Forum - View topicNEWS: Makoto Shinkai Confirms He Is Currently Working on New Work
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Kougeru
 Posts: 5811 |
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yeah, it leaked out somewhere that he's announcing it this month or next month
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mdo7
 Posts: 8238 Location: Katy, Texas, USA |
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Well at least he's confirmed he's working on something. So that's something.
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Flared
 Posts: 117 Location: United Kingdom |
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I bet it's about two somewhat uninteresting characters far away from each other being brought together by supernatural circumstances and/or natural disaster, along with a few too many insert song sequences.
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merr
Posts: 515 |
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And one’s a boy, and the other’s a girl! |
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MagicPolly
 Posts: 1748 |
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Every time I see this copypasta it makes me feel like whoever wrote it never watched anything from before Your Name and didn't actually watch Suzume (which has a completely different style of soundtrack) |
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Flared
Posts: 117 Location: United Kingdom |
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I have watched Garden of Words, though I haven't seen Suzume because from reading the synopsis the overall plot and themes seem very similar to Your Name and Weathering With You, so I didn't fancy watching the same film for a third time. You say it has a different soundtrack, so did Shinkai finally cure himself of his addiction to insert songs and do actual plot progression? If so, well done to him. |
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EmeraldSaucer
 Posts: 960 |
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What is "actual plot progression", and why do you think it doesn't happen during insert songs just because you don't like them/the amount of them? |
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Flared
Posts: 117 Location: United Kingdom |
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Like using dialogue accompanied by the characters doing something towards the story rather than a glorified montage every half an hour where the characters just do random or mundane stuff of which very little gets the plot moving. I wouldn't mind if Shinkai did it once in his movies, but Shinkai seems obsessed with using them multiple times and it just gets repetitive. Feels a bit lazy to me, that's all. |
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EmeraldSaucer
Posts: 960 |
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Sounds like those "glorified montages" involve characters doing something towards the story actually (that, in fact, is the whole point of montages). Since I don't know what you qualify as characters doing "random" things in a movie or how that would even be possible unless there is just no story whatsoever, nor does it really make sense why "mundane" stuff would not also advance the story in a film All of that seems to me like disliking one component of a film and trying to backpile arbitrary reasons for disliking it beyond just not enjoying that particular aspect |
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Flared
Posts: 117 Location: United Kingdom |
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Feel like you want but it’s only one aspect I dislike about his films, with others including his boring characters and overlooking plot holes to make the viewer “feel things” instead. |
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EmeraldSaucer
Posts: 960 |
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Yes, movies typically want to make the viewer feel things, it's pretty important actually. Like having "mundane" scenes to establish characters and character dynamics, the stuff which a story is built out of, and which are pretty enjoyable to watch when you're not trying to CinemaSins a film Though I want to stress that it's hard to see why exactly you dislike these aspects of Shinkai's films (beyond the basics of not liking insert songs I guess), since you seem unable to articulate what about them is bad when pushed (as seen here by you just sidestepping the conversation entirely to complain about "plot holes") |
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Flared
Posts: 117 Location: United Kingdom |
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What I dislike about Makoto Shinkai films (dedicated to EmeraldSaucer) 1. His characters are boring and not memorable. Whilst you remember the overall plot and themes of his films, the characters have nothing about them that make you attached to them or stick in your mind. Very cookie-cutter and taken straight from the anime character parts bin. I know films don't have the same airtime as a TV series to build characters as much, but his are low effort even for movies. 2. Repeated use of insert song sequences. Once in a film is fine, but multiple feels a bit like padding to me. They don't really add to the plot either, with one in Your Name just being the two living their alternative lives in the dreams. That kind of thing doesn't give us anything else about the characters, their motivations or anything new happening in the story. 3. The infamous plot hole in Your Name that they try to cover up with the feeble excuse that you don't remember your dreams. Well, a lot of people do, and I think if you kept having the same dream every night for weeks you'd definitely start remembering details (especially one very important one). It also feels as though many fans just overlook this with just "Yeah, but the feels", and Shinkai pushes this too. 4. His films follow the same overall plot and character dynamic. I explained most of his films' main structure in my first post. All of them from Garden of Words to Suzume have this and it's getting to the point where you wonder if he only knows how to make one type of film because he got success with the formula with Your Name. |
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EmeraldSaucer
Posts: 960 |
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So besides being vague (what constitutes a character being "memorable"? What about the characters is "boring" to you? What about them is "cookie-cutter" and what anime are you using as examples that they are supposedly templated from?), this is just patently untrue given the popularity of his works demonstrating a clear resonance between these characters and many people
You do at least try to provide an example here, but your example demonstrates the whole problem with your approach: characters living out alternate life scenarios in dreams does advance the story because it advances our understanding of who these characters are as people, how they respond and how they try to acclimate to their double lives in "dream". This seems more like a matter of you being unable to identify character and story than them not being present in these sequences (and thus are unable to fully understand why they are there and so you default to believing them to be "padding") And you don't mention it directly here, but this also demonstrates an inability to grasp that mundanity can be meaningful, that a film can depict simple moments in life as a means of furthering plot and the audience's understanding of the characters and the situations they find themselves in. Just wanted to include that, since you've backed away from mentioning that (again) after the first time you brought it up
True, when one approaches storytelling not merely as a checklist of events that "make sense" people tend to enjoy and appreciate the emotional core of a movie. Sadly some people are unable to get over this hurdle and, as I mentioned, proceed to CinemaSins about stuff that actually doesn't matter
People have already told you that this is wrong (and I have to assume you're speaking about a completely different Garden of Words here) and speaks to a general lack of knowledge about Shinkai's body of work. Though that should be evident by your now trying to include Suzume in this, a film you have already stated you have not seen and know little to nothing about even in terms of basic detail. Remember children, reading a synopsis and trying to moan about "plot holes" is not a substitute for actually digging into and understanding fiction |
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MFrontier
Posts: 20109 |
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I'm looking forward to seeing what his new work is about and I wish him the best of luck with it.
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Lord Starfish
Posts: 185 |
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Suzume has no insert songs unless you want to count that part where they're in Souta's friend's car and he's cycling through songs he feels are appropriate to the given situation, and that's just... him listening to music while the other characters are talking. He also eventually gets called out for his attempts at mood-setting being distracting and annoying. Other than that, the only vocal songs are in the credits. Interestingly though, the soundtrack album has two extra vocal songs that don't play in the movie at all, indicating that maybe they planned to have more songs at some point, but ended up scrapping them.
It's also a movie where famously, Shinkai didn't want to do a love story and so he opted to downplay it as much as possible by turning the love interest into a mundane object that can somehow talk and walk, by so doing making most of the interactions between the leads just come off as silly rather than romantic. I mean... There still ultimately is a love story, it's just clear that that's not where Shinkai's heart lay. As evidenced by the fact that the big emotional climax of the film... just has the love interest standing on the sidelines doing nothing. (To be clear, I mean spoiler[Suzume talking to her younger self in the Ever After, after the big action set piece to save Souta and close the gate. Obviously Souta is hugely important in that action set piece, but Suzume's meeting with her childhood self sidelines him completely.]) I'm not sure I would really count myself as a fan of Shinkai either, being that prior to Your Name I had found all his movies to be very pretty but also really uninteresting story- and character-wise, and I also did not like Weathering With You... But since Your Name he's been two for three on movies I genuinely loved, which has me at least willing to give his next work a shot. |
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