Forum - View topicPhilosophical speculation-- what makes anime different ...??
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Steve Berry
Posts: 522 Location: San Francisco Bay Area, CA |
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So, here I am thinking-- what makes anime "art"?? And more importantly, what makes it different from other forms of expression?? I mean, what does a story get from being told in this form...??
Imagine, for example-- Bebop, or Escaflowne, or Macross Plus, or Spirited Away, or whatever.... but as a novel, a poem, a live action movie, a play, a comic book.... etc. And vice versa-- imagine a novel you love, or a comic, etc.-- What changes by making it into anime?? What improves, what do you lose?? Now, lets pretend that any movie you made had as big a budget as you wanted, etc. so you could have as great of special effects as you wanted... etc. If so, then does that cancel out the "visuals" as an important aspect specific to anime?? Or is the fact that it can produce amazing visuals on a much smaller budget than a hollywood movie important?? (BTW, is that fact true-- the financial bit? It's my understanding, but I'm not absolutely positive) And... its not about topics either, I figure-- I mean, any story in a novel could have robots or aliens, etc. Much sci-fi does. What then makes anime... anime? And what does it do that other forms don't do as well? What does it do worse?? My own first thoughts-- the serial nature of the TV shows is important-- you can tell a very large story, but it actually has an ending-- which creates a story arc. This is very different from American TV or movies. That's my first thought. I mean, though, besides that-- is it just cultural?? That the culture of anime allows creators in Japan to do things that we don't "allow" our movie makers, artists, etc. to do?? i.e. incredilbe visual mayhem and flexibility-- not everything has to be linear. i.e. the ability to have an open ending, with some strings left untied (which I personally like at times) i.e. long quiet moments with a more subtle soundtrack (this you can particularly see, as an example, in the new dubs that Disney has put out for the Miyazaki films, where they've actually changed some of the orchestration to "pump" things up). Are these the things that makes anime special?? And if so, are they inherently part of the form, or simply the fortunate mistake that is the culture of the form?? Opinions anyone?? What do you think makes anime... different? specific? |
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Coral Skipper
Posts: 223 |
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The main thing that sets anime apart from other cartoons is the fact that shows are often targeted at an older audience and have a plot to go along with it unlike the Simpsons or South Park, both of which I like.
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Legato 2057
 Posts: 437 Location: Soon to be Japan |
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I have to disagree with Coral Skipper. For every adult anime like Cowboy Beebop, there is also an childrens anime like Hamtaro. Not to say one form is any worse than the other, I personnaly enjoyed watching Pokemon. I think that what sets it apart form say american animation or live action films, is the Japanese persepctive. I know this sound like "Anime is different because its made in Japan". But in reality thats what it is. There seems to be something in the Japanese culture that draws each and every one to anime/manga/sentai/etc... It may be as Steve Berry said and be the fact that you can view a story from begining to end, which i personally enjoy. Or being able to have an ending with loose straws like Cowboy Beebop or Trigun (two of my favorited BTW) which allows you to wonder: "Ok what exactly did Vash/Ed do after that?"
There are a million other reasons why I like anime, but I can't remember them all 
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king_micah
 Posts: 994 Location: OSU |
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In anime, the artistic and dramatic freedom exists to bring real stories. Few live actions can surivive studio processes to do the same. But a few do manage, Like Babylon 5, Blake 7, The Prisoner. These are very rare, yet anime's form allows more visions to take place, more often. That's why anime can be so good and be art.
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radicaledward
 Posts: 776 |
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I have to agree partly with the theory of "Anime is different becuase it is from Japan", which by default allows for a different cutural persecive on things. However, I also belive that anime is different becuase it can sometimes be a more conducive media for some forms of expression. For example, some shows that do well in an animated media (e.x. FLCL) might not be able to carry the same weight in the "Live-Action" media.
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Yuki555
 Posts: 164 Location: Georgia |
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Hmm...this is a bit tough. I think anime is different because the art is captivating for one thing. It also follow an interesting storyline (sometimes), that you want to know what'll happen next. Like a good book. There's also the great music to enhance the experience.
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JETBLACK87
 Posts: 1073 |
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I think its the roots of animation from Japan as aposed to it here. all(most) kids have been brought up with cartoons and cartoons are thought to be ment for kids. but its different that that in Japan. so thats why there are more mature anime in Japan, but still having the stuff for kids.
and another thing, I might be wrong about this, is that the live-action movie industry is bigger in the US that in Japan. so all the movie makers in the US make live-action but in Japan its mostly animated. |
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Woo Jae
Posts: 69 Location: NYC and the Bronx. |
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Hmm...
