Forum - View topicsomething i just wanna say concerning anime on tv
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Fatal
Posts: 33 |
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first off, i need to say that im a very strong follower of anime on tv. anyway, one of the things i absolutly hate is the use of the word "butchered". by "butchered", it means the story is altered, character names are changed, and original music is removed. a perfect example of a butchered anime on tv is Cardcaptors, Escaflowne and Yu-Gi-Oh!.
when i was reading the new Ms. Anserman column about Kenshin, i was appalled at the description that Kenshin is "butchered". i do agree that the Kyoto Arc is heavily edited, but in no way "butchered", yes, there IS a DIFFERENCE between "heavily edited" and "butchered" (i described butchered up in the first paragraph, and "heavily edited" simply means lots of edits). anyhow, as i said, Kenshin is in NO WAY butchered. the story is still there, Okubo still dies, the oniwaban group still dies, every integral part of the story is intact. the edit lists are kind of deceiving, it gives the impression that they cut out all the important part of the story, its one of those tihngs that you actually have to watch. well anyway, i just wanted to get that off my chest. |
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Annie-Mei
 Posts: 8 |
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I have to disagree with your assessment of "butchered:
Butchered - to mame, or alter so that it is no longer a resemblance of the original. If they change even the names of characters / its butchered. If they edit out too many scenes / its butchered. If they change the story / its butchered. Might as well at that point, just buy the DVD versions. Im all for anime on tv, as long as they dont butcher it. |
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Emerje
 Posts: 7548 Location: Maine |
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Your definition and you're examples don't really go together. The key phrase there is "no longer a resemblance of the original".
Best examples by your definition of true butchering would be Cardcaptors (couldn't even keep the name the same) where they change the character names and the story to apeal more to boys and totally skipped the first few episodes, And Dragonball Z's first run where they totally change everything, people don't die, heaven doesn't exist and HELL is rewriten as HFIL. Emerje |
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dannavy85
 Posts: 114 |
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I think we've come a little bit towards destroying the censor hugging influences of Action for Children's Television from the late 1970's and 80's american cartoon slaughter. The rise of Cable TV has helped to end such meddling into the rights of animators but there's still a long way to go before American animation is once again free to decide its own course.
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jmays
ANN Past Staff
 Posts: 1390 Location: St. Louis, MO |
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Yep. Progress and more progress... Personally, I'm not "outraged" or "appalled" when something is changed (very slightly) for TV. Typically, the option is edit or don't show it. Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I trust the guys at Williams Street to push the envelope when they can; I guess this wasn't the time to do it. But the ax is used with more reluctance now, and that's certainly progress. As long as it keeps in that direction (regarding TV), I'm satisfied. |
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Case
Posts: 1016 |
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Hear hear.
It's true that the definition of that word is completely subjective in this case. However... That's just pessimistic. Cartoon Network alone gives you some 100 hours of anime a month - which would probably cost you $1000-some if you relied solely on DVDs (and that'd be getting it at GOOD prices) - and all it costs is the petty $50, or whatever it is your cable or satellite subscription costs you. And what are you doing for your part? Squawking about the things they AREN'T giving you. Honestly. I'm as demanding as the next guy here, but I don't think I'd make it through life alive if I didn't sit back and appreciate the things I *have* from time to time. I can understand complaining a little bit, but can't you appreciate their efforts at least enough to not call every imperfection in their work "butchering"? 
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Tomoyo714
 Posts: 73 Location: NY State |
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I am happy as long as they keep the plot in tact enough for me to follow, as they generally do on Cartoon Network.
I watch anime on tv not expecting to see the whole thing...I expect edits and as long as they aren't appalling like Cardcaptors was...I can live with it. I view most anime on tv as a way for me to preview a show for free anyway so I can decide if I want to sink the money into it. I am now buying Rurouni Kenshin, which without the edited version to at least preview I never would have chanced purchased because of its lenght. I do hope as time goes on we can see less and less edits, but I do see us moving very slowly in that direction and that pleases me. On a side note if we are talking about things that annoy us... I am getting sick and tired of people bashing English voice actors. I don't believe that the industry as a whole is as poor as many posters are making it out be. Yes there are bad ones... but there are bad Japanese va's also. I happen to like quiet a few english va's. I love the dub of Cowboy Bebop and Fruits Basket. In fact I watch most of my anime dubbed with the expection of Cardcaptor Sakura (for obvious reasons) and Inu-Yahsa....(That is one voice cast I don't like very much) But credit where credit is due...these english speaking men and women are making big steps in what is in a way almost a new industry. Just a few years ago you weren't seeing the huge call for the quality that one is now and these hard working people are trying to give it to us. 
