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[OT] Regarding all these locked posts


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Tony K.
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Joined: 18 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 4:10 pm Reply with quote
Regarding TcDohl's thread. I locked it because of the obvious friction developing between steventheeunuch and Animefreak6969. Talking to both of them, I know it's fruitless to warn either of them because they never listen. Aside from deleting their posts, I have no real powers like banning and such, and thought it to be more conclusive in just locking the entire thread, rather than have it go into a flame war between those two and any others that would tag along. Sorry.

But it seems this kind of topic (reading posts/reading rules/how the moderating policy works) is pretty popular and got yet another incarnation anyway, so there you go.
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dormcat
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 4:27 pm Reply with quote
TcDohl wrote:
Actually, my last thread was locked as well, and I was not given a clear explanation of why. That thread was actually pretty intelligent and universal, and it was about whether or not people actually read posts.

Next time you'll ask something like "[OT] How much time do you spend on Internet forums a week?" "[OT] How do you choose your favorite search engine?" "[OT] What is the browser you are using and why?" And so on. All can have nice intelligent discussions, yet none of them has a place on ANN, for ANN is a website dedicated to anime and anime-related creations, merchandise, and culture.

If you are doing an anime-related report and need opinions from other users, it's courteous to notify admins and/or mods beforehand and awaits their approval. Other forms of Internet surveys are discouraged; ANN is not a place for Internet culture studies.
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PantsGoblin
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 4:43 pm Reply with quote
dormcat wrote:
TcDohl wrote:
Actually, my last thread was locked as well, and I was not given a clear explanation of why. That thread was actually pretty intelligent and universal, and it was about whether or not people actually read posts.

Next time you'll ask something like "[OT] How much time do you spend on Internet forums a week?"

If you are doing an anime-related report and need opinions from other users, it's courteous to notify admins and/or mods beforehand. Other forms of Internet surveys are discouraged; ANN is not a place for Internet culture studies.


>_> Well, I thought the topic was legimate. It was refering to this site, so it wasn't completely off-topic. I honestly don't think he was doing a report either, he was just curious. I remember Zac chewing out somebody who openly admited to not reading posts a few days ago, so it was on my mind also... That thread was actually the main one I was refering to in the end of this post.

Also, about the people who don't read the rules... Imo, lurking and understanding how the forum works and people act is just as important as the rules. From my experience, it usually helps more. I lurked here for quite a while before actually posting, helps a lot.
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dormcat
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 5:12 pm Reply with quote
PantsGoblin wrote:
Also, about the people who don't read the rules... Imo, lurking and understanding how the forum works and people act is just as important as the rules. From my experience, it usually helps more. I lurked here for quite a while before actually posting, helps a lot.

phpBB lacks features forcing new users to learn. Another forum software named Discuz! has an extensive hierarchy of user privileges, as well as recommendation systems. In order to gain more privilege, an user has to visit the forum frequently and post as many "good" posts (judged by length and peer review / recommendation) to climb up the ladder. The detailed hierarchies are different from site to site, but here's an example:

0 - Banned user. Can't even log in.
1 - Newly registered user. Can only read posts.
2 - Fresh user. Can reply and search titles.
3 - Intermediate user. Can search full texts, start new thread, and use system default avatars.
4 - Veteran user. Can use small custom avatars.
5 - Elite user. Can start polls, use medium-sized avatars, signatures, and attach a small file to posts.
6 - Super user. Can attach medium files to a post and include pictures in signatures.
7 - Single-board mod. Can lock threads in specific board(s) and attach large files to posts.
8 - Group mod. Can delete and modify posts in all boards, and demote and/or temp ban users.
9 - Admin. Can perm ban and/or remove user accounts and nominate mods.
10 - Ultra admin / founder. Can do just about everything.

I'm not saying this hierarchical system is good (it can be easily cracked by setting up multiple accounts and recommend each other, just like rating system in most online auction sites), but I always prefer systems forcing new user to lurk and observe for at least 24-72 hours.
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creativename



Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 14
PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 5:51 pm Reply with quote
dormcat wrote:
0 - Banned user. Can't even log in.
1 - Newly registered user. Can only read posts.
2 - Fresh user. Can reply and search titles.
3 - Intermediate user. Can search full texts, start new thread, and use system default avatars.
4 - Veteran user. Can use small custom avatars.
5 - Elite user. Can start polls, use medium-sized avatars, signatures, and attach a small file to posts.
6 - Super user. Can attach medium files to a post and include pictures in signatures.
7 - Single-board mod. Can lock threads in specific board(s) and attach large files to posts.
8 - Group mod. Can delete and modify posts in all boards, and demote and/or temp ban users.
9 - Admin. Can perm ban and/or remove user accounts and nominate mods.
10 - Ultra admin / founder. Can do just about everything.

