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Why is the Wii such a horrible system?


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GATSU



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 3:15 pm Reply with quote
I only just got a used copy a few months ago, and it's like playing the Virtual Boy with better graphics all over again.
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Tony K.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 5:22 pm Reply with quote
Well, in respect to its innovation at the time, the Wii was a real game-changer for the industry because of the whole "physicality" scheme they built into it. That particular function allowed for more lively social interactions and physical activity, something video gaming consoles had never really achieved before; "interaction," sure, but not to the degree of having everybody swinging Wii-motes around. It was more than just sitting down, holding a controller, and fiddling your fingers for a few hours. It made you stand up, move around, and people thought it was fun.

Granted, its actual video gaming aspects aren't nearly as loud and pretty as what we've come to know through the more traditional and contemporary forms (PlayStation, XBox, PC, and I guess even those handheld consoles). But the sales numbers speak for themselves, and the Wii still sold a lot of systems.

Personally, I was spoiled by HD gaming and movies well before I got a chance to try the Wii. The Wii-exclusive stuff played pretty well, but then I tried playing the music games (Guitar Hero and Rock Band), and the interface for the key notes felt soo~ much clunkier in comparison to PS3. And as I mentioned about the HD spoilage, I kinda' got annoyed at the fact that all the games were still made in SD. To me, it's like a movie studio deciding to only release a brand new big budget film on DVD in 2014, when everybody else is doing BD releases.

The technical aspects were its big downfall for me. And while I can appreciate what the Wii did for everyone else, I thought it still felt a generation behind in terms of presentation.
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classicalzawa
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 5:48 pm Reply with quote
There are a few games that make me go "well, I'm already stuck with it, might as well get these", but most of the Nintendo first party stuff? Better on Gamecube (or perhaps DS, except motion controls actually make sense for Metroid, but then Other M was made...). There's the Klonoa remake, No More Heroes, Lost in Shadow was enjoyable, I liked Fragile Dreams a lot, ExciteBots is probably the racing game for the system (yeah, not Mario Kart slot machine reel), and if you can still buy Wiipoints, there's stuff like Secret of Mana, Mario RPG, and Chrono Trigger (though statistically, we all own that game at least twice by now). Nothing worth buying the system for, but if you have it, it is possible to find the needles in the haystack and find them for cheap (and I'm assuming you'd already know of Xenoblade and such). Almost all of the best games have something in common though: they use the wiimotion as minimally as possible. For the most part, ExciteBots is still good despite heavy wiimotion usage, most racing games that force you to use the wiimote have the player immediately facing a wall any time they so much as tilt left or right.

What I'm doing with it now is leaving it upstairs for my folks to use Netflix with it so they don't ask to use my precious PS3, which I can use for actual gaming (and Netflix if I really want to, but mostly gaming). Maybe I'll put BoomBlox upstairs for them to use, but it's mostly just a Netflix machine at this point.

It seemed like such a good idea until I got it, all these cool games with motion control, then you get it, and you find out that unless you're in a Wii bowling league at a nursing home and want more practice or want Netflix (a feature not available immediately when it came out), it's not a good system for gamers. For non-gamers though, Netflix is "point and click A", something my non-gaming folks like. That's probably why The WiiU isn't doing so well now, Wii's main audience was people who don't play games, and if half the games for the WiiU are almost the same, what's the point of getting another one if the Wii still works fine?
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GATSU



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:24 pm Reply with quote
Tony:
Quote:
But the sales numbers speak for themselves, and the Wii still sold a lot of systems.


It sold, because it's Nintendo, and because the games were continuations of popular Nintendo franchises. It was a helluva bait-and-switch, though. Like I said, I got my collection discounted, and I still feel ripped off.

zawa:
Quote:
(and I'm assuming you'd already know of Xenoblade and such).


