Forum - View topicCode Geass: Lelouch of the Rebellion (TV) - dub.
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HitokiriShadow
 Posts: 6251 |
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As mentioned before, why people consider Code Geass a trainwreck varies, but its generally not a single event but a combination of a number of events and factors. The series has plenty of plot holes, things that don't make sense or don't stand up well to logic, and some things are just downright silly. One of my biggest problems with the first season is coming up in about two episodes. However, whether these things constitute a trainwreck depends on what you consider a trainwreck. For me, Gundam SEED Destiny was a trainwreck but Code Geass just gets silly at times and I can deal with that (I just stop worrying about the details too much). So take the whole trainwreck thing with a big grain of salt because it really depends on A) what you consider a trainwreck and B) how seriously you take the storyline, try to hold it up to "good writing" standards, or try to apply logic to it and how much its failure on the latter to counts bothers you. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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With regards to the "train wreck" label that some fans have used, they may have been meaning different things. Wikipedia gives several definitions for Train Wreck in the metaphorical sense.
I disagree that Code Geass falls under the definitions of "foreseeable but unavoidable", or "disastrous yet inevitable". There is a fairly major event which happens late in the series. I believe it was relatively unforeseeable, and didn't have to be inevitable. However, if we use the definition "distasteful yet morbidly fascinating", we can apply it to that previously-mentioned event. Therefore, I believe that people have been correct to call it a "train wreck", but they have been applying the wrong definitions. This is negated if they use the classical use of the metaphor, which is to "get progressively worse". I disagree with them that the series trends significantly downhill*, but that is more a matter of opinion, and harder to prove or disprove. On a final note, I can say that after a somewhat-shaky start, the second season is just awesome at the moment. So please, don't let a few incidents get in your way of watching it when it eventually comes out in dub format. Hope I haven't put in anything that needed a spoiler tag. No-one wants to piss off an entire thread of people. Thank you for reading. *After that superb start, the only direction it could go was down. But, I don't think its fallen as much as some people claim. |
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HitokiriShadow
Posts: 6251 |
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I've mostly seen the train wreck label applied to the writing and general direction of the series. In other words, they are saying that the series as a whole at some point became a giant mess and is unsalvagable, at least in the sense that they cannot take the story remotely seriously anymore. And it was accused of being a trainwreck long before the event you are talking about. As I said before, whether or not the series becomes a trainwreck depends largely on what you are expecting of the series and how much of a suspension of disbelief you can manage. The trainwreck accusation largely seems to be from people who cannot reconcile the school hijinks and LOL Pizza and Fanservice with a more serious story.* They often tend to obsess over trivial details too much and make too big of a deal over things not being particularly realistic. If you are still enjoying it now and don't think its on its way to becoming a trainwreck, you probably won't feel that way about it, though you may well have some issues (possibly major ones) by the time the first season is over. *I would also argue that the story is not intended to taken as seriously as some do, did, or want(ed) to. If you were expecting a dark or fairly serious story (like Rahxephon, Stellvia or the more serious aspects of Full Metal Panic, not necessarily something like Evangelion or Gasaraki), then Code Geass is not what you are looking for and it made that clear early on. |
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nightjuan
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If you ask me Code Geass has always been a messy show, in either season, mainly because it's always trying to do too much and doesn't take itself quite as seriously as other series, but I do think there's some "method to the madness".