Sites that strict are a real turn off. This isn't the military, it's a discussion board. Those sites are just set up for elitism.

The lurking method usually doesn't work either. People will lurk or they won't, they will not be forced to. They will just wait out the period.
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blind_assassin



Joined: 07 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 11, 2006 7:50 pm Reply with quote
Priveleges and ranking are nice but creativename is right, they just breed elitism (like GameFAQs, the site I love to hate) and make people who have been on the site a long time try and sculpt everyone else into their image and ruin it for lots of people. People that are going to be productive are usually pretty easy to spot within their first 10 posts and the same goes for major trouble makers. Everyone else is pretty much just wait and see.
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PantsGoblin
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 5:45 am Reply with quote
blind_assassin wrote:
Priveleges and ranking are nice but creativename is right, they just breed elitism (like GameFAQs, the site I love to hate) .


Ya, they do breed elitism, but that wasn't the point. As much as I dislike Gamefaqs (just the forums, their faqs are invaluble), they do have an system that works pretty well at keeping out trolls and eases users into the environment. Something that we don't have here. But, this is a smaller forum, that kind of stuff isn't nearly as large of a problem here. If we got bigger, it may be a good idea. The larger the forum, generally the more security is needed... or we could just ignore everything and end up like Gaia...

creativename wrote:
The lurking method usually doesn't work either. People will lurk or they won't, they will not be forced to. They will just wait out the period.


That was a suggestion, I wasn't saying it should be some kind of rule...
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The Frankman



Joined: 19 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 5:50 am Reply with quote
creativename wrote:
Sites that strict are a real turn off. This isn't the military, it's a discussion board. Those sites are just set up for elitism . . .

Interesting you should say that. At some time or another I've seen posters who have said something similar to that sentiment about these forums.
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marie-antoinette



Joined: 18 Sep 2005
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Location: Ottawa, Canada
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 7:07 am Reply with quote
I've always found this forum to be one of the best when it comes to rules and have in fact based rules on a forum I am moderator of off some aspects of how things are done here.

I'll admit that I don't think I actually read the rules post, but you honestly don't have to in order to get an idea of the rules. I figured them all out by watching what other people did, especially when it comes to locked threads. Paying attention is a good way to keep out of trouble.
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blind_assassin



Joined: 07 Aug 2006
Posts: 755
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 3:21 pm Reply with quote
PantsGoblin wrote:
Ya, they do breed elitism, but that wasn't the point. As much as I dislike Gamefaqs (just the forums, their faqs are invaluble), they do have an system that works pretty well at keeping out trolls and eases users into the environment. Something that we don't have here.

I find that GameFAQs set-up is more likely to have legitimate members seem like moronic trolls because of how it starts off. Limiting posts and topic creation is sort of effective but it isn't hard for it to wind up making it very difficult to get lots of help (or help others) right off the bat since every post has to be up for 24 hours before they stop counting for the limit.

Another thing is the search feature. You get it after being a member of the site for like a week but thats the sort of thing that should be available faster than that. More than half of that sites topics are duplicates or triplicates (I've actually seen 9 copies of essentially the same topic at once) and that would at least be partially relieved if it were possible for someone to join up and be able to actually use it instead of either risking a faux pas or slogging through 400 topics to make sure he won't add to the overabundant spam.
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dr. worm



Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 8:46 pm Reply with quote
Call me dense if you will, but I actually clicked on this thread hoping to see why this other thread was locked.

I checked the rules twice, but outside of some random suggestions that the poster might want to use the information for creating bootlegs, there is no rule that this thread comes close to violating.

There is some explanatory text at the bottom, but it is asking for the motive of the original poster. Now I admit that I am a newbie here, but as I understand it, it is hard enough to establish motive in meatspace, but on the internet you literally have know means of verifying if the original poster's response is accurate. Lying about yourself is even a given on the internet, I personally would never use my real address for anything except when buying something.