I got a used cheaper copy, but I'm afraid to play it, because of how clunky and over-hyped everything else has been. Crying or Very sad

Quote:
Better on Gamecube


Yeah, that was their last good system.
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classicalzawa
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:43 pm Reply with quote
Well I've played a bit of Xenoblade, it doesn't use the motion controls, so that's a positive. The worst it could be is "good for a Wii game, above average for PS3 game", right?

I'm still big on Nintendo's handhelds though, they've always been good. Sure, both the DS and 3DS have tons of gimmicky garbage on them too, but not to the level the Wii did and a lot of the RPGs on it are really good too. I'm also a big fan of the 3DS shop where we're getting awesome time wasters like Pushmo. Either that or it's easier to use touch controls more intelligently than motion controls, how else are you supposed to do sudoku in Brain Age? writing it in makes sense!
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Mr Adventure



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PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 1:53 am Reply with quote
GATSU wrote:
Tony:
Quote:
But the sales numbers speak for themselves, and the Wii still sold a lot of systems.


It sold, because it's Nintendo, and because the games were continuations of popular Nintendo franchises.


Uhhhh that's not why the Wii sold gangbusters. Like, at all. Wii did the impossible and managed to break into the 'casual' market. Its motion controls were very popular with older folks, like parents. Who don't give two turds about 'Popular Nintendo franchises'.

And if you were right, the Wii U would be the hottest item in town. Its not (unfortunately).


The Wii is a solid system, with a solid line-up of exclusive titles. The motion controls work as advertised. and where pretty innovative (see, absolutely everyone else introducing some form of motion control latter). The games that really used the motion controls to their fullest were really great. Like Sin & Punishment. But most of the major titles didn't even require them. Like Smash Bros.

You're an obvious troll and I don't know why I'm engaging with you. But the failure of the Wii U is proof positive that you're flat out wrong about Nintendo relying on past franchises to sell units. It wasn't that at all.

EDIT: Also the Virtual Boy is a cool system if you appreciate its history and circumstances. There are some interesting games on there, and the technology was way ahead of its time (to far ahead actually, which is why it failed)

EDIT 2: And the Wii and Virtual Boy are absolutely nothing alike. Wii's graphics weren't all Red & Black, the Virtual Boy had no motion controls, and the Wii doesn't do stereoscopic 3D. So you're comparing cheese to chalk.
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GATSU



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PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 2:15 am Reply with quote
Mr. Adventure:
Quote:
And if you were right, the Wii U would be the hottest item in town. Its not (unfortunately).


That's because the games on the Wii U are just rehashes of popular franchises. There's a difference.

Quote:
The motion controls work as advertised.


Except when you're trying to target and lock things. Rolling Eyes

Quote:
There are some interesting games on there, and the technology was way ahead of its time (to far ahead actually, which is why it failed)


It failed, because the presentation looks worse than an 80s 3D Atari game.

Quote:
And the Wii and Virtual Boy are absolutely nothing alike.


They're both systems which rely more on gimmicks rather than quality or enjoyment. One's just more successful than the other.
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ikillchicken
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:36 am Reply with quote
Why was the Wii such a horrible system? Was it a horrible system? Yeah, kinda. But sorta not. I don't know. I think there were three big problems with it.

Problem #1: Motion controls were largely a disaster.

