Forum - View topicEP. REVIEW: Fate/strange Fake
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An Unchosen One
 Posts: 201 |
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I have no idea where the writer got the idea that "faith" is what matters against Dead Apostles, because that's not what's said. Not to mention the Tsukihime remake having a new scene indirectly mocking the idea that the church's weapons and abilities are powered by it.
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TJ_Kat
Posts: 873 Location: Saskatoon, Canada |
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I think you mean rapport. A repertoire would be all the skills the two of them have available to them. A rapport is how well they get along and understand one another. |
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<('_')^
Posts: 181 |
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As someone who has read The Epic of Gilgamesh I'm a little disappointed in Enkidu's depiction here. His intimidating, beast-like appearance in the myth was a critical part of the story and helped with his contrast from Gilgamesh, who was ugly on the inside. And what's with him being non-bianary here? The myth explicitly depicts Enkidu as a wild man. Not sure where they got the idea to make him so eloquent. (The guy used a half-eaten cow leg to smack a goddess for crying out loud!) I know anime tends to take a lot of liberty with inspirations, but the creative choices here don't seem very meaningful. Imagine how fun this franchise could be if it toned down the anime tropes and made use of the unique sources that inspired it. On another note, they missed the perfect opportunity to have Gilgamesh get his own hands dirty in an old-fashioned slugfest with Enkidu. Would have perfectly captured their bromance and highlighted Enkidu as someone equal to Gilgamesh.
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Errinundra
Moderator
 Posts: 6692 Location: Melbourne, Oz |
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^
As one of the characters in Fate/Apocrypha observes about the Grail Wars - "Anything goes!" |
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The Scream Man
 Posts: 309 Location: Sydney, Australia |
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I actually didn't know that the Tsukihime didn't have Grail Wars because of the DA disrupting the Magic balance in their world. I THOUGHT their were still some in the Fate world, but I may be remembering it wrong.
I know SF is its own timeline that BROADLY follows what happens in Zero/FSN so it will be interesting to see if they have any hints back to those times. |
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EmeraldSaucer
 Posts: 921 |
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There are Dead Apostles in Fate worlds (Roa being the primary example before Edmond Dantes kills him), but they are few in number and don't have the same power as they do in Tsukihime worlds
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The Scream Man
Posts: 309 Location: Sydney, Australia |
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Oh I knew they were still AROUND, I just didn't know that the relationship between the strength of Magic and Dead Apostles. I just assumed that the more magic in the FATE worlds had resulted in Mages killed DA more easily and lessening the numbers of the race.
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maximilianjenus
Posts: 3109 |
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Yes. But now I am wondering if it will only be obvious for the ones who read the novel, as the anime might have skipped that detail (spoiler for one connection between zero and sf) spoiler[in the ln it is stated that the soldiers used maya for breeding purposes, in sf we are introduced to her son] |
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<('_')^
Posts: 181 |
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That's not exactly what I'd call good writing... What strikes me as the weirdest part in all this is that the creators of the franchise actually seem to have done some research. Imagine going through hundreds of cool myths, unique folk tales, and exciting historical periods, and then being like Nah, I'll just throw together some anime rubbish and call it a day. As I've heard many times, anime is at its best when it doesn't actively try to be "anime". |
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An Unchosen One
Posts: 201 |
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I'm pretty sure the reviewer has it backwards; from what I remember, it's not that they're having an effect on any kind of balance, but rather that human order is much weaker, resulting in the Counter Force (a phenomenon that utilizes Heroic Spirits against threats to humanity) either not working or being less effective, allowing beings like Dead Apostles and even Dead Apostle Ancestors to be more common. It's been a long time since I dug deep into Tsukihime lore, though, so I could be off. I think the last time I actively looked into anything was a little after Nasu casually retconned it and Fate/ into separate timelines. |
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John the Dark Lord
Posts: 316 |
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Both of these questions have the same answer: The Fate franchise interprets the part of the myth that states the gods made Enkidu out of clay literally. This version of Enkidu is a living clump of clay that can take whatever form they wish. Their current form is modeled after the divine harlot Shamhat, who educated them when they were just a mindless beast, but they did look monstrous when they first came to existence. As for the non-binary part, I won't say it's wrong, but it doesn't mean the same thing here as it does for a normal person. Since Enkidu is a living clay doll, they don't have a biological gender. It's possible they could become either gender with their shapeshifting ability, but they usually don't bother. |
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<('_')^
Posts: 181 |
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There are many creation stories where humans are said to have been made from clay/earth. That doesn't make them genderless. Does being made from wood mean Pinocchio is genderless? I don't take issue with having non-bianary characters & shape shifters in the story. There are plenty of mythical figures that fit that category. Enkidu just isn't one of them. The original writing and art used for The Epic of Gilgamesh clearly established Enkidu as masculine character. While some versions of the story interpret Enkidu's assimilation into human society, as a physical transformation with him looking more and more human, its always clear that this change is a bad thing, with Enkidu eventually losing his power & dying because of it.The Enkidu we see in FSF feels more like some angelic being from Christianity rather than the beast-man created to crush Gilgamesh in the Epic. My impression of this creative choice is that the franchise creators just wanted another pretty character. There just doesn't seem to be much depth beyond that. Which is a shame cause they handled Jack the Ripper well as far as reinterpretations go.
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Key
Moderator
 Posts: 19136 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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In addition to what John the Dark Lod said about this, keep in mind that this is a franchise which has King Arthur, Mordred, and Jack the Ripper (in another branch) be female and Alexandar the Great be a hulking brute (he was never classically depicted or described as a big man). In general, creatively reinterpreting legends is par for the course both for this franchise and for anime in general. |
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<('_')^
Posts: 181 |
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Not too familiar with Fate outside of the Anime adaptations, but wasn't the irl sources addressed for Artoria and Alexander? I don't mind deviations so long as they are acknowledged and written well. I would say Jack the Ripper was handled well. Although Jack the Ripper was probably some ordinary human irl, in FSF they made the point of heroic spirits being manifestations of the legends themselves rather than simple resurrections of historical figures. Alexander the Great's legacy and accomplishments led to most people imagining him as a big strong man. Gilgamesh is the most powerful Heroic spirit because he managed to overcome his mortality by creating a legacy that lived on as The Epic of Gilgamesh, which is the oldest written story in human history. Just like that, Jack the Ripper's depiction here properly reflects the mystery of a killer that was seemingly omnipresent. Enkidu's depiction on the other hand seems rather shallow and doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I really hope the latter episodes address this.
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LastPage 3
Posts: 291 |
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The same thing happens in Fate though.
They're trying to empathize his connection to nature without having him look like the typical wild man archetype, most likely as a way to contrast with the more typically masculine leaning Gilgamesh. |
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