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REVIEW: Guin Saga Collection 1


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Otaking09



Joined: 24 Feb 2009
Posts: 616

PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 11:06 pm Reply with quote
David Matranga played D'eon not Durand. Illich played Durand.

Look out for those switches Key!

[EDIT: Review has been corrected to account for this. That's what I get for not rigorously double-checking my facts. Razz - Key]
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Top Gun



Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1974

PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 2:58 am Reply with quote
I don't dabble much in recently-airing series other than skimming the seasonal preview guides, but Guin Saga was a show that stuck out like a sore thumb to me. I'm a huge sucker for high fantasy stories, and it's a fairly-rare anime series that tackles that genre. (Moribito and Escaflowne are probably the only two I've seen myself.) It's great to hear that this series lived up to my initial impressions; I'll definitely give it a try at some point. Smile
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maaya



Joined: 14 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:01 am Reply with quote
Top Gun wrote:
I'm a huge sucker for high fantasy stories, and it's a fairly-rare anime series that tackles that genre. (Moribito and Escaflowne are probably the only two I've seen myself.)


Don't forget The 12 Kingdoms. Very Happy

Guin Saga has an awesome soundtrack, but the rest is unfortunately not as good as it could have been. 16 novels is just too much for 26 episodes, so they had to cut out a lot, leaving plot holes and "flatness" instead. And they preferred to put the focus on the action instead of the story / the setting, adding even more (badly animated) action scenes than the novels have, and therefore cutting out even more of the other content.

It's too bad, because this could have been an epic series, but imho it turned out just "ok". Well, still better than most of the rest ><
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Nayu



Joined: 23 Dec 2010
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:16 am Reply with quote
Is it only one beastman or should I stay away from this due to my irrational fear of furries stemming from watching far too much Thundercats as a youngster?
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maaya



Joined: 14 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:33 am Reply with quote
Nayu wrote:
Is it only one beastman or should I stay away from this due to my irrational fear of furries stemming from watching far too much Thundercats as a youngster?


only one ... but it has some monkeys oO
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Key
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Joined: 03 Nov 2003
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Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)

PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 8:00 am Reply with quote
maaya wrote:
Guin Saga has an awesome soundtrack, but the rest is unfortunately not as good as it could have been. 16 novels is just too much for 26 episodes, so they had to cut out a lot, leaving plot holes and "flatness" instead. And they preferred to put the focus on the action instead of the story / the setting, adding even more (badly animated) action scenes than the novels have, and therefore cutting out even more of the other content.


Yeah, that's something that I neglected to mention in the review. Something had to be cut out to cover that much story in only 26 episodes, and clearly a fuller sense of detail about the setting was it. Heck, the trailers go into more detail about the background of Parros than the anime does; nowhere in the anime do they mention that Parros has been around for something like 3,000 years, for instance. A map of some sort would have been nice, too. But that's that's the norm for anime adaptations of novel series. (The Twelve Kingdoms is one of the rare exceptions.)

Since you seem familiar with the novels, maaya, can you comment (in appropriate spoiler tags, of course) on exactly what all was cut out?
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samuelp



Joined: 25 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 8:50 am Reply with quote
Key wrote:
maaya wrote:
Guin Saga has an awesome soundtrack, but the rest is unfortunately not as good as it could have been. 16 novels is just too much for 26 episodes, so they had to cut out a lot, leaving plot holes and "flatness" instead. And they preferred to put the focus on the action instead of the story / the setting, adding even more (badly animated) action scenes than the novels have, and therefore cutting out even more of the other content.


Yeah, that's something that I neglected to mention in the review. Something had to be cut out to cover that much story in only 26 episodes, and clearly a fuller sense of detail about the setting was it. Heck, the trailers go into more detail about the background of Parros than the anime does; nowhere in the anime do they mention that Parros has been around for something like 3,000 years, for instance. A map of some sort would have been nice, too. But that's that's the norm for anime adaptations of novel series. (The Twelve Kingdoms is one of the rare exceptions.)

Since you seem familiar with the novels, maaya, can you comment (in appropriate spoiler tags, of course) on exactly what all was cut out?

Actually, there's a full "map of Guin Saga" feature video that was/is on the official Japanese Guin Saga anime website.

http://www.guinsaga.net/​special/​index.​html

Click on "Navigation of Guin Saga".

It's a bit too bad it (and the other ~5 web extras) couldn't be included in the release but since they weren't on the R2 DVDs it makes that tough.

There are some maps in the published english novels, but they only cover up to the end of the Battle of Nospherus.
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samuelp



Joined: 25 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 8:54 am Reply with quote
Key wrote:
maaya wrote:
Guin Saga has an awesome soundtrack, but the rest is unfortunately not as good as it could have been. 16 novels is just too much for 26 episodes, so they had to cut out a lot, leaving plot holes and "flatness" instead. And they preferred to put the focus on the action instead of the story / the setting, adding even more (badly animated) action scenes than the novels have, and therefore cutting out even more of the other content.