It's a tough question, but I think one of the many reasons I like anime so much is the juxtaposition of both funny/sad, normal/weird, cliched/noncliched characters and themes that make it unique. This weird/oddness probably has more to do with Japanese culture and mentality than not. Take a movie like Grave of the Fireflies. There, you have a sad tale of brother, sister, and war. Yet, even amidst the tragedy, we see Setsuko and Seitaro having fun amidst the war. Other animes to this as well - take Rurouni Kenshin TV series. There, the characters can be deadly serious and silly at almost the same time. This doesn't happen as much in what I have seen of American animation. Or even in His and Her Circumstances, wheren Miyazawa can be insanely cute as her "little" exaggerated self and poses, and be completely normal in the next. Then, of course, you have the interesting characterization of the characters and the way it can be taken to extremes. Here is a well explained reasoning of anime as art/valid form of entertainment as one may find on the web. http://www.serc.rmit.edu.au/~ashelton/anime/html/page_site.html#rant1 |
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Steve Berry
Posts: 522 Location: San Francisco Bay Area, CA |
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If you're interested, it's really quite interesting. The concept of anime being "focused"-- i.e. that everything has to be made, created, versus live action film, where much is prebuilt or filmed by chance, is a very interesting arguement.
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jmays
ANN Past Staff
 Posts: 1390 Location: St. Louis, MO |
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Ah, focus... A couple of months ago, I wrote a column discussing "focus" in anime. [ link ] Sorry about the pretentious tone. ^^;; -Jonathan |
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Dan42
Chief Encyclopedist
 Posts: 3817 Location: Montreal |
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Heheh. This is reminding me of this thread and this column at anipike.
Personally, I think Andrew Shelton is a genius for coming up with that concept of focus. (And he's got one of the best anime review sites on the net to boot -- too bad he stopped updating.) When I read that rant of his, it was an absolute revelation for me. It answered questions that I had been asking myself, consciously or subconsciously. I was ripe... and it completely shaped my way of thinking about animation and the way I see myself as an anime fan. One of the most common question on forums is "why do you like anime?" or "what makes anime better?" Previously I could only answer something about intricate story lines and characters, and that was true, but then why wasn't I similarly attracted to intricate story lines and characters in live-action? Oh, sure I prefer live-action movies when they have those qualities, but why did I seek out animation in *particular*, why was I drawn to animation more than live-action? With the concept of focus, everything becomes clear. This is something that is unique to animation, something that live action does not -- can not -- have. Through focus and the ability to not be confined by realism, every scene in anime can be amplified, every action and every emotion can be made bigger, more powerful, more touching. As a simple example, just think about the colors in a Miyazaki movie. These vibrant colors would be utterly impossible in a live-action movie (or would require to unrealistically increase color saturation), yet they have a vital impact on the atmosphere of the movie. |
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Godaistudios
Posts: 2075 Location: Albuquerque, NM (the land of entrapment) |
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If I could find one word to describe that column, I'd call it an epiphany. I'm in complete awe of just how well that described things. And not to use a pun here, it's causing me to focus on... focus. Talk about a way of enhancing one's experience. He truly shows how it can be considered a viable artform, rather than just being referred to being a cartoon. ^_^;
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Steve Berry
Posts: 522 Location: San Francisco Bay Area, CA |
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Dan, I read over the thread you linked to, as well as the article, as before. Some questions, though, ..
