discussing a continuation in the heat of the moment after a series ends or the dub cast right after the license is announced is fine with me. The line for speculating is simply drawn at 1) asking the same questions over and over again when the answer is clearly not there, but obviously will be at some point (it's just a matter of being patient and observing); and 2) posting fanfiction or hypothesizing made-up scenarios that attempt to alter franchises so much to the point of sounding ridiculous and/or stupid, and therefore, becoming completely inconsequential. Heck, some of the fanfiction might be so bad, that some people could even get angry or insulted by it.

However, a few of the staff had brought up the possibility of having a dedicated thread for fanfiction. But I think I'd have create a thread in the Anime forum to survey its applicability and popularity, first, to see if its existence would even be accepted by everyone.
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Nayu



Joined: 23 Dec 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 9:59 am Reply with quote
Yeah, I've been known to report those sort of new threads myself. Whatever language is added to Teh Rules does need to be clear about the difference.

Smile
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st_owly
Get off my lawn!Get off my lawn!


Joined: 20 May 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 10:57 am Reply with quote
I know this sounds a bit draconian, but most of these kinds of threads are asked by noobs who probably haven't read the forum rules. Therefore, how feasible is it to automatically post moderate all new members, and if they try create a thread like this, it can then be stopped before it even reaches the forum, and they then get a message along the lines of "Recommendation threads are not allowed, as per forum rules. Please visit the "Anime Hunting..." thread and use the tools there to help yourself find something to watch." or "Speculative questions about second seasons etc are not allowed. Please keep an eye on the series' page in the Encyclopedia for any news. If there's nothing there, then there's no news." It would also stop all the noob necrobumps we've been seeing lately as well. Someone resurrected an 8 year old thread recently and it's just getting silly. Can we also have the feature in the talkback which warns people they're posting in an old thread applied all over the forum please?
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Alan45
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Joined: 25 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 2:50 pm Reply with quote
@st_owly
I think post moderating new members for the first five or ten posts would achieve what you want, but it would likely put a rather large burden on the moderators. I suspect that the current system where we report the offenders and they are then admonished is the most practical. I've noticed that most of the time when I try to report something that it has already been reported. I don't think I've gotten to do more than a couple of reports.

You have to wonder about some people. Most of the offenders are on their first post. I lurked for a year and waited a couple of months after I registered before I posted anything. To a certain extent it is kinda fun watching Tony or Key stomp all over their feelings. You can almost always tell just by looking at the thread title what is going to happen.
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TsunaReborn!
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Joined: 08 Sep 2012
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:18 pm Reply with quote
Is there a way that when a new account is created they are taken to Teh Rules page? Or they agree to these rules before they create their account - much like terms and conditions, that way some may read through before they complete their account creation.
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mdo7
It...it's not like I post for you or anything!It...it's not like I post for you or anything!


Joined: 23 May 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:27 pm Reply with quote
TsunaReborn! wrote:
Is there a way that when a new account is created they are taken to Teh Rules page? Or they agree to these rules before they create their account - much like terms and conditions, that way some may read through before they complete their account creation.


Yeah I like that idea TsunaReborn. I'm all for this idea too. Smile

Is there a way everytime a new user signed up to be part of ANN, they have to read and click/sign on a agreement. Maybe it'll help (except for trolls that like to aggravate people without violating "black & white rules"). But still, it can help a lot.
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st_owly
Get off my lawn!Get off my lawn!


Joined: 20 May 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 8:52 am Reply with quote
It's a good idea. But by signing up to the forum, you're already agreeing to follow the rules. I did register on a forum once (can't remember which one) where you were taken to a rules page, but the "accept and continue" button didn't become active until you'd spent a minute on the page. Might force people to actually read the rules. Perhaps a page with "Welcome. If you're looking for some new anime to watch, please visit this thread (with a link to the anime hunting thread) or use the encyclopedia. If you're wanting to know if there's a second season upcoming, please check the show's encyclopedia page. If there's nothing there, then there's no news about it. If you have a question which can't be answered by these methods, please either ask in the series' thread, (link to series discussion index) or in the "general anime questions thread."
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mdo7
It...it's not like I post for you or anything!It...it's not like I post for you or anything!


Joined: 23 May 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 2:13 pm Reply with quote
Yeah I can accept that too, but we have to make sure new users read the rule first before they do anything. Also I wish we had some sort of implements to sort of "screen" users if the person is a troll or a avid civil-minded anime fans that want to express their thought.

[EDIT: Please don't over-quote. Thanks. -TK]
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Alan45
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 4:27 pm Reply with quote
Unfortunately there is no way to identify a troll until they start trolling. Fortunately they usually can't help themselves and reveal their nature as soon as they start to post. The same can be said of banned people who sneak back.

You have to be careful about giving new people too many hoops to jump through to register. If you are too strict they are likely to get discouraged. Ultimately this could kill the site.

Banning is the same way. There is a fine line between keeping the forums civil and banning too many. Most of us have made injudicious comments at one time or another or ridden a hobby horse until others screamed. If they get too quick with the ban hammer you could end with five people in the forum who don't read each others posts.

I think we currently are in a good place. Not to strict and not too soft. Give the bad eggs enough rope and they will surely hang themselves. Trolls can't help but troll, it is the nature of the beast. As for the new types, if they were the type to actually read the rules they wouldn't be a problem. Report them, let the moderators deal with them. In time they may become decent forum inhabitants.

The main thing is to make the rules clear so Tony or Key can rub their noses in it.
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nobahn
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 7:26 pm Reply with quote
I have been informed that my suggested amendments will not be used; therefore, may I request that this thread be locked?
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