Motion control is a neat, novelty idea in general. But for actual sit down video games was always a terrible idea. It's just fundamentally wrong headed. Contrary to intuition, motion control is not more immersive than a simple button press. Simple buttons are clean, reliable, and make it very easy for the player to communicate their commands to the game with minimal effort. And that actually makes it was easier for the brain to tune out one's physical body and attach to the character you're controlling. Motion controls are really just a more complicated, less reliable system that actually inhibits that process. Plus, even if you did believe motion controls could be beneficial if done right, they never actually worked quite right with the Wii. Even with the Plus attachment, you never truly felt like you were fully controlling a sword or gun or whatever that you could move around as freely and rapidly as a real object in your hand. See, they just never really overcame the feedback problem. Even in games I moderately enjoyed like Red Steel 2, it was still a bit too easy for your sword to get stuck or miss a beat and suddenly you'd end up with your controller disconnected from where your sword was. Especially when you had to make rapid, frantic movements. And then everything just went to hell as you desperately tried to re-establish symmetry. The only way to really get it to work was to make sure you only made really controlled, clear movements. Which meant that you always felt like you were only using the stick you were holding to guide the sword around, rather than actually holding the sword yourself. I think too, it was also a development problem as much as a hardware problem. Or maybe it was a development problem because of hardware problems. I don't know. Point is, very few games ever actually did anything with the motion controls. They mostly just did waggle, shake the remote to attack bullshit which is the worst possible thing. It offers none of the actual hands on control (since it's just an arbitrary shake) but it's actually far less responsive and far more distracting and immersion breaking than a simple button press. It was a major step up when, later in the console's life, most games just started ignoring the motion or making it optional.

But...that said:

Say what you will, Wii Sports was fantastic. I mean, it's not really a "video game" in the traditional sense. And I don't say that to be dismissive. It's just...not. In terms of how you engage with it, its more like maybe...a Foosball table? Something like that? I don't know. But I really did enjoy the hell out of it. I got the Wii the Christmas it came out and frankly, there was a reason it was the "must have" item that year. Me and the family spent a ton of time playing it and we had a really great time. For whatever else the Wii was or wasn't it gave us a tremendously fun activity that we enjoyed a whole lot that year.


Problem #2: The massive lack of 3rd party support.

I mean, Nintendo's 3rd party support has been dwindling for ages. As far back as the N64, and even more so with the Gamecube. But, that said, the Gamecube still actually got a lot of good stuff. Resident Evil 4, Soul Calibur 2, Killer 7, Tales of Symphonia, Beyond Good & Evil. A pretty sizable chunk of the stuff I liked was actually 3rd party. Yeah, maybe some of the most graphically advanced stuff didn't make the cut. But they did pretty okay. The Wii on the other hand...It's just a wasteland. They completely painted themselves into a corner by just being so far behind their competition. You basically had to either develop a game exclusively for the Wii or not for it at all. There was just too much of a divide. And that meant, barring a couple exceptions (few of which were actually any good) you just didn't see 3rd party games for it. The trouble is too, that's just such a big part of gaming these days. I mean, look, PS3 and 360 have some great first party games. But they'd be super sparse too if not for 3rd party support. Third party games are about 80% of gaming these days. And the Wii just cut all that right out. It meant that, for whatever the Wii did right, it was never much of an option as a stand alone "only system you own" for anyone interested in accessing the vast majority of games out there.

But...That said:

Since the Wii was essentially miles behind the other systems, it was pretty damn cheap to buy. So that's something. No, I mean really. I'm not being facetious here. As I said, the Wii was never much of an option as the only system you own for most gamers. But given the price, it really wasn't a terrible buy as a secondary system in addition to something else. I got my PS3 and if I had to choose I'd take it in a heartbeat, but thinking back, I'm reasonably happy I got a Wii too. I mean, was a couple hundred bucks really so much to spend for what I got? Not really. As I said, I had a lot of fun with Wii Sports. And there were some real gems too even if they were few and far between. So yeah. Not a bad purchase when you look at it for what it was.


Problem #3: The 1st party support was pretty underwhelming too.

Now don't get me wrong. There are certainly some good first party games for the Wii. In fact, Xenoblade was one of the top games of the generation I think. And it was nice to see them bring back stuff like DKC and classic Kirby. But it was slim bloody pickings otherwise. I mean, we got two Super Mario games, but one was a very derivative sequel. More Mario Kart and Smash Bros, but there's little reason to not just play the previous versions. Only one Zelda (Twilight Princess is a GC port) which was actually pretty damn weak and really misses the mark in a lot of ways. Two Metroid games, but one mediocre and the other just god awful. One crappy Fire Emblem sequel which is the worst by far of any of them to date. Kirby's Epic Yawn: The game where you literally cannot lose. No Pikmin. No Starfox. No Luigi's Mansion. You know, as much as the system lacked 3rd party support, I actually think there may have been more 3rd party games that I enjoyed than the paltry 1st party offering.