As for why I was watching the thread, I wanted to de-brick my Crest/Banner of the Stars dvds.
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Tony K.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 9:10 pm Reply with quote
Concerning the post dr. worm linked to, I had deleted a few of that user's posts prior to that one for his poor grammar, vague questions/one-liner statements, and incoherent topics.

I didn't necessarily need his motives answered, but I was more so trying to nudge the user into putting in the extra effort of posting. You know, clean, legible posts that get to the point. I recieved a report denoting the ambiguity and decided to lock it.

When I lock threads, it by no means is a sign of killing the topic. I always tell this to users through PM that you can present just about any subject on the forums, so long as you present it well and it's within the rules.

It just so happens that some users (almost always the new ones) don't get it right on the first or second attempt. 'Cause if at first you don't succeed, you can dust it off and try again (~you can dust it off and try again, try again~).

(Sorry for that Aaliyah reference. And it's a darn shame she passed away so young too).
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Cloe
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 4:25 am Reply with quote
Deltakiral wrote:
Although every so often we get some wise guy (or gal) who thinks it's fun to spam or try to race to a thousand post.....why I couldn't tell ya.

Seriously, I wonder that too. About the thousand post thing. I see people come in and from day one comment on anything and everything, whether it's relevant to the discussion or not, and I can almost hear the sound of a buzzer or something as the posts tally up. It completely disjoints things. Granted, most of these people are cut off before they reach 100, thanks to the blessed efforts of the mods and admins.
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Animefreak6969



Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 587
PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 9:51 pm Reply with quote
Cloe wrote:
Deltakiral wrote:
Although every so often we get some wise guy (or gal) who thinks it's fun to spam or try to race to a thousand post.....why I couldn't tell ya.

Seriously, I wonder that too. About the thousand post thing. I see people come in and from day one comment on anything and everything, whether it's relevant to the discussion or not, and I can almost hear the sound of a buzzer or something as the posts tally up. It completely disjoints things. Granted, most of these people are cut off before they reach 100, thanks to the blessed efforts of the mods and admins.


Well, a lot of people consider me to be one of those "Gotta GET A THOUSAND" posts people, but i assure you, im not, unless i get something special for it or , i dont attempt to get any specific number of posts.........NOW if there was a prize involved, for anyone here that thought i was bad before, they would be PISSED to see me then......however, I myself pray for that day to not come. and a Ranking system might make me want to do that also, but im not sure since i haven't been on a forum that ranks you
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CGord



Joined: 05 Oct 2006
Posts: 163
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 10:50 pm Reply with quote
Well, if I may toss in my 2 cents...

I've been an Admin on a decent-sized forum (current stats: Threads: 204,473, Posts: 2,058,179, Members: 112,356, Active Members: 6,648) for a bit over eight years now. We started with maybe six people in a chatroom in the summer of 1998, & grew it from there. So while I'm a relative n00b here, I'm not to forum culture in general.

I don't want to bag on the Staff for everything I would do differently here, because it's not my board, but I do want to address one thing: posts being deleted (or members being flamed) for the post being too short. I find that to be a completely unnecessary practice on the part of the Mods, & I read the flaming by members as nothing more than snarky elitism.

Chastising a person because their post isn't sufficiently long enough to be deemed a worthwhile response is something I've never seen on any other forum. Sure, moderating is required to keep things running smoothly, but this is a case of useless micro-management.

Sometimes, "+1" expresses everything you want to say perfectly. Sometimes, nothing more is needed, & any more is worthless filler.

Sometimes, you don't really want some people writing long posts. Perhaps one fairly coherent sentence is their limit. I know for me, if you can't spell worth a damn, I don't really want to read much more than one sentence from you, anyway.

Also, from a volunteer Staffer's viewpoint, it's a lot of added work for no benefit. You're not really stopping anything detrimental. Getting rid of spambot threads, now there's a worthwhile task.

In the long run, though, I don't dislike it here enough to leave, so I will jump through the hoops placed before me in order to participate. If it gets under my skin too much, I'll wander off to somewhere else. (Took me long enough to find this place, btw. I've used the Encyclopedia for quite awhile, but never bothered even looking for a forum here until I noticed a mention of it in a Greg Ayres blog.)

In closing, I would've just posted "Deleting short posts SUCKS" but I was afraid it would be deleted. Wink
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