Forum - View topicForum Tournaments: Voting Closed.
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Kouga13
 Posts: 113 Location: Canada |
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Going to have to follow Earth_Wyrm's example.
Switching my previous picks of: #1 Most Improved #2 Best Supporting To: #1 Best Supporting #2 Most Improved |
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abunai
Old Regular
 Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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*sigh* Strategic vote changing, eh? This is why they don't allow that in real elections.
Both the two front-runners are fine topics for a tournament, but I confess that I am more personally interested in Best Supporting, since that has a good chance of being most fun, for the same reason that we all prefer Ledger's Joker to Bale's Batman. Supporting characters, liberated of the need to carry the storyline as protagonists, can become far more interesting and flexible. Shoot, I'll jump on the bandwagon with a strategic vote change: I hereby change my vote from: 1. Best Supporting 2. Best Hero/Heroine to 1. Best Supporting. 2. Most Flawed. - abunai "But Moooom! All the other kids were doing it!" "If the other kids jumped off a bridge --" |
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mow123
 Posts: 339 |
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Recently, several people have changed their votes in favor of the Best Supporting Character tournament, resulting in a near tie between the top two ideas. Here are my current counts:
Biggest Badass: 30 Most Improved: 22 Best Hero/Heroine: 37 Most Troubled/Flawed: 10 Best Supporting: 36 Personally either of the top two ideas seem very viable. However, I would have to agree with a previous poster that said the criteria for the Best Supporting tournament remains vague. The criteria behind what makes one supporting character better than another still seems very iffy. What would constitute a borderline entry versus a seed? Are we mainly using quality? Or are we using ability to steal the focus from the lead, such as marie-antoinette suggested? While clearly better, in my opinion, than the 3rd most popular idea, the lack of solid criteria is by far the tournament's greatest weakness. Additionally, I believe this tournament would spark less discussion and shorter reasons to justify votes. Unfortunately, popularity may be considered a criteria since there is no concrete criteria established. Even after reading both Skylark's and Key's description of the tournament, I remain unconvinced that a solid criteria exists for this tournament. Here are their arguments for reference:
While I agree supporting characters deserve attention, very little what I would classify as criteria is given; I bet it would be difficult to measure one character's ability to stand out against another. How do we weigh value of two minor characters against each other? I can see an argument based on pure quality and how important these character are to the story-- but even then the criteria seems largely undefined compared to previous tournaments. Here's Key's description of the tournament:
Yet again, no solid criteria can be found even in Key's description of this tournament. How would you measure one character ability to shine as a minor character to another? Are we basing this on pure quality of the character like I suggested earlier? If we are, sadly, this will be dictated by how likable the character is which sadly is influenced by the character's popularity. By likability, I also would include characters that we love to hate; Taniguchi from the MoHS would be good supporting character example of this. Best Supporting actor works in real life because the actors are measured based on their acting ability unfortunately, this makes it hard for this award to transfer over to the anime medium. I would love to hear from any supporters of this tournament a detailed list of criteria that could be used for this tournament; I would hate to have a popularity contest for minor characters. I do admit that this idea would be a tad more light hearted, less cerebral and less prone to generate discussion than Best Hero/Heroine, but quite frankly the discussion and the logical thinking process is what makes these tournaments for me. If we had a tournament that didn't promote a lot of discussion, that would be a big minus for me. I love a good debate as long as everyone remains civil; I know that at least Livu-, Sophisticat, JesuOtaku, Olliff, and a few others would agree with me on that. 
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abunai
Old Regular
Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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That's nonsense. When you are judging a Best Supporting Actor, you evaluate the way he interprets the character -- an evaluation that necessarily involves the nature of the character. Similarly, evaluating an anime character involves a complex of voice acting, character design, scripting/storyboarding and animation. It's a package deal. If you insist on this comparison, it will affect the other tournaments quite as much as Best Supporting. Your comparison, therefore, is invalid. - abunai |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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You know, its disappointing that the tournament has turned vicious before it has even begun. That's just not right.
What am I supposed to do? Change my vote to favour the one I want to win, but further increase the bitterness, or, not change my vote, keep my principles, and watch as my favourite choice gets pipped at the post? ...... ...... ...... Vote Change: Secondary pick changed from "Best Supporting Character" to "Most Flawed Character". ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The current tallies I have are as follows: Biggest Badass: 30 Most Improved: 22 Best Hero/Heroine: 37 Most Flawed/Troubled: 12 Best Supporting Character: 35 Option Vote (now discontinued): 18 Ayes, 13 Nays, 15 abstains Edit: Ah, mow123 got here first. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- One last thing; to all those who have made vote changes, don't forget to back and edit your original vote to reflect that change. That's how it is done in the actual tournament after all. While skimming back to edit my post I noticed that several people hadn't edited their own posts, meaning that technically their vote change hasn't come into effect yet. I mean, yes I have taken all changes into account with the above vote tallies, however my figures are not the "official" ones. Key may not be so lenient as I; depends on his view about strategic vote changes, I guess. For example Kouga13 and Earth_Wyrm, I know for a fact that neither of you edited your original votes. You should do so as soon as possible. |
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mow123
Posts: 339 |
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Valid point, Abunai. However, I doubt that many people would use the solid criteria you presented. Unfortunately, a lot of the above criteria you give can only be evaluated by watching the show in question -- unlike most other criteria words can not do it justice. For example, you can describe a character's moral character and selflessness fairly easily, but it may be harder to describe the VA ability/scripting, and animation to someone who has not seen the show. Of all the criteria listed, character design would be the only one that would be fairly easy to describe with words to someone who hasn't seen the show. I admit; it is still possible to attempt to do so. Thank you for your input; you made an excellent point. If this idea wins, I would like Key to add Abunai's criteria to the tournament's description. @dtm42 I do not believe that there is anything vicious about changing votes strategically as long as everyone does it in a civil manner. There's a difference between competitiveness and viciousness, you know?  Competition is fun as long as people remain calm, polite and sportsmanlike about it.