But...that said:

No, I got nothing here. This is what ultimately leaves me feeling quite disappointed. I can forgive the motion controls, especially since they mostly got ditched entirely in most later games. I can forgive the lack of 3rd party support since I already got that on PS3. But I was really let down by the 1st party games on the Wii. It was a big disappointment.
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Emiru's hands



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 5:41 pm Reply with quote
I don't think the wii is such a horrible system. Yes the graphics are very bad, but that's because it's not meant to be a system with HD eye-popping graphics. It's meant for light cartoony stuff.
When I got it I thought it was a waste of space and money until I started using it correctly, that is, downloading super mario world and buying multiplayer games which I can play when my friends come over. Nothing keeps a bunch of 20 year olds more intertained than Kirby's epic yarn.
It may be just an old console but with a new face but they needed something to keep up with the new technology. Or something like that.
People need to keep in mind that it's a mainly a console for children hence the cheapness.
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LonelySoul 8515



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PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2014 1:46 am Reply with quote
I got the wii mostly because my gamecube broke down due to a idiot.

but I still play it for Fire emblem POR and RD, resident evil remake and etc.
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potatochobit



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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 4:46 pm Reply with quote
wow, GATSU, your opinions are terrible
I have to question if you even play games regularly

the gamecube? a good system? lmfao

if you bought a wii because you were expecting good graphics - ugh...

did you even watch the mariokart commercials?
at least play mario galaxy 2 before complaining it's a bad system

if you are playing on a LCD HD TV you absolutely need a component cable and there is also an option in the wii system menu that must be activated to use it
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ikillchicken
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 2:41 am Reply with quote
potatochobit wrote:
the gamecube? a good system? lmfao


GATSU may be wrong about a lot of stuff but I'll agree with him completely here. The Gamecube was an excellent system. So much stronger than the Wii. I'll take Pikmin, Mario Sunshine, Metroid Prime, Resident Evil 4 and Zelda Wind Waker over anything on the Wii. And there were plenty of other good secondary games too. Not to mention, that was probably the peak for Smash Bros and Mario Kart. Frankly, I can't imagine why somebody would defend the Wii while bashing the Gamecube.
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gsilver



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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 8:44 am Reply with quote
I mostly found the controls to be unusable.

I'm uncoordinated, so fine aiming with the remote was next to impossible. Even if I avoided actual games, menus still threw motion-only parts at me, of which keyboards were the most problematic.

I also had trouble with "waggle" where you had to shake the controller repeatedly.


It's telling that I never even bothered to beat Mario Galaxy until years later on Dolphin (despite buying the Wii version near launch) where I could assign the cursor to a thumb stick and waggle to a button press.
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potatochobit



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PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 8:31 pm Reply with quote
The gamecube sold 21 million consoles total.

there are only two nintendo consoles that sold worse than that.
the virtual boy and the wii-u.

just for discussions the N64 sold 32 million, thats like 33% more than a gamecube? Even the original XBOX sold more consoles than the gamecube.

the gamecube may have had a few good games and I bought 3 consoles myself, for family members, but there were also alot of bad games on it.

sadly, the dreamcast sold even less; that is my favorite system and I owned like 5 of them.
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ikillchicken
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 8:33 am Reply with quote
You continue to make absolutely zero sense to me potatochobit. You go on about how the Gamecube sold like shit and then promptly declare the Dreamcast your favorite system. I mean...what? The irrelevance of sales numbers to one's opinion of quality is evidently something you understand, so what are you even talking about here?
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