Yeah, that's something that I neglected to mention in the review. Something had to be cut out to cover that much story in only 26 episodes, and clearly a fuller sense of detail about the setting was it. Heck, the trailers go into more detail about the background of Parros than the anime does; nowhere in the anime do they mention that Parros has been around for something like 3,000 years, for instance. A map of some sort would have been nice, too. But that's that's the norm for anime adaptations of novel series. (The Twelve Kingdoms is one of the rare exceptions.)

Since you seem familiar with the novels, maaya, can you comment (in appropriate spoiler tags, of course) on exactly what all was cut out?


Basically what was cut out was huge amounts of detail. This doesn't really spoiler anything, but for example in the novels there were something like 5-6 different Sem tribes instead of 3.
There were a lot more different Mongaul captains, and the events in the beginning at the Keep were simplified considerably.

At the same time, random characters for Guin to fight were inserted into the anime, like the unnamed bodyguard in the keep. They basically wanted to make sure Guin kicked ass constantly in the beginning to draw in an audience, I think.
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maaya



Joined: 14 Oct 2007
Posts: 976

PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:23 pm Reply with quote
samuelp wrote:
Basically what was cut out was huge amounts of detail.


Yes, that sums it up pretty well. The novels are full of details about the setting, the world, its history, its legends, the different political powers (how did a mighty nation as Parros even get attacked in the first place), countries and their culture (Sem culture f.ex.). Well, of course these things are easier to include in a book, but still makes the world lose much of its richness.

What is also missing from the anime is often the whole context. Why is X fighting with Y and how? The tactical part of the battles is left out and is replaced with simple "Guin VS X" kinds of fights. And the missing details lead to plot holes or difficulty to understand some parts, and a loss of suspense imho.

spoiler[F.ex. the Yidoh(?) monsters. In the anime they kind of appear as some Deus Ex Machina, and we don't really know what they are or how they work. While in the novel all this is explained in detail.]

In short, the whole Nospheros battle is simply much more complex.

The characters also suffer from the cuts. Amnelis, Astrias and Marus are all quite complex characters, with their own feelings and worries, of which you don't see much in the anime. Even the Black Lord of the keep has some background.
In the book you get to know much more of Remus' feelings as well (and while he is still the weaker twin, he is not as weak as in the anime) and Guin is much more impressing as a main character imho.

On the other hand, they added fights, f.ex. with different minor monsters and many of those with Marus, which never happened in the books. I would have preferred for them to use that screentime for different stuff ><

Well, it's not all bad ... but could have been much better.
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belvadeer



Joined: 11 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2011 12:18 pm Reply with quote
Nayu wrote:
Is it only one beastman or should I stay away from this due to my irrational fear of furries stemming from watching far too much Thundercats as a youngster?


This might sound strange coming from the guy who makes jokes about furries and what anime they like but...don't be ridiculous.

That aside, I've got to hear this in English! Very Happy
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MaxSouth



Joined: 11 Oct 2008
Posts: 1166

PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2011 4:17 pm Reply with quote
from what I have read, there is a point to see this animé, but I actually hate the way the industry dumbed down the rarest chance to build a truly large scale, epic fantasy animé into something just a bit better than average (yet with made-up plot holes/deus ex machina crutches that not necessarily were in the manga)...

there are countless of animé series which have no world behind them, and now the industry could make something different, but they have failed, intentionally...

probably this Guin Saga would actually deserve to be redone in proper manner (maybe as 52-episodes long series), but this will never happen since there was only one chance... they had to do this right way from very beginning...


Last edited by MaxSouth on Sat Mar 26, 2011 4:30 am; edited 1 time in total
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Bara_Megami



Joined: 08 May 2004
Posts: 106

PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2011 5:25 pm Reply with quote
I noticed a few typos:

11 minute retrospective on original author Karo Kurimoto -> Kaoru Kurimoto

relies a little too much on dues ex machina -> deus ex machina

But yeah, this anime seems interesting. I liked what I read of the manga Vertical translated, even though I am generally not interested in epic fantasy like this.
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maaya



Joined: 14 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2011 5:48 pm Reply with quote
btw, Kanon has also recorded a very beautiful English version of the ending theme. Too bad it's not included as an extra it seems ...
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Key
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Joined: 03 Nov 2003
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Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)

PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2011 8:16 pm Reply with quote
maaya wrote:
btw, Kanon has also recorded a very beautiful English version of the ending theme. Too bad it's not included as an extra it seems ...


Really? We can only hope that it may be included with the second collection. (Which is certainly possible, since the end theme doesn't change.)

The errors mentioned in the previous post will be dealt with.
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Greed1914



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 1858

PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2011 8:57 pm Reply with quote
I haven't gotten around to watching this, but I've been told that I'd like it. The setting certainly sounds interesting, if nothing else.
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