At the end of the article on "focus" he mentions that he'd like people to respond with observations of their own regarding focus, etc. Is there a link to that?? Or is it a thread on a forum on that site?? Or were people just emailing only to him?? I'm very interested in seeing some of the other examples, moments of "focus" that others wrote in about, or discussed on a thread there. Do you have any info on that? Also, I read the thread you linked to. Interesting, but boy did it get highjacked by the semantic discussion regarding "child" and "escapism". ugh. Finally, I was thinking about the links between comics and anime, and their importance to why anime is anime, and how it functions as a form. Has anyone else here read "Understanding Comics" by Scott McCloud?? A fascinating read on how comics work as comics, and the entire book is written as a comic, which makes it wonderfully accessible and visual-- the way a book should be on comics. Anyways, in it, he describes a host of things, many of which apply to anime. He even has a lot to say about manga. Firstly, the oversized eyes and simplified expressions of many comic characters, in both anime and manga-- he lends to it an importance regarding the ability of a viewer to empathize with a character. It's easier, and sometimes deeper, when the expressions are simplified and thereby amplified (think: Van Gogh's "The Scream"-- is that the right name??). You are better able to relate to the character with some of your own emotional specifics. He also comments on the frequent difference in detail between the backgrounds and the characters-- i.e. where the characters are simply drawn, and the backgrounds are magnificently detailed-- this is for everything from Akira to Bebop to Nausicaa. The depth of the background adds a sense of reality to the abstracted emotions being expressed on the simplified faces of the characters, thereby amplifying the emotional effect. The discussion of focus fits right into this. I wonder if this tendency in anime stems from earlier cultural norms set up in the Japanese comic tradition. Does anyone know about (or a have a link to an article about) anime's links to manga, historically, and the relationship between the two forms-- i.e. how the way anime is made has been determined in large part by the conventions of a different form (manga)...?? This is fascinating to me, as manga and anime, however much they might share, are very, very different in terms of the techniques they have available to them and how they are put together. Comics have to show time linearly, in the sequence of space, whereas animation is able to show time in only one space (i.e. you can't look at multiple moments of time in animation, the way you can in a comic). This is all obvious once you think about it, but it's interesting to note the common use of still frames in anime, for effect, or the occassional use of word bubbles and multiple comics-style frames in anime, as in Kare Kano. All these "comic" devices have functional uses for storytelling (i.e. still frames to highten the effect of a moment, allowing you to pause on it and consider it longer than if things were still moving... multiple comic-style frame to allow a viewer to experience more than one moment of time/visual perspective at once), but other types of animation, such as Disney, don't use any of these techniques, probably because they don't use motion...... It is these sorts of cultural links between manga and anime that make anime such a fascinating type of animation. BTW, the book by Scott McCloud is absolutely worth reading if you're interested in comics or manga, etc.... |
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jmays
ANN Past Staff
Posts: 1390 Location: St. Louis, MO |
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Hehehe. Guess how many responses I got to that thing. Zero. Oh well...of course, you could always write about others here =) -Jonathan |
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Steve Berry
Posts: 522 Location: San Francisco Bay Area, CA |
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Time to remedy that sad fact Miagi. It's one thing to propose a fascinating theory. It's another to have a wealth of examples at one's fingertips. Besides, it's good for the viewing muscles to have a purpose at times....
Some of my favorites-- Final (?) episode of Escaflowne. spoiler[Hitomi is in a "psychic" state. In her vision, Van is running away from her. The background is completely blank. All attention is given to Hitomi, Van, the web between them, and the pendulum necklace swinging across the screen. The web only breaks when she realizes that she loves Van, and that she needs to let him be free. She does. The web breaks, and he disappears, free, and free to love her. ]A wonderful meshing of visual/oral form and emotional story telling. It's moments like this that anime thrives at. End of the 27th episode of Macross. spoiler[The Zentradi are destroying the planet, a powerful reliving of the dropping of the bomb. Interestingly enough, this happens at the end of the show, rather than being the premise of the beginning of the show, which is far more common. The show is more a sad and meaningful attempt to stop the dropping of the bomb, which fails. You do, however, get to see what happens just after it. Visually, from above, it's beautiful, almost like starbursts, mirroring those seen in space. On the planet, the incredibly vivid colors pull you in, the form of the human as the blasts hit impact are there, yet simplified, almost symbolic as they're engulfed. Details like like metal melting are closed in on, in the midst of the bombardment. ]Things impossible to do with a live action camera, and the kind of sweeping motion you are unable to render in a comic. Minmay begins to sing, almost a dirge. Also in Macross, as Hikaru (Rick Hunter) relives the death of spoiler[Ben, the episdoe after Ben (pardon the Robotech names here) has died. You see Ben in his cockpit, the powerful yellow and red behind him. As his ship is encircled in the flame of the barrier system, ]you see the simplified form of the face and torso, made sketchy and black with pen marks, and you hear the scream. Vivid and emotional? Absolutely. A visual technique that can only be rendered, not recorded, if you know what I mean. A host of scenes in Spirited Away. From the train driving over the water, to the utter blackness of the tunnel at the beginning of the film, as the walk through it, only the light at the end being represented. A final side note-- CGI is really animation, IMO, and is a fascinating way in which animation techniques are brought into live action film. Think-- T2, as you watch the flames roll across the play ground in the Judgement Day dream sequence. Something that could only be made, not captured. However, the concept of making it seem "real" is still very much there, even for something like LOTR, and this is a major difference between CGI in live action films versus anime, or CGI in anime. Other moments of focus, anyone? Other ways in which the gears of anime work and turn? |
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