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Fatal
Posts: 33 |
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youre conflicting yourself. key word is no longer a resemblance of the original. as i said, every integral part of the story is intact. if you honestly think kenshin is "not recognizable", then maybe you shouold watch again. hell, im just happy, we are getting this version rather than the Butchered (by my definition and yours) version by Sony. also, i need to say that i have close to 355 anime dvd's. one reason to that is due to the fact that anime on tv |
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Ataru
 Posts: 2350 Location: Missouri (Strikeman) |
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That brings up a good point, Fatal. As the years goes by for CN, it has "lossen" it's censorship belt, mostly with the introduction of Adult Swim. But that also means that, "Hey, it they show just enough, does that mean I have to go out and buy a $20 DVD if they only 2 or 3 things are different." I think about that each time I watch Inu Yasha or Lupin, "Well there be that big of a change on the DVD?" Sure, when can hope online and read summaries or look at the edit list to see what was token out or edited out, but will it be enough to justiy buy the DVD? Heck, at one point I was thinking about buy Betterman until I saw it on TechTV, but becasue nothing has been change, only a couple snips here and there for ad time, I felt no need to buy, but to record it.
A couple months back, I talk to an old anime fan buddy of mine and he also said, that outside of Toonami, in some cases, he felt that no need to was money one buying the DVD, when he can just record it on TiVo and spend maybe, half as much as he on buying the set. So, lately I keep a close eye on what is upcoming on TV anime wise. Like GateKeepers 21, I was thinking of buying, but I'm not sure now. It depends how much was cut for ad time and if I like the dubbing. If I don't, I'm getting it. (Why do I feel like I should be on talk radio. )
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Rebecca
 Posts: 57 |
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No, they haven't changed the story or plot around to the point that it's no longer recognizable. No, the voice acting isn't that bad (even if I nearly turned off the TV when one of the characters spoke with a heavy southern accent).
My problem IS with some of the edits. First off, Saitou and Sano are two of the best characters in the series because they are the 'bad asses'. You've got characters such as Kaoru teaching a style of fighting that focuses on protecting the weak and fighting without killing, Yahiko training under her, and Kenshin refusing to kill. Saitou and Sano are supposed to balance this out, but they can't do this on actions alone. A lot of what made these characters fun and dynamic was the way they talked. The edits have made these two characters static by taking out the language (meaning their harder or 'fighting' style of speech) that made them controversial in that setting. Then we move to the visual edits. Maybe it's just me, but I don't believe in saying 'well, at least it's better then it USED to be' as if that somehow makes up for the edits. The revolution at the end of the Tokugawa era was a violent and tense time in Japanese history. The restoration was no less of a volatile time since there were a lot of changes going on. The blood and violence is in the anime to emphasize this. You can say that this is obvious and that they didn't need to include this in a lot of the episodes, but those behind making and producing Rurouni Kenshin included it for a reason. Taking it out is insulting to those who obviously felt there was a need for it to be there in the first place. Overall I think that some of the elements that made the show stand out have been lost. I'd use the word butchered for any show that's been edited down into a 'nicer' form of itself and removes interesting and dynamic elements from the show. |
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Hellomojo
 Posts: 225 Location: Orlando, Fl. |
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now that we're talking about edits, I wouldn't have minded if tech tv changed Leibias
 name in Silent Mobius. But it was funny the first time i heard it.
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Tenchi
 Posts: 4663 Location: Ottawa... now I'm an ex-Anglo Montrealer. |
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Hmm... a thread about editing anime on TV in the ANN forum that has been up for at least a day... yet, I can't help but feel something's missing...
I need my dose of cut n' pasted conspiracy theories involving Jamie Kellner, dammit! Jamie Kellner, the man so cool that he is the only private American citizen able to pass and implement his own laws, apparently, as well as making large contributions to the campaigns of evil Republicans, because we all know that TV executives just love having the government regulate them more. 
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posah-tai-vo
Posts: 9 Location: The playground of my mind.... |
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All I know is that I would rather watch butchered anime any day of the week, than watch endless reruns of Scooby Doo. You take what you can get!
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Toubib
 Posts: 55 Location: Tampa, FL |
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What we need is a HBO/Showtime-level station that shows anime. I don't know much about the Anime Channel, since we don't have it down here in Florida, but the only way I can see not having edits in anime is to have a premium channel that has an anime block, or a more inclusive premium anime channel(since I think the Anime Channel only plays ADV stuff).
But I think that will still be a few years away. First Anime Channel has to get a wider distrobustion to help show that anime can support a channel all it's own, then someone will get the bright idea that to make more money from it, they'll charge to have the channel. Then we the fan/consumer will say if you want us to pay for it we want more adult content. |
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umop_apisdn
Posts: 10 |
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I don't believe the Anime Channel edits, but I don't have the channel to check. However, through Comcast Digital, we get the Anime Channel in the Comcast On-Demand program, and I know that they carry Colorful, to say the least. I've also watched RahXephon, Evangelion, and Samurai X, and it didn't seem edited.
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