More than what many people would like to admit, in my opinion, which is why I avoid using the whole "train wreck" label in its common definition. But I understand that may require either sufficient suspension of disbelief or just good-natured enjoyment, which may be a problem for some viewers. There are certain things which rely on coincidences, in-universe logic or off-screen developments, but only a couple of them are events that I would really want to complain about. Most I just find to be minor or easily explained away, and some incidents I can dislike but still understand or even come to appreciate because they move the story forward. I've enjoyed most of the show so far and the first season, in particular, stands up to a good re-watch whenever I want to be entertained. The sequel stumbles in certain respects, but I would agree that it eventually finds its way again, or at least comes as close as it could. Other than that, it depends on how it will all finally come to an end. Dub-only viewers are blessed, in a way, because by the time they're done with the first season R2 should have already finished too, and thus they can choose to watch the whole thing at once if they so desire. In any case, I would like to apologize if the thread went a little off-course because of my previous response. |
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BrothersElric
 Posts: 1996 |
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Well like I said before, I'm not really a harsh critic or picky person who pays attention to every single little detail anyways, so I don't think it'll bother me that much even if it is. I'll just have to watch the episodes myself to see what I think. |
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archaron
 Posts: 1024 |
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I can understand why spoiler[he erased Shirley's memory, but at the same token I can't say he had the right to do what he did. He should have left the choice up to her. I have always been big on free will. I find it hard to relate his way of thinking. (I just hope this series does not end up being too similar to Death Note.)] |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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It is already comparable to spoiler[Death Note. I watched the first three episodes of Code Geass in a blur (by way of fansubs). By the end of the first, I had already made the connection that this show was following Death Note's lead in portraying a dark protagonist. By the time I had finished watching the third, I knew it without a trace of doubt. Lelouch is overall a nicer person, but he has a dark streak to him that Light himself would be proud of.] I also realised early on that the mecha were derived from spoiler[Eureka 7. Sure, there are a ton of differences, but you cannot tell me that the Lancelot does not resemble the Nirvash. They both are of similar sizes (not 18m robots, anyway) and have similar structural designs (ignoring transformation capabilities). After seeing the Lancelot in episode two, it was obvious that it's moves were based off the fast-moving LFOs.] |
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BladeDragoonZETA
 Posts: 586 |
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this did come from the same company that gave us E7 (Sunrise) so I'm quite sure some of the mecha designers worked on both shows.
this last episode is definitely one I really like, and dub Mao did a very good job spoiler[sounding crazy] |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Well, it's not like it is very hard to portray him spoiler[as crazy.] If the episode you just watched was the fifteenth, then all Mao's VA had to do for this episode was turn up for work. |
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BladeDragoonZETA
Posts: 586 |
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Oh I don't know promising spoiler[to make CC "compact"]
requires you to sound somewhat spoiler[crazy] |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Yes, but his actions (attempted actions, really) are so awful that they really carry the performance. Even a passable attempt at spoiler[craziness] is enough. Though of course I'm glad that the VA put in the effort to make him sound really spoiler[insane]. |
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Ohoni
Posts: 3421 |
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I think credit is due here, he did deliver the lines in an engaging and believable manner. A lesser performance, either too mellow or too over the top could really have ruined the tension of the scenes by making them too comical. I've heard crazy done badly in the past, and that wasn't bad.
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BellosTheMighty
 Posts: 767 |
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Re: trainwrecks... I think it's happening constantly, but where you think the big one comes depends on what aspects of the story you like. Or to be more specific, the underlying problem with Code Geass seems to be that it can't decide on what approach to take to its material. At first it was going the Death Note route with a sociopathic teen genius carrying out a masterplan to re-make the world. Then Lelouche mellowed somewhat and it swerved into a role-reversed Gundam, with a masked schemer being the focus of the narrative and a idealistic pilot with a super-advanced mecha being his noble but misguided rival. Then it became a story about military and political maneuvering, and now it seems to have swerved again into a kind of magical girlfriend/relationship drama rigamarole. It's not as bad as Gundam Wing, where the story shifts gears every five episodes with an audible clunking sound, but I can see why people argue so much about where it fails. In fact it fails at several different times depending on what you're expecting.
Of course, if you don't care about that shit, you can just enjoy the story. The story has been pretty consistantly enjoyable, if sometimes merely average. |
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joshuafer
 Posts: 262 |
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I enjoyed the latest episode, which was 15. I did think Mao spoiler[ would be around longer, kinda surprised he was killed off.] I also thought it interesting when Shirley saw Lelouch at school,spoiler[ maybe he should try to hook up with her again.] I can see comparing this to death note, but in death note light had 0 problem killing non criminals. Sure, lelouch spoiler[ blew up that ship with the resistance guys,] but sometimes you need to sacrifice some pawns to get a shot at the King, chess style strategy. He does not seem as cold hearted as Light did, to me. Hell, when Light spoiler[ considered having to kill his own sister, and the ] time where he spoiler[killed that newscaster lady, was pretty damn cold.] I was also a little surprised to see that the girl who got shot spoiler[ by shirley had amnesia...sounds like a soap opera now. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out.]I wonder if much is resolved at the end of the first season, since they made a second season..
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zanarkand princess
 Posts: 1484 |
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Well spoiler[ I think light was prepared to kill everyone else in the room before his sister but he might have.] While lelouch seems like a nicer person I think he's a lot more selfish than light thought he was (does that make sense?) If he didn't have any motives I hardly think that he would be out fighting. I also think the show is going down a very messy road even in season 2. It wants to do so much it doesn't know where to begin and it ends up becoming a bit ridiculous in all of it's over the topness.
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