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Dorcas_Aurelia
 Posts: 5344 Location: Philly |
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That just shows that people care. *nervous laughter* Three days from now we'll probably be into the character nomination period, so it should get back to the fun part then. I'm not particularly enthusiastic about a Supporting Character Tournament, but I'll still host the minigame for whatever we pick (prizes included). |
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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I would like to vote for Biggest Badass tournament for the first choice. I've been wanting to see this tournament go for quite a while, because I know that there will be some interesting characters come up in this one. My second choice is Best Supporting Character. I think that the characters within this one would have it two ways, if they're good, they might be moving based on merit or other traits that allow them to do their roles. The other side could be deviously evil.
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Olliff
 Posts: 550 |
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It appears that the vote is still very close. I did an analysis of the votes, and here are what the votes would be if all votes were unweighted:
Biggest Badass: 17 Most Improved: 13 Best Hero/Heroine: 29 Most Flawed/Troubled: 9 Best Supporting Character: 27 More or less, this tally is fairly similar to the actual tally with one exception, the Biggest Badass tournament, which has substantially less support when counted this way. I do realize that the votes will be weighted for this vote, but I believe this analysis reveals an important fact, the raw support for each tournament. Personally, I am content with either of the top two choices even though I believe that the Best Hero/Heroine would provoke more interesting discussion. However, like many others have posted, I would be disappointed if the Biggest Badass tournament is picked. Not only would it be prone to fanboy/fangirlsm; it would cover a genre that holds little interest for me. Additionally, as you can see by my analysis this is the only choice that has substantially less unweighted votes than it does have votes under the weighted system. Due to this, this tournament may suffer from poor turnout. Ultimately, who you vote for is your own choice, but please try to keep this in mind before you make your vote. |
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rainbowcourage
 Posts: 1216 Location: what is commonly known as "hell week" |
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Because Best Hero/Heroine is going to have so much less fanboy/girlism. 
While we're all stating how we feel about stuff, I think a Best Hero/Heroine contest would be boring as crap. Inevitably the more altruistic characters do better, and then it becomes a Contest of Purity.
Well that's a double-edged sword. I'm pretty sure I won't be participating in the next tournament if Best Hero/Heroine wins. Also, I happen to think that a catchy title like "Biggest Badass" might attract new user traffic, but maybe I'm loca... *on a side note, I think I came in fourth in the Best Duos Tournament as well, which is actually perfect. I came as close to the top as I could in both tournaments without actually winning prizes, prizes which I would not be able to receive. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Why so? Because of your real-world location? |
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zawa113
 Posts: 7393 |
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I've edited my post back on page 9 to a vote change too, first I dropped my #1 and #2 choices to make them even and thus both worth 1 point, and then switched my hero/ine vote to most flawed. my edited post looks like this (so you don't have to go back and hunt):
*edit, sorry, i edited my edit and this and ugh, keep changing my mind! so yeah, ima just leave it at this, since i'm sure voting for category is almost over. |
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Key
Moderator
 Posts: 19136 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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This may sound callous, but frankly I'm not all that concerned anymore about chasing people away with the tournament topic. It sounds like we're going to lose at least a couple of people anyway we do it, so what happens, happens.
Remember, cut-off for voting is the end of the month, so we're talking 11:59 p.m. forum time on Saturday. It's possible I may not be home then, so any vote after that point won't be counted regardless of whether or not I get the voting promptly closed. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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We are probably going to lose more than that. In the previous tournament we almost never got twenty-five people, except at the beginning and towards the end. At the moment forty-seven people have voted. Which means that our median turnout will be just half of that. So though we all know that people are invariably going to drop out, we should be prepared for a bigger drop than "at least a couple". |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar  Posts: 16983 |
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This is hardly vicious. Really. No one is really arguing or shouting attacks at people now are they? So no need to pour salt on wounds that aren't even there yet. And as for losing voters...that simply happens regardless. it's called the real world and life. Even those that want to participate may not be able to regardless of topic. Hopefully plenty will find time regardless of which tournament we have. I will say though that I find the strategic vote changing very hypocritical from some people. The ones who ones who saw fit to complain about vote petitioning during the actual tournament for example. That's wrong and unsportsmanlike but "strategic vote changing" like this is ok? Just